Off-peak contactless/Oyster timing details: trains vs. ticket barriers?

[agk2126]

In the London zonal areas where Oyster/contactless payments are accepted on National Rail services, individual trains are listed as peak or off-peak (e.g. on the NR trip planner), with off-peak starting after 9:30. (Trains departing precisely at 9:30 show peak fares.) However this isn't technically dependent on what train one takes, but instead when one touches in, correct?

I understand this is an edge case, of course, but as I type this I'm literally standing outside the ticket barriers in Clapham Junction, hoping to catch the 9:31 Southern train to Gatwick Airport (Platform 7) which is listed as an off-peak fare (£9.00 instead of £13.30). This will be a challenge. To catch this off-peak train, in practice, I would need to tap my Oyster or contactless card at or before 9:30.

Does anyone know if tapping at 9:30:01 counts as off-peak? Given that trains departing at 9:30 (e.g. the 9:30 Thameslink from London Bridge to Gatwick Airport) are shown as peak, I would assume no, but curious about details. Beyond that, is it correct to list, say, 9:31 or 9:32 trains as off-peak when (a) the fares in question are only available with contactless/Oyster payment, and (b) passengers would need to enter the ticket barriers during peak fare periods to have any hope of catching them?

 

[Bletchleyite]

They are slightly different out of pure practicality, yes. Though I believe there is a bit of leeway (unpublished) so touching in at 0928 is likely to result in an off peak fare.

It works both ways to be fair. In the Oval area if you "lose" by way of contactless simply purchase a paper ticket instead as the fares are the same (aside from capping, but this is only at quite a high value now the errors in it have been fixed).

 

[microrich]

They are slightly different out of pure practicality, yes. Though I believe there is a bit of leeway (unpublished) so touching in at 0928 is likely to result in an off peak fare.

It works both ways to be fair. In the Oval area if you "lose" by way of contactless simply purchase a paper ticket instead as the fares are the same (aside from capping, but this is only at quite a high value now the errors in it have been fixed).

I don't have a reference for it, but fairly certain this has been published as part of a FOI request. I believe the leeway is 2 minutes after and 5 minutes before the off-peak period start and end times. i.e. you can tap in until 0635 and from 0927 to get an off-peak fare (similarly 1605 and 1857 in the evening peak). I believe the official reason is to take into account any time synchronisation issues with systems, so therefore cannot be 100% relied on, but have been using these leeways myself on a fairly regular basis for quite a few years without any issues.

 

[Watershed]

There is a certain amount of leeway at each end of the peak periods to accommodate this. As per this Freedom of Information request, off-peak PAYG fares are charged starting at 09:27.

However, due to minor synchronisation discrepancies, the time that the barriers work to may be different than the time displayed on station clocks etc. so I would wait until at least 09:28 or so to touch in, if possible.

 

[CyrusWuff]

It works both ways to be fair. In the Oval area if you "lose" by way of contactless simply purchase a paper ticket instead as the fares are the same (aside from capping, but this is only at quite a high value now the errors in it have been fixed).

Though the application of restrictions to traditional tickets in the Oval area is such that if any of the trains involved crosses one of the peak thresholds, you need an Anytime ticket. Whereas with contactless it's purely based on the time of the first tap.

For example: If travelling from High Wycombe to Gatwick Airport using contactless, the latest train you can catch from High Wycombe before the PM peak is likely to be the 1552 (or the 1604 if you tap in before 1600.) Using a traditional ticket, that officially becomes 1418 as the 1440 connects with a 1605 departure from London Bridge.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Though the application of restrictions to traditional tickets in the Oval area is such that if any of the trains involved crosses one of the peak thresholds, you need an Anytime ticket. Whereas with contactless it's purely based on the time of the first tap.

Sort of, yes (based on the departure time of each train from the boarding point each time you change, not based on it "crossing one of the peak thresholds"), but nothing stops you splitting tickets and the fares are such that this won't usually significantly affect the cost (sometimes it saves a couple of quid - yes, there are anomalies in the simple Anytime Day Single fares!)

Probably the most useful one for early(ish) birds is the 0630 start of the morning peak on contactless (but not oddly paper tickets) which for people travelling from the likes of Bletchley really isn't that early, particularly as you can tap in a bit early and still be valid on the 0634). It will be interesting to see if that changes at any point.

 

[Watershed]

Sort of, yes (based on the departure time of each train from the boarding point each time you change, not based on it "crossing one of the peak thresholds"), but nothing stops you splitting tickets and the fares are such that this won't usually significantly affect the cost (sometimes it saves a couple of quid - yes, there are anomalies in the simple Anytime Day Single fares!)

Probably the most useful one for early(ish) birds is the 0630 start of the morning peak on contactless (but not oddly paper tickets) which for people travelling from the likes of Bletchley really isn't that early, particularly as you can tap in a bit early and still be valid on the 0634). It will be interesting to see if that changes at any point.

You can tap in at 06:34 and you'd still be charged Off-Peak fares!

 

[JonathanH]

For example: If travelling from High Wycombe to Gatwick Airport using contactless, the latest train you can catch from High Wycombe before the PM peak is likely to be the 1552 (or the 1604 if you tap in before 1600.) Using a traditional ticket, that officially becomes 1418 as the 1440 connects with a 1605 departure from London Bridge.

I think strictly with a paper ticket you can catch the 1552 from High Wycombe with a off-peak paper ticket, but then have to wait until 1900 to leave London Bridge.