TfW class 398 Stadler Citylink tram trains

[AdamWW]

So it's doable, over time, but not sounding particularly cheap!

All the photos I've seen of the class 399s (Sheffield tram trains) show a front with no yellow.

Though I can't really think what the down-side is to just sticking some yellow on the front.

 

[positron]

Yeah if it's a choice of a yellow vinyl sticker or spending lots of money then vinyl is fine. Just intriguing that someones probably messed up a bit somewhere.

 

[MikePJ]

When are these units due to do street running?

Not for quite a while - it'll be when the link between Cardiff Central and Callaghan Square opens, and that's currently at the design stage. There's probably 3+ years to fix the problem.

 

[Chris125]

I saw something somewhere recently that was saying that the issue was that it isn’t currently possible to fit lights that comply with both rail and road regulations. The removal of yellow ends on rail vehicles is only allowed if extra-bright lights are used, but these presumably would dazzle drivers on the road, so until the rail regs can be updated to allow a lighting arrangement that also works on the road, they’re reverted to the older rules for rail vehicles that require a yellow panel.

That can't be right, surely? There's no yellow on the Stadler Tram-Trains in Sheffield and they operate both on-street and on national rail.


Supertram 399201 by Mike McNiven, on Flickr

 

[wickham]

Can anyone kindly supply delivery dates for 398013/019/020/021 and are we still waiting for 398026 or has this arrived.
Thanks.

 

[800001]

Can anyone kindly supply delivery dates for 398013/019/020/021 and are we still waiting for 398026 or has this arrived.
Thanks.

398013 arrived sometime in November 2021.

Can't help with the other units.

 

[mansonlo49]

Can anyone kindly supply delivery dates for 398013/019/020/021 and are we still waiting for 398026 or has this arrived.
Thanks.

398019 went back to old dalby
today from litchurch lane

 

[Pinza68]

398013 arrived sometime in November 2021.

Can't help with the other units.

Saw 398.026 on 24th June at Taffs Wells, and it was around the side, looking like it hadn't been there for long

 

[BillStampy]

Another Class 398 move tomorrow, RailAdventure 43s to go pick it up from Pengam Sidings.
398 move to Pengam:

Realtime Trains | 3Q50 0935 Taffs Well Depot to Pengam Sidings | 13/08/2025

Real-time train running information for 3Q50 0935 departure from Taffs Well Depot to Pengam Sidings on 13/08/2025. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

RailAdventure 43s:

Realtime Trains | 6V37 0732 Kings Norton Ot Plant Dept to Pengam Sidings | 13/08/2025

Real-time train running information for 6V37 0732 departure from Kings Norton Ot Plant Dept to Pengam Sidings on 13/08/2025. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

RailAdventure dragging the 398:

Realtime Trains | 6Q38 1220 Pengam Sidings to Kings Norton Ot Plant Dept | 13/08/2025

Real-time train running information for 6Q38 1220 departure from Pengam Sidings to Kings Norton Ot Plant Dept on 13/08/2025. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

 

[800001]

Another Class 398 move tomorrow, RailAdventure 43s to go pick it up from Pengam Sidings.
398 move to Pengam:

Realtime Trains | 3Q50 0935 Taffs Well Depot to Pengam Sidings | 13/08/2025

Real-time train running information for 3Q50 0935 departure from Taffs Well Depot to Pengam Sidings on 13/08/2025. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

RailAdventure 43s:

Realtime Trains | 6V37 0732 Kings Norton Ot Plant Dept to Pengam Sidings | 13/08/2025

Real-time train running information for 6V37 0732 departure from Kings Norton Ot Plant Dept to Pengam Sidings on 13/08/2025. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

RailAdventure dragging the 398:

Realtime Trains | 6Q38 1220 Pengam Sidings to Kings Norton Ot Plant Dept | 13/08/2025

Real-time train running information for 6Q38 1220 departure from Pengam Sidings to Kings Norton Ot Plant Dept on 13/08/2025. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Then I presume onwards to Old Dalby after Kings Norton?

 

[ExRes]

Then I presume onwards to Old Dalby after Kings Norton?

On Thursdays 1356 6Q39 Kings Norton OTPD to Old Dalby

 

[60159]

On Thursdays 1356 6Q39 Kings Norton OTPD to Old Dalby

Saw it at Cardiff. 015 I think.

 

[BillStampy]

Saw it at Cardiff. 015 I think.

Yes, can confirm it was 015.

 

[berneyarms]

That's five sets on test at Old Dalby now?
398 015 / 019 / 022 / 024 / 025

 

[alm37]

That's five sets on test at Old Dalby now?
398 015 / 019 / 022 / 024 / 025

Think 017 is also at Old Dalby, but that 022 is at Taffs Well. Agree that makes five sets at Old Dalby.

 

[berneyarms]

Think 017 is also at Old Dalby, but that 022 is at Taffs Well. Agree that makes five sets at Old Dalby.

You're right about set 017, I omitted that one but when did set 022 come back from Old Dalby - they both went there in February and I've seen no reports here of it returning.

Clearly with that many sets now back at Old Dalby (up to six sets), there are quite a few issues that need ironing out on the test track before the class can progress towards entering service.

 

[alm37]

You're right about set 017, I omitted that one but when did set 022 come back from Old Dalby - they both went there in February and I've seen no reports here of it returning.

Clearly with that many sets now back at Old Dalby (up to six sets), there are quite a few issues that need ironing out on the test track before the class can progress towards entering service.

Sightings reported elsewhere suggest 022 went to Old Dalby on 26 February and returned on 25 April. Haven’t seen it myself to confirm though.

 

[ExRes]

Sightings reported elsewhere suggest 022 went to Old Dalby on 26 February and returned on 25 April. Haven’t seen it myself to confirm though.

398022 was returned to Pengam on 25th April by 1155 7Q38 from Old Dalby, there are photos of the move on Flickr

 

[800001]

You're right about set 017, I omitted that one but when did set 022 come back from Old Dalby - they both went there in February and I've seen no reports here of it returning.

Clearly with that many sets now back at Old Dalby (up to six sets), there are quite a few issues that need ironing out on the test track before the class can progress towards entering service.

I thought they were there to get mileage accumulation in, not because of issues with the sets?

You would think if they have work that requires doing, the work would be done at the Stadler depot of Taffs Well.

 

[Busmansholiday]

IIRC, the Sheffield ones can operate on either the tram-train (Cathedral to Rotherham) or the Supertram network, they cannot do both. Of the seven, I think four are for tram-train and three for Supertram, I don't know the current allocations. The reason is there are different bogies for the two systems (flange depth I think) so they have to lift them and change the bogies if they want to swap any around (IE accidents).
I don't know, but it's possible there are different light settings that are changed over in the workshop. The only bit of the tram-train that is street running is Commercial St to Cathedral and that's pedestrianised with a couple of road crossings.

 

[berneyarms]

398022 was returned to Pengam on 25th April by 1155 7Q38 from Old Dalby, there are photos of the move on Flickr

Thanks for that clarification.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 15 Aug 2025 ==

I thought they were there to get mileage accumulation in, not because of issues with the sets?

You would think if they have work that requires doing, the work would be done at the Stadler depot of Taffs Well.

Fair enough - I thought that the normal mileage accumulation would be done on the live railway rather than the test track.

I had assumed that they were at Old Dalby to allow for testing post modification work, but I’m happy to be corrected.

 

[800001]

Sightings reported elsewhere suggest 022 went to Old Dalby on 26 February and returned on 25 April. Haven’t seen it myself to confirm though.

I can confirm the following are at Old Dalby

398015/017/019/024/025

 

[Defiance149]

Understand a 398 was delivered to Taff's Well by road w/c 4th Aug, can anyone confirm the ID if so? 398030?

 

[800001]

Does anyone have an up to date list of the 398s that are now here in the uk, including Taffs Well and Old Dalby?

 

[scottie]

398001-26,28 here it says on trams online website updated to the 17th August.

 

[tfw756rider]

398001-26,28 here it says on trams online website updated to the 17th August.

398027 was seen on test in Taffs Well, Abercynon and Aberdare in April 2025 so must also be in the UK (more specifically, Britain).

So, of the 36 398s, at least 28 (398001-028) are in Britain, and at most 8 (398029-036) aren't yet.

 

[800001]

Thanks for both replies. Appreciated.

 

[J663738]

Other than a broken down 398 I saw at Merthyr Tydfil a few months ago, I haven't seen any of these out and about for testing.
There are plenty at Taffs Well depot, but they seem to just sit there.
Why would you spend all that money on rolling stock, pay interest on the capital expenditure and not try and get them into service as quick as possible?

 

[CapitalStar378]

Other than a broken down 398 I saw at Merthyr Tydfil a few months ago, I haven't seen any of these out and about for testing.
There are plenty at Taffs Well depot, but they seem to just sit there.
Why would you spend all that money on rolling stock, pay interest on the capital expenditure and not try and get them into service as quick as possible?

Not quite as bad as the 701s but still does seem like a waste of resources. TfW don't choose to share much with the public so we can only speculate. There are several 398s at Old Dalby for post modification testing I read on here, not sure what those mods were.

 

[Dai Corner]

Not quite as bad as the 701s but still does seem like a waste of resources. TfW don't choose to share much with the public so we can only speculate. There are several 398s at Old Dalby for post modification testing I read on here, not sure what those mods were.

Hopefully TfW aren't paying lease charges if they're not usable in passenger service. I might ask my MS to ask the Transport Minister.