SWR email following getting caught short-faring

[KM08]

Hi everyone,

I have read quite a few of the thread's now and so I think I know what to expect, yet despite this I am extremely anxious about this situation. I completely understand that what I did was completely wrong and I really want to make it right and beg SWR to settle out of court. I am only 23 and a recent law graduate (which I know is ironic and I should know better). I stupidly listened to a friend who told me about saving some money on my tickets, I never did anything like this before but I was an idiot and I had been wanting to save some money following university due to my plan of pursuing further education. I know this is not an excuse at all and I am just as bad as everyone. I have read that SWR are often happy to do an out-of-court settlement and I know that I will need to look into getting a loan to likely cover the cost of this. I have never received any penalty fares or warnings before this.

The situation is, In April, I was approached by a revenue protection officer. I had purchased a ticket from Staines to Ashford however I intended to travel further to Kew Bridge Station. I told the officer that I usually purchase a Staines to Ashford ticket but on this occasion, I was in a rush and forgot to change my stop when purchasing a ticket. The officer looked through my trainline purchase history and then gave me the receipt of notice, informing me that SWR will be in touch with further information. Last week, I had received an email from the fraud investigator who asked me to confirm my personal details and to provide any relevant information. I provided all of my details, including my rail card which was valid at the time of travel and I also provided the same explanation that I provided to the Revenue Officer. I know this was stupid (again a reoccuring pattern) but I panicked in the moment and then realised the severity of the situation if it turns out that I have been untruthful.

Following this correspondence, I received an email yesterday with an excel spreadsheet of all of the suspicious journeys that they assume I had made. They date back from November last year until a day after the incident in April. They also contain one case of a refund. I cannot for the life of me remember why I requested a refund but I know for a fact that I wouldnt have travelled on a refunded ticket as I didnt even know that this was possible until I read this forum. I suffer with severe anxiety and at this point I am just convincing myself that all of my transactions were wrong, even though I know for a fact that those were legitimate journeys. I have until Tuesday to fill out the excel spreadsheet with any relevant evidence for 145. Now, I have already identified at least 18 that I know for certain are legitimate and I know exactly what I did those days. The issue is, is that Im worried they will not believe me and I do not know what evidence I can provide for them to see I am telling the truth. They disputed a few tickets from Staines to London Waterloo for example. Staines is my home station and London Waterloo is the final destination on that line so I am confused as to why this has been flagged. Some other trips that I had made from Staines to Ashford and Ashford to Staines were also legitimate, I often got a lift to my workplace which meant I didnt need to buy a ticket to Kew Bridge Station but I got off at Ashford. Unfortunately, other times, I didn't have a lift arranged and still travlled on the Staines to Ashford ticket

I'm genuinely mortified and terrified that I have ruined my life, if it doesnt result in a criminal convicition I anticipate being in thousands of pounds of debt over belieiving someone stupid who has gotten away with it every single time. It is a lesson learnt especially now that I know the severity of the situation and it's consequences.

The question I really have is, how do I prove to them that some of the marked journey's were legitimate? Other than me purchasing the ticket, I hae pictures from those days showing where I was and maybe some statements showing me purchasing things in the area. I am more than willing to pay an out of court settlement for my illegitimate journey's but I know that this isn't up to me. I know that I am stupid and have been scolding myself over this to the point it's affecting my health (not in a pity seeking way but I would appreciate if we can keep the advice factual rather than targeted at my stupidity and uselessness since I have been struggling but I did this to myself and deserve a punishment). How do I approach this now that I basically lied in my first email response to the investigator.. where do I go from here in terms of the spreadsheet as I do not want to be fined for journey's that were lawful.

Thank you in advance for everyone's help and advice. I really appreciate it.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

Hi everyone,

I have read quite a few of the thread's now and so I think I know what to expect, yet despite this I am extremely anxious about this situation. I completely understand that what I did was completely wrong and I really want to make it right and beg SWR to settle out of court. I am only 23 and a recent law graduate (which I know is ironic and I should know better). I stupidly listened to a friend who told me about saving some money on my tickets, I never did anything like this before but I was an idiot and I had been wanting to save some money following university due to my plan of pursuing further education. I know this is not an excuse at all and I am just as bad as everyone. I have read that SWR are often happy to do an out-of-court settlement and I know that I will need to look into getting a loan to likely cover the cost of this. I have never received any penalty fares or warnings before this.

The situation is, In April, I was approached by a revenue protection officer. I had purchased a ticket from Staines to Ashford however I intended to travel further to Kew Bridge Station. I told the officer that I usually purchase a Staines to Ashford ticket but on this occasion, I was in a rush and forgot to change my stop when purchasing a ticket. The officer looked through my trainline purchase history and then gave me the receipt of notice, informing me that SWR will be in touch with further information. Last week, I had received an email from the fraud investigator who asked me to confirm my personal details and to provide any relevant information. I provided all of my details, including my rail card which was valid at the time of travel and I also provided the same explanation that I provided to the Revenue Officer. I know this was stupid (again a reoccuring pattern) but I panicked in the moment and then realised the severity of the situation if it turns out that I have been untruthful.

Following this correspondence, I received an email yesterday with an excel spreadsheet of all of the suspicious journeys that they assume I had made. They date back from November last year until a day after the incident in April. They also contain one case of a refund. I cannot for the life of me remember why I requested a refund but I know for a fact that I wouldnt have travelled on a refunded ticket as I didnt even know that this was possible until I read this forum. I suffer with severe anxiety and at this point I am just convincing myself that all of my transactions were wrong, even though I know for a fact that those were legitimate journeys. I have until Tuesday to fill out the excel spreadsheet with any relevant evidence for 145. Now, I have already identified at least 18 that I know for certain are legitimate and I know exactly what I did those days. The issue is, is that Im worried they will not believe me and I do not know what evidence I can provide for them to see I am telling the truth. They disputed a few tickets from Staines to London Waterloo for example. Staines is my home station and London Waterloo is the final destination on that line so I am confused as to why this has been flagged. Some other trips that I had made from Staines to Ashford and Ashford to Staines were also legitimate, I often got a lift to my workplace which meant I didnt need to buy a ticket to Kew Bridge Station but I got off at Ashford. Unfortunately, other times, I didn't have a lift arranged and still travlled on the Staines to Ashford ticket

I'm genuinely mortified and terrified that I have ruined my life, if it doesnt result in a criminal convicition I anticipate being in thousands of pounds of debt over belieiving someone stupid who has gotten away with it every single time. It is a lesson learnt especially now that I know the severity of the situation and it's consequences.

The question I really have is, how do I prove to them that some of the marked journey's were legitimate? Other than me purchasing the ticket, I hae pictures from those days showing where I was and maybe some statements showing me purchasing things in the area. I am more than willing to pay an out of court settlement for my illegitimate journey's but I know that this isn't up to me. I know that I am stupid and have been scolding myself over this to the point it's affecting my health (not in a pity seeking way but I would appreciate if we can keep the advice factual rather than targeted at my stupidity and uselessness since I have been struggling but I did this to myself and deserve a punishment). How do I approach this now that I basically lied in my first email response to the investigator.. where do I go from here in terms of the spreadsheet as I do not want to be fined for journey's that were lawful.

Thank you in advance for everyone's help and advice. I really appreciate it.

Welcome to the forum.

There's an old phrase about 'never be your own client' - and that may be relevant here. As a law graduate, you have probably received pointers about what you would do if you were to become a solicitor or barrister, and try to think about those:
- strictly, it's not for you to prove that you weren't doing what the accusation says, but it's for the railway to prove that you were doing it.
- but everyone is allowed to use common sense. So if you swear that you weren't doing something but it was someone who looked just liked you, had the same accent and wore the same shoes and just happened to be in the same area* then you may find that this attempt to deny guilt isn't accepted.
- so start by looking which journeys you can show were legitimate. From what you say, you have some of these
- now think about which journeys you think were legitimate. Why do you think they were OK? What would the railway think if you told them this?
- and now go on to the journeys that you know were dodgy. There's no point trying to defend the indefensible.
- what does this leave? If anything, are they journeys that reflect the patterns of the ones that are legitimate, or are they more like the ones that are dodgy? That will give you some idea of what you should be saying to the railway.

It's also worth remembering that you don't necessarily have to produce your evidence right now. So if your proof of a journey is that 'I was going to see my auntie/boyfriend/priest/accountant/whatever and they can confirm I was there' you don't need a signed letter from them right now - but you do need to be reasonably certain that they would be prepared to stand up in court to say that you were telling the truth.

*https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cn72x5p8801o

 

[soil]

This is presumably an attempt to get an out-of-court settlement?

They can choose to prosecute you for the offence which they can prove.

It seems unlikely that if you explain your Staines - Waterloo tickets that they would dispute these further.

However the Staines - Ashford tickets are obviously highly suspicious given that you live in Staines & work in Kew Bridge and were caught making the most obvious and childishly simple of short fare scams using the Staines - Ashford on one occasion, any reasonable person would assume that you did so on other occasions as well.

Ultimately they would not be able to prove those evasions in court, but can convict you on the single count.

So you could:

1. dispute and provide some sort of evidence, e.g., your friend's contact details who drove you to work
2. state that you can't recall and offer to pay for the fares to settle the matter - seems that this would not be particularly expensive? How many fares are involved?

Also it's obviously vanishingly unlikely that you were caught the one time you tried this, so admitting one and denying 29 is unlikely to convince, but admitting 20 and denying 9 seems more credible.

 

[WesternLancer]

I see you have been given some good advice above already.

I'll make a more general point

You mentioned having studied law so I'm assuming if you get the chance you will be keen to a take up a legal job / career. Over the course of that career you would be likely to earn many £1ks of salary (possibly £100k's over a working life) - but getting prosecuted for this will put that at risk - so achieving an out of court settlement must be your highest priority.

It sounds like you have done well so far and persuaded them to potentially offer a settlement and now they are looking for the money they believe you owe them. From what we see on here they will play fair with you if you play fair with them and some good advice above over how to make your case. But you do have to realise that the problem with fare dodging is that it casts your other behaviour in a bad light (which in much broader terms is why it could be career limiting to engage in petty misdemeanors but then not realise the impact on what someone might think when interviewing you for a job in a legal firm if they think that you are happy to take foolish advice from someone you know about committing petty fare evasion.....)

So with that in mind (and I know this is difficult when money is tight and you are a recent graduate) - you might need to accept that you have to pay for some tickets that weren't actually wrong but you can prove that they were legit tickets, as in the bigger picture it's much more important to achieve the out of court settlement when looking at things longer term money wise. To some extent this is part of the price you might have to pay to avoid going to court

Weigh this up when following @Fawkes Cat 's excellent advice on how to approach this above in post #2

Good luck with this - people will help advise you on things like wording you could use on the spreadsheet (for example if you can not provide evidence of a legit ticket you could say something to them on the XL sheet that is honest like 'I believe I had the correct ticket for this journey from Y station to x station but I am unable to provide further supporting evidence for this entry' - but then just have to live with it if they believe you or not )

 

[KM08]

Welcome to the forum.

There's an old phrase about 'never be your own client' - and that may be relevant here. As a law graduate, you have probably received pointers about what you would do if you were to become a solicitor or barrister, and try to think about those:
- strictly, it's not for you to prove that you weren't doing what the accusation says, but it's for the railway to prove that you were doing it.
- but everyone is allowed to use common sense. So if you swear that you weren't doing something but it was someone who looked just liked you, had the same accent and wore the same shoes and just happened to be in the same area* then you may find that this attempt to deny guilt isn't accepted.
- so start by looking which journeys you can show were legitimate. From what you say, you have some of these
- now think about which journeys you think were legitimate. Why do you think they were OK? What would the railway think if you told them this?
- and now go on to the journeys that you know were dodgy. There's no point trying to defend the indefensible.
- what does this leave? If anything, are they journeys that reflect the patterns of the ones that are legitimate, or are they more like the ones that are dodgy? That will give you some idea of what you should be saying to the railway.

It's also worth remembering that you don't necessarily have to produce your evidence right now. So if your proof of a journey is that 'I was going to see my auntie/boyfriend/priest/accountant/whatever and they can confirm I was there' you don't need a signed letter from them right now - but you do need to be reasonably certain that they would be prepared to stand up in court to say that you were telling the truth.

*https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cn72x5p8801o

This is presumably an attempt to get an out-of-court settlement?

They can choose to prosecute you for the offence which they can prove.

It seems unlikely that if you explain your Staines - Waterloo tickets that they would dispute these further.

However the Staines - Ashford tickets are obviously highly suspicious given that you live in Staines & work in Kew Bridge and were caught making the most obvious and childishly simple of short fare scams using the Staines - Ashford on one occasion, any reasonable person would assume that you did so on other occasions as well.

Ultimately they would not be able to prove those evasions in court, but can convict you on the single count.

So you could:

1. dispute and provide some sort of evidence, e.g., your friend's contact details who drove you to work
2. state that you can't recall and offer to pay for the fares to settle the matter - seems that this would not be particularly expensive? How many fares are involved?

Also it's obviously vanishingly unlikely that you were caught the one time you tried this, so admitting one and denying 29 is unlikely to convince, but admitting 20 and denying 9 seems more credible.

Thank you both for your responses, I really appreciate it.

Do you happen to know how often they ask for evidence such as signed witness statements, I can arrange to get them for some of my travels outside of Staines-Ashford but for the days were I would have gotten a lift to work, it will be quite difficult as I was not very close to this person and I feel as though the prospect of getting involved in something potentially legal will put them off. As you said @soil , if I did it once then any reasonable person would assume I did it all the other times as well, even if that isn't the case. This makes me feel like it will just be easier for me to admit to all the fares labelled Staines to Ashford, which there is around 130 of. As I said, not all of them were illegitimate but Im worried that if I can't provide a witness statement to back me up in those circumstances, It may not end well. A lot of them dating back from November onwards were legitimate and as you said @Fawkes Cat it is on them to prove that I did the things they accuse me of. Yet at the same time, my aim is to not get a criminal record for the purpose of my career and want to be seen as complying. Especially since, I do not remember which exact dates I got a lift.

I think I will just need to suck it up with all the Staines to Ashford fares but will dispute a few of the others only because I have genuine evidence that those were not unlawful. Im hoping that considering I can get signed witness statements for thos journeys, they will be okay with letting those go.

 

[KM08]

I see you have been given some good advice above already.

I'll make a more general point

You mentioned having studied law so I'm assuming if you get the chance you will be keen to a take up a legal job / career. Over the course of that career you would be likely to earn many £1ks of salary (possibly £100k's over a working life) - but getting prosecuted for this will put that at risk - so achieving an out of court settlement must be your highest priority.

It sounds like you have done well so far and persuaded them to potentially offer a settlement and now they are looking for the money they believe you owe them. From what we see on here they will play fair with you if you play fair with them and some good advice above over how to make your case. But you do have to realise that the problem with fare dodging is that it casts your other behaviour in a bad light (which in much broader terms is why it could be career limiting to engage in petty misdemeanors but then not realise the impact on what someone might think when interviewing you for a job in a legal firm if they think that you are happy to take foolish advice from someone you know about committing petty fare evasion.....)

So with that in mind (and I know this is difficult when money is tight and you are a recent graduate) - you might need to accept that you have to pay for some tickets that weren't actually wrong but you can prove that they were legit tickets, as in the bigger picture it's much more important to achieve the out of court settlement when looking at things longer term money wise. To some extent this is part of the price you might have to pay to avoid going to court

Weigh this up when following @Fawkes Cat 's excellent advice on how to approach this above in post #2

Good luck with this - people will help advise you on things like wording you could use on the spreadsheet (for example if you can not provide evidence of a legit ticket you could say something to them on the XL sheet that is honest like 'I believe I had the correct ticket for this journey from Y station to x station but I am unable to provide further supporting evidence for this entry' - but then just have to live with it if they believe you or not )

Thank you so much for your response.

I'm not sure if I necessarily persuaded them yet, they said in the email 'However, if you respond with a truthful account, there may be an opportunity for an out-of-court settlement. ' I am hoping that in my case they will agree to an out-of-court-settlement. As you touched upon, my biggest worry is protecting my career first.

On the spreadsheet, it doesnt ask me for additional comments, just simply asks me to confirm my actual departing and finishing station. Is it common for people to just add additional information? If so, do I detail exactly what I did that day or generally say, I believe I held a valid ticket for this train and travelled from my said destinations.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 20 Aug 2025 ==

As mentioned previously, if I dispute some of the journeys using all the evidence that i have because I know I can get witness statements but suck up the ones that were actually legitimate from Staines - Ashford, it will result in 130 fares that I need to pay for. I did hold a valid railcard at the time but I am assuming that they will charge me for an anytime day single ticket twice (please correct me if i am wrong).

 

[WesternLancer]

Thank you so much for your response.

I'm not sure if I necessarily persuaded them yet, they said in the email 'However, if you respond with a truthful account, there may be an opportunity for an out-of-court settlement. ' I am hoping that in my case they will agree to an out-of-court-settlement.

Its going in the right direction

As you touched upon, my biggest worry is protecting my career first.

On the spreadsheet, it doesnt ask me for additional comments, just simply asks me to confirm my actual departing and finishing station. Is it common for people to just add additional information?

I'm not sure - maybe start by just stating the truthful info ref the journey stations as requested

If so, do I detail exactly what I did that day or generally say, I believe I held a valid ticket for this train and travelled from my said destinations.

So are they actually asking for any supporting evidence? (maybe you should post up a redacted copy of their text - not the spreadsheet though) if you want people to see that.

If they are not asking for evidence you can maybe wait until they do - or you could refer to the matter in your reply - eg 'I have checked my records and completed the spreadsheet to the best of my ability. I have referred to evidence I have of my own travel including things in my diary for example, but I am not able to do that in every case so this relies on my memory in some instances' or some such wording

See what others here think

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 20 Aug 2025 ==

As mentioned previously, if I dispute some of the journeys using all the evidence that i have because I know I can get witness statements but suck up the ones that were actually legitimate from Staines - Ashford, it will result in 130 fares that I need to pay for. I did hold a valid railcard at the time but I am assuming that they will charge me for an anytime day single ticket twice (please correct me if i am wrong).

I think you are right - they are not going to give you a railcard discount for a fare for a journey where you dodged the ticket and they are now charging you for it. Work on the basis if Anytime Single prices. If they then charge less well that's good news, but it's unlikely.

 

[KM08]

For reference this was the first email I received:

Good morning,

We are currently investigating your case,involving your travel from Ashford to Kew Bridge Railway Stations when you presented a ticket valid from Ashford to Staines Railway Stations which was not valid for your journey and you were reported for prosecution.

All the evidence available is beingconsidered. If you consider that there are any explanations or mitigating factors thatmay influence our investigation, you areinvited to provide a response to this emailwithin 7 days of its date, by no later than the 22nd of August 2025.

Please ensure that ALL details beloware completed and returned to ensureour records are correct.

THIS IS NOT A REQUEST FORPAYMENT

First Name(s)
Surname
Date of Birth
Contactnumber(s)
Email
Address
Postcode

Following my response I received this:

Good afternoon,

Thank you for your emails of the __ and for providing confirmation of your personal details, along with your explanation regarding your ticket and railcard use on the ____. I also acknowledge receipt of your evidence confirming you held a valid Railcard at the time of travel.


We are currently investigating your journey from Staines to Kew Bridge Railway Station on the ______. On this occasion, you were spoken to by South Western Railway Revenue Protection staff on a South Western Railway train service travelling between Staines and London Waterloo. You presented a ticket purchased for travel between Staines and Ashford (Surrey). You later admitted to actually travelling from Staines to Kew Bridge Railway Station. As a result, the ticket you held was not valid for your journey and you were reported for prosecution.


This investigation is being conducted under the requirements set out in the National Rail Conditions of Travel 2024 and the Railway Byelaws 2005. For clarity, I draw your attention to the following provisions:


• National Rail Conditions of Travel 2024, Condition 6: Passengers must hold a valid ticket before boarding and it must be valid for the journey they are making.

• Condition 14: Tickets that have been refunded cease to be valid for travel and cannot lawfully be used on a train service.

• Railway Byelaw 18(1) (2005): No person shall travel on the railway without a valid ticket entitling travel.


It is ultimately the responsibility of the passenger to ensure they are in possession of a ticket valid for the whole of their journey and, where a discount has been applied, to also hold a valid and in-date Railcard at the time of travel.


As part of this investigation, your online ticket purchase history has been reviewed under a Data Sharing Agreement, covering the period from the 12th of December 2020 onwards. This analysis has identified tickets suspected of not being valid for the full journey, and in some cases, tickets that were purchased and later refunded where it is suspected that travel nonetheless took place.

I have attached a document (Exhibit RJM-1) setting out your online ticket purchase history. The journeys under investigation are highlighted and numbered 1 to 185 in the first column. You are invited to provide an accurate account for each highlighted entry by completing the form. Please complete columns R, S, for each highlighted line and column marked ?.

• Column R: The correct start and finish stations travelled.

• Column S: Whether you travelled on a refunded ticket (Yes/No).

This information is important to establish the full circumstances. Please note that your response may be used in legal proceedings if this matter progresses to court. However, if you respond with a truthful account, there may be an opportunity for an out-of-court settlement. It is essential to note that we do have additional evidence, including ticket tap data, refund data, and may apply for CCTV data, which may be presented if your case proceeds to court.


I followed this email up asking for clarification as the spreadsheet seemed to be wrong/slightly confusing so I politely emailed to clarify and received this response:


I have updated the spreadsheet (attached) and can confirm that this enquiry now only relates to the highlighted journeys numbered 1 to 146 in Column A, and specifically to the cells in Columns R and S marked with a question mark (?). These entries are where I require your confirmation as to the correct stations that you started and finished your journeys, please use the format example:- Staines to Kew Bridge, which you admitted to on the _____.


If you did hold a valid railcard for any of these journeys, please provide supporting evidence (such as a screenshot of your digital railcard or a photograph of the physical card showing the start and expiry dates) in your email reply. If no railcard was held, please make this clear in your response.


Thank you for your cooperation, and I look forward to receiving your completed Exhibit RJM-1 within the requested timeframe.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

I followed this email up asking for clarification as the spreadsheet seemed to be wrong/slightly confusing so I politely emailed to clarify and received this response:


I have updated the spreadsheet (attached) and can confirm that this enquiry now only relates to the highlighted journeys numbered 1 to 146 in Column A, and specifically to the cells in Columns R and S marked with a question mark (?). These entries are where I require your confirmation as to the correct stations that you started and finished your journeys,

This doesn't mean that the railway are certain you fare dodged on all these trips - it means that they think you might have done. So if in your own mind you're certain that you really were just going to Ashford or wherever for a given journey, mark those as definitely being Staines to Ashford trips.

It might help if you try to think whether you did anything different on days when you got a lift on to Kew Bridge. As an example, did you always get a lift on Tuesdays but never on a Monday? Or did you set off later when you got a lift? Things like that might show up a pattern to which trips are legitimate and which aren't.

And although we try to believe people who seek our help, you need to bear in mind that the railway may be less sympathetic. In line with that, saying that you only went one stop by train and then got a lift the rest of the way is a story that the railway have heard many times before - and all too often, it turns out to be untrue: put baldly, if someone could give you a lift from Ashford station (not too far off the A30), why couldn't they give you a lift from Staines station (less than a couple of miles away and also not too far off the A30)? As I said in my first comment, if your story isn't obviously believable you may have to work harder to get it believed.

 

[KM08]

This doesn't mean that the railway are certain you fare dodged on all these trips - it means that they think you might have done. So if in your own mind you're certain that you really were just going to Ashford or wherever for a given journey, mark those as definitely being Staines to Ashford trips.

It might help if you try to think whether you did anything different on days when you got a lift on to Kew Bridge. As an example, did you always get a lift on Tuesdays but never on a Monday? Or did you set off later when you got a lift? Things like that might show up a pattern to which trips are legitimate and which aren't.

And although we try to believe people who seek our help, you need to bear in mind that the railway may be less sympathetic. In line with that, saying that you only went one stop by train and then got a lift the rest of the way is a story that the railway have heard many times before - and all too often, it turns out to be untrue: put baldly, if someone could give you a lift from Ashford station (not too far off the A30), why couldn't they give you a lift from Staines station (less than a couple of miles away and also not too far off the A30)? As I said in my first comment, if your story isn't obviously believable you may have to work harder to get it believed.

I completely understand. Even though the two towns are close together, the person would have to go out of their way to pick me up from Staines as I believe they lived closer to Ashford station or they had a partner there (I never really questioned this I was just accepting the kind offer). I can see that it would be difficult for me to prove that this was the case and the fact that the stations are so close together works against me rather than for me. I think I just need to accept that there is no point me disputing the Staines to Ashford travels. I always got the same train ticket which departed at the same time each day so the pattern was the same regardless of the lift or no lift.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 20 Aug 2025 ==

Would anyone suggest writing a letter of apology alongside my evidence and spreadsheet esentially begging them for an out of court settlement. If yes, does anyone have any suggestions of how to go about this?

 

[WesternLancer]

Would anyone suggest writing a letter of apology alongside my evidence and spreadsheet esentially begging them for an out of court settlement. If yes, does anyone have any suggestions of how to go about this?

Forgive me, but have you not already asked for an out of court settlement before this stage?

If not you should certainly be writing something that follows the usual format (lots of examples on other threads)

- apology for what has happened
- understand the gravity of what you did, will always ensure you have the correct ticket going forwards
- anxious to settle the matter with the need for court action
- happy to so-operate with their enqiuiries
- make a clear offer to pay any fares owed and their cost in investigating matters

 

[soil]

I completely understand. Even though the two towns are close together, the person would have to go out of their way to pick me up from Staines as I believe they lived closer to Ashford station or they had a partner there (I never really questioned this I was just accepting the kind offer).

So 146 tickets Staines - Ashford?

Are these singles or returns?

And between what dates? This is presumably £800-£1000 in total depending on dates.

This does seem rather implausible that you would have taken lifts on dozens of occasions and not know exactly where the kind lift-giver lives.

Also it does rather depend on the time of day and where you work in relation to Kew Bridge station, but the train might be faster and more reliable, so I'd not necessarily expect you to be catching trains at the same time if getting a lift as going by train all the way.

 

[KM08]

Forgive me, but have you not already asked for an out of court settlement before this stage?

If not you should certainly be writing something that follows the usual format (lots of examples on other threads)

- apology for what has happened
- understand the gravity of what you did, will always ensure you have the correct ticket going forwards
- anxious to settle the matter with the need for court action
- happy to so-operate with their enqiuiries
- make a clear offer to pay any fares owed and their cost in investigating matters

No I hadn't directly written and asked them for this, I just replied to their first email with my details and the same response that I gave to the revenue officer which wasn't truthful and so now I need to write a letter detailing the above points and admiting to the fact that I panicked and lied both times which obviously doesnt really help me. I will send across the letter with the spreadsheet, or maybe even before.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 20 Aug 2025 ==

So 146 tickets Staines - Ashford?

Are these singles or returns?

And between what dates? This is presumably £800-£1000 in total depending on dates.

This does seem rather implausible that you would have taken lifts on dozens of occasions and not know exactly where the kind lift-giver lives.

Also it does rather depend on the time of day and where you work in relation to Kew Bridge station, but the train might be faster and more reliable, so I'd not necessarily expect you to be catching trains at the same time if getting a lift as going by train all the way.

It's more so 130 as 18 of the journeys i can definitely account for. I calculated the cost of all of those tickets plus admin fees to total just over £1000.

 

[soil]

No I hadn't directly written and asked them for this, I just replied to their first email with my details and the same response that I gave to the revenue officer which wasn't truthful and so now I need to write a letter detailing the above points and admiting to the fact that I panicked and lied both times which obviously doesnt really help me. I will send across the letter with the spreadsheet, or maybe even before.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 20 Aug 2025 ==


It's more so 130 as 18 of the journeys i can definitely account for. I calculated the cost of all of those tickets plus admin fees to total just over £1000.

Offering to pay for 130 of 146 seems like something they might accept/reasonable.

Note that fares increase in either March or January, so be sure to use the correct fare at the time, not the current fare.

 

[KM08]

Could I kindly receive some feedback on the letter/email below that I am planning on sending alongside my spreadsheet- thank you in advance.

Dear X,

I am writing regarding the journeys highlighted in Exhibit __ and to provide my full and honest account, along with my sincere and unreserved apologies.


When I was first asked about my reason for not having a valid ticket, I panicked and gave an incomplete explanation, saying only that I was rushing for the train. In reality, this was not the full truth. Because of my anxiety, I reacted out of fear and was not fully honest. I deeply regret this and I am profoundly sorry for not being transparent from the very beginning.

Having now carefully reviewed the spreadsheet, I accept full responsibility for the fact that on many of these journeys I did not hold a valid ticket. I am extremely remorseful and ashamed of my behaviour. I fully recognise the seriousness of my actions and the consequences they have, and I am incredibly sorry for this unexcusable conduct. I can assure you with absolute certainty that I will never repeat such behaviour, ever again.

There are, however, 18 specific instances where I did hold a valid ticket, which I have highlighted in green in the spreadsheet. In those cases, I can accurately attest to the details of the journeys, including the stations travelled and who I was with on those days. I am of course happy to provide any evidence that I can to support these instances.

As for the refunded ticket, to the best of my knowledge it was not used to travel. This ticket was an accidental purchase which I had refunded because I already held a valid return ticket for that day. I have come to this conclusion based on my transactions where I can see that on Monday 9th of July 2024, I had purchased a return ticket for that exact journey, but for a train scheduled at 7:21am rather than 7:33am (evidence of which I have attached). I used the ticket that I purchased for the earlier train and refunded the one that I no longer required. As this happened over a year ago, my recollection is not very good but I am exercising my judgement based on the evidence.


I am keen to resolve this matter without the need for court proceedings and would like to kindly ask you to consider an out-of-court settlement. I am fully prepared to cooperate with your investigation and, if granted the opportunity for such a settlement, I am ready to pay any unpaid fares together with your administrative fees.


I am truly sorry for my actions, for not being fully honest from the start, and for the inconvenience caused. I hope that my remorse and willingness to make amends are clear, and I respectfully ask for the chance to resolve this matter without the need for court involvement.


Thank you very much for your time and consideration.

 

[WesternLancer]

Could I kindly receive some feedback on the letter/email below that I am planning on sending alongside my spreadsheet- thank you in advance.

Dear X,

I am writing regarding the journeys highlighted in Exhibit __ and to provide my full and honest account, along with my sincere and unreserved apologies.


When I was first asked about my reason for not having a valid ticket, I panicked and gave an incomplete explanation, saying only that I was rushing for the train. In reality, this was not the full truth. Because of my anxiety, I reacted out of fear and was not fully honest. I deeply regret this and I am profoundly sorry for not being transparent from the very beginning.

Having now carefully reviewed the spreadsheet, I accept full responsibility for the fact that on many of these journeys I did not hold a valid ticket. I am extremely remorseful and ashamed of my behaviour. I fully recognise the seriousness of my actions and the consequences they have, and I am incredibly sorry for this unexcusable conduct. I can assure you with absolute certainty that I will never repeat such behaviour, ever again.

There are, however, 18 specific instances where I did hold a valid ticket, which I have highlighted in green in the spreadsheet. In those cases, I can accurately attest to the details of the journeys, including the stations travelled and who I was with on those days. I am of course happy to provide any evidence that I can to support these instances.

As for the refunded ticket, to the best of my knowledge it was not used to travel. This ticket was an accidental purchase which I had refunded because I already held a valid return ticket for that day. I have come to this conclusion based on my transactions where I can see that on Monday 9th of July 2024, I had purchased a return ticket for that exact journey, but for a train scheduled at 7:21am rather than 7:33am (evidence of which I have attached). I used the ticket that I purchased for the earlier train and refunded the one that I no longer required. As this happened over a year ago, my recollection is not very good but I am exercising my judgement based on the evidence.


I am keen to resolve this matter without the need for court proceedings and would like to kindly ask you to consider an out-of-court settlement. I am fully prepared to cooperate with your investigation and, if granted the opportunity for such a settlement, I am ready to pay any unpaid fares together with your administrative fees.


I am truly sorry for my actions, for not being fully honest from the start, and for the inconvenience caused. I hope that my remorse and willingness to make amends are clear, and I respectfully ask for the chance to resolve this matter without the need for court involvement.


Thank you very much for your time and consideration.

It’s a bit long but not sure what would be best to edit out. However it does come across as honest and genuine and that’s important.

If you have time before you send it wait to see what others think

 

[KM08]

It’s a bit long but not sure what would be best to edit out. However it does come across as honest and genuine and that’s important.

If you have time before you send it wait to see what others think

Thank you.

If anyone else can give me some feedback too I would appreciate it. Hoping to send it this evening or tomorrow.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 21 Aug 2025 ==

I have gone ahead and sent my response. Could anyone tell me what I can expect next? If I have admitted to the journeys listed and apologetically asked them for an out of court settlement, what would they do next? Should I expect further investigation or do they tend to reply with an offer? If so, how long wil it take for them to get back to me?

 

[WesternLancer]

Thank you.

If anyone else can give me some feedback too I would appreciate it. Hoping to send it this evening or tomorrow.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 21 Aug 2025 ==

I have gone ahead and sent my response. Could anyone tell me what I can expect next? If I have admitted to the journeys listed and apologetically asked them for an out of court settlement, what would they do next? Should I expect further investigation or do they tend to reply with an offer? If so, how long wil it take for them to get back to me?

Hard to know how long but they may get back to you before too long but could be weeks potentially not days.

They might next send a request for a sum as a settlement offer. These are often not broken down so not easy to understand how they arrived at total in order to check it but people do ask for breakdowns if it seems disproportionate. Mistakes are not unknown.

 

[pips]

hey, I'm in a similar situation and after sending them my Excel spreadsheet I received an email saying they completed their investigation and were passing the info on to their prosecutions team, who would inform me of their decision regarding my case - it was about a week or so after my email reply, and now I'm not sure how long it will be until I receive notice of Prosecution's decision but thought this could be helpful info re: timelines

 

[WesternLancer]

hey, I'm in a similar situation and after sending them my Excel spreadsheet I received an email saying they completed their investigation and were passing the info on to their prosecutions team, who would inform me of their decision regarding my case - it was about a week or so after my email reply, and now I'm not sure how long it will be until I receive notice of Prosecution's decision but thought this could be helpful info re: timelines

Thanks for sharing this direct experience - I think it would be helpful for @KM08 to see

 

[KM08]

hey, I'm in a similar situation and after sending them my Excel spreadsheet I received an email saying they completed their investigation and were passing the info on to their prosecutions team, who would inform me of their decision regarding my case - it was about a week or so after my email reply, and now I'm not sure how long it will be until I receive notice of Prosecution's decision but thought this could be helpful info re: timelines

Hey! That is super helpful thank you very much. I sent my email to them over a week ago but still not received a response… Im honestly so anxious but hoping that it will all work out in the end

 

[EJ13]

Hey! That is super helpful thank you very much. I sent my email to them over a week ago but still not received a response… Im honestly so anxious but hoping that it will all work out in the end

Hi! Did this get settled in the end? How long did it take!

 

[jfollows]

Hi! Did this get settled in the end? How long did it take!

KM08 has not visited the forum since August 31.
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