What is this penalty and can I appeal it?

[Chrius56000]

. . .Complain to G.A.'s Customer Services about it, and if they insist it's not their business, insist on it being escalated to someone who does know about that £63.80 – they've taken just shy of five times the Anytime Single Fare from you for some purpose and haven't been transparent to you in saying what it was for!

 

[usualrailguy]

I do have access to a fax machine, and AS have provided a fax number - presumably that may work as it should get to them on time?

 

[enyoueffsea]

I do have access to a fax machine, and AS have provided a fax number - presumably that may work as it should get to them on time?

That is correct.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 9 Aug 2025 ==

. . .Complain to G.A.'s Customer Services about it, and if they insist it's not their business, insist on it being escalated to someone who does know about that £63.80 – they've taken over five times the Anytime Single Fare from you for some purpose and haven't been transparent to you in saying what it was for!

As has already been said by AlterEgo, the likelihood of GA accepting that a notice for the PFN was not issued is slim to none. Complaining to the customer service team about a PFN (which should be appealed through the appropriate process) is unlikely to yield anything.

 

[signed]

I do have access to a fax machine, and AS have provided a fax number - presumably that may work as it should get to them on time?

Yes, that would likely be your best bet

 

[Starmill]

It's for the appeal to be made on whichever grounds the OP felt the notice was unfairly issued in the first place; they don't state their grounds for appeal in their post. I don't think a panel will accept "I wasn't given a notice", because we all know they will not play detective in looking at CCTV or seeing if the RPI has complaints about them not issuing notices before. That will waste the OP's time; I am certain that's a dead end no matter how frustrating we will all find it.

Well the appeal panel isn't going to accept an appeal unless they know what the appeal is against are they.

 

[soil]

It seems very dodgy to be pushing people to pay PF on the spot.

Although it's some sort of chore to pay it at a later date, so they can claim they are doing you a favour by this, the fact that PF is an extrajudicial penalty , and you've got 21 days to pay/appeal means that this wouldn't be reasonable behaviour given the legitimate interest in the passenger being able to check that everything is correct before paying.

 

[DeverseSam]

I’m not sure how they knew that payment had been taken but the journey history will show this (or not).

Interestingly, we’re told the initial card payment for the Penalty Fare was declined. Was this the same card they touched out with? If so, it could be that the card was blacklisted.

I have seen many tiktoks which show tfl don’t take payment until 3am, so it’s impossible to know payment was taken at the time.

I agree it’s likely that it was blacklisted and an error code like 74 was displayed, https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/barrier-codes.174338/#post-3758379. There doesn’t seem to be any other explanation for the RPI being sure that the fare hadn’t been paid

 

[soil]

The law presumes a letter posted first class arrives two days after posting, so post the letter over the counter at a post office and get a receipt.

You could also send it Special Delivery Guaranteed which carries an extra cost.

The rule is "before the end of the period of 21 days beginning with the day after the day on which the penalty fare is charged", which means that from Tuesday 22nd July it must be received by the end of Tuesday 12 August.

In terms of first class post, it's not two days, but the second business day after posting. Thus Monday posting would be deemed to arrive on Wednesday, which is too late, but posting on Sunday would be deemed Tuesday, and on time.

 

[SCDR_WMR]

It seems very dodgy to be pushing people to pay PF on the spot.

I highly doubt there was any pressure applied by the RPI to deal with it there and then. I've seen RPIs from many TOCs issue PFs and the standard line seems to be " this is the amount, reduced to this if paid within X days, or you can pay it now if you wish. Paying now does not prevent you from appealing the penalty fare" or similar wording.

 

[usualrailguy]

I highly doubt there was any pressure applied by the RPI to deal with it there and then. I've seen RPIs from many TOCs issue PFs and the standard line seems to be " this is the amount, reduced to this if paid within X days, or you can pay it now if you wish. Paying now does not prevent you from appealing the penalty fare" or similar wording.

No such wording for me - I was not given the option to defer payment at all, or any mention of X amount reduced to Y if paid within A days. Having established that I did not have a 'valid ticket', it was quite simply "where are you travelling from", followed by explaining that "you will be issued a penalty fare" and then, as I said, typing something on his device, telling me the amount and holding out the reader. No other details were taken from me (or given to me).

 

[Starmill]

No such wording for me - I was not given the option to defer payment at all, or any mention of X amount reduced to Y if paid within A days. Having established that I did not have a 'valid ticket', it was quite simply "where are you travelling from", followed by explaining that "you will be issued a penalty fare" and then, as I said, typing something on his device, telling me the amount and holding out the reader. No other details were taken from me (or given to me).

Sounds like the reason that you weren't given the Penalty Fare was because it couldn't have been correctly made it out then, rather than because of some kind of error.

 

[soil]

No such wording for me - I was not given the option to defer payment at all, or any mention of X amount reduced to Y if paid within A days. Having established that I did not have a 'valid ticket', it was quite simply "where are you travelling from", followed by explaining that "you will be issued a penalty fare" and then, as I said, typing something on his device, telling me the amount and holding out the reader. No other details were taken from me (or given to me).

It's an interesting one.

If this was me I'd just contact Greater Anglia to sue for return of the £63.80 on the basis that they never provided the appeal information or even the PF itself, as required by law. I'd sue if they didn't resolve within 14 days/

Obviously this action would be contingent on your having had a valid ticket.

Appeal is another option, maybe cheaper, but you get your court fees back, so.....

 

[WesternLancer]

The law presumes a letter posted first class arrives two days after posting, so post the letter over the counter at a post office and get a receipt.

You could also send it Special Delivery Guaranteed which carries an extra cost.

They are overseas. Does that principle apply? Does gauranteed delivery work from abroad?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 9 Aug 2025 ==

Do you have anyone in England who could post it for you if you send the above photograph (without redactions) and a letter to lodge an appeal?

“Alternatively, you can appeal by sending a written appeal to AS, Regus, Building 1000 Lakeside, Western Road, Portsmouth, PO6 3EZ giving as much information as possible to enable the AS team to search for your notice details.

Please include details of the date, time and place where your journey began and ended and the passenger details given at the time of issue.”

This is a good approach.

 

[Egg Centric]

No such wording for me - I was not given the option to defer payment at all, or any mention of X amount reduced to Y if paid within A days. Having established that I did not have a 'valid ticket', it was quite simply "where are you travelling from", followed by explaining that "you will be issued a penalty fare" and then, as I said, typing something on his device, telling me the amount and holding out the reader. No other details were taken from me (or given to me).

You gave no details such as your name, address, etc? Furthermore since you were travelling unsuccessfully on contactless they haven't scanned anything that could give them that information (such as an e-ticket from an online retailer)?

See what others say but this is so irregular if as described that I'd be tempted to do a chargeback.

Sounds very strange though. Are you certain of this recollection?