Lothian Group discussion (Lothian City, Lothian Country Bus and East Coast Buses)

[FlybeDash8Q400]

Also hearing 15 diesel Tri-axles ordered for
Airlink. My guess is EvoSeti’s.

Question is would MCV body a 13.4m chassis? They haven’t done that as yet, just the 12m and 12.8m versions.

 

[LothianBusesPh]

Any driver no matter how long they have been with ECB can be given any run - except for the NightHawk’s.

I believe you have to be over 21 for the X7.

 

[enginedin]

I believe you have to be over 21 for the X7.

I wonder how many <21s fully qualified drivers Lothian Buses employ

 

[Avenger20]

I believe you have to be over 21 for the X7.

Is that something to do with the split registrations?

 

[TheEastCoaster]

Is that something to do with the split registrations?

Is this the only Lothian route that has split registrations currently? seems strange, i thought maybe it was because of the long distance being over 30 miles away from the city or the extra long run on the A1?

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

Is this the only Lothian route that has split registrations currently? seems strange, i thought maybe it was because of the long distance being over 30 miles away from the city or the extra long run on the A1?

It’s the old EU rule of it being over 50km. Anything over that length needs to be split somewhere to comply. Believe law still exists domestically post Brexit.

Bizarre one with the X7 is that when it was first introduced (107 days) it was compliant as a single route West End to Dunbar High Street. Extending it to ASDA meant it crept over, just. Thus a new separate registration was added Dunbar High Street to Dunbar ASDA. Ideally it’d be split in Haddington for operational convenience but it’s stayed Edinburgh to Dunbar High Street, Dunbar High Street to ASDA. I believe the 253 is split this way (Edinburgh-Haddington-Grantshouse-Berwick).

 

[Graeme Duncan]

According to the Lothian Buses tracker e750 entered service on route 10 which leaves only 3 remaining of the 1st batch to enter service 732,738 and 746.

 

[Baileygirl]

According to the Lothian Buses tracker e750 entered service on route 10 which leaves only 3 remaining of the 1st batch to enter service 732,738 and 746.

738 is also in service on a 10

 

[TheEastCoaster]

You both make very good points here. Lothian have consistently added westbound journeys in the evening on the 36 so it will be interesting to see what happens with those. I would expect some dead runs to and from the Gyle as it is now. Sighthill I’m less sure of in terms of dead runs but late evening turnarounds either there or Hermiston Gait which again already exists. I can definitely see some of the early and late ‘garage runs’ that exist partly going with those runs curtailed to start/end at Queensferry Street. The Ocean Terminal start/ends of which there are a few probably kept if not added to.

This is probably the most logical solution going forward, hopefully this won't end up cutting the 36 down in terms of usage, it seems to be at a good position right now.

The 48 I’m suggesting would return essentially to its pre covid state. Every 20 minutes Fort Kinnaird to Gorebridge with single decks. I do think there’s a reasonable trade off for Rosewell with the 31 there. Certainly I’d be wanting the 31 over a 46. Though I suspect you’d want both!

Although I don't live in Midlothian I do visit it a lot, and the 31 is a service which has potential to extend beyond Polton Mill, at the end of the day if the 46 had to go, the 31 would be the best solution that is cost effective.

The 30 is simply a way of keeping Longstone with enough single deck rotas. Unless Lothian have something even more radical planned!

Maybe the 20 and 32 could do with an increase? nah doubt it will happen.

 

[CN04NRJ]

Question is would MCV body a 13.4m chassis? They haven’t done that as yet, just the 12m and 12.8m versions.

Exactly, it's more the luggage space that's needed. 81 seats isn't all that often needed given the frequency.

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

Exactly, it's more the luggage space that's needed. 81 seats isn't all that often needed given the frequency.

It’s tricky. I can’t see how a 12m version would ever work as it’s barely any longer than a B5TL. A 12.8m version might work but ideally you’d want to maintain the 13.4 length largely for fleet consistency. Surely ADL aren’t going to come out of nowhere and body these?

There’s a fair argument that the luggage racks could be filled more efficiently though. Half the time people put their cases flat on the rack whereas you’d fit more if they were stored on their side. Rucksacks could be carried on the floor without compromising legroom.

I also think a return to more traditional Pratico 3840 seats rather than the current GTS6700 which feel way too big for the journey length would be sensible too.

I’m still not at all convinced that two doors are necessary for Airlink. Yes perhaps post Airlink use it may be beneficial but otherwise it’s generally not useful. There is the slight caveat of it functioning as the rear emergency exit too.

 

[AndrewTaylor95]

It’s tricky. I can’t see how a 12m version would ever work as it’s barely any longer than a B5TL. A 12.8m version might work but ideally you’d want to maintain the 13.4 length largely for fleet consistency. Surely ADL aren’t going to come out of nowhere and body these?

There’s a fair argument that the luggage racks could be filled more efficiently though. Half the time people put their cases flat on the rack whereas you’d fit more if they were stored on their side. Rucksacks could be carried on the floor without compromising legroom.

I also think a return to more traditional Pratico 3840 seats rather than the current GTS6700 which feel way too big for the journey length would be sensible too.

I’m still not at all convinced that two doors are necessary for Airlink. Yes perhaps post Airlink use it may be beneficial but otherwise it’s generally not useful. There is the slight caveat of it functioning as the rear emergency exit too.

Lothian will probably get them to do a longer chassis as a one off, It's only MCV that do Volvo B8L chassis for the UK now as far as I'm aware so I doubt ADL will step in although would be a decent order to keep the Falkirk factory open but that ship has probably already sailed

 

[CN04NRJ]

Lothian will probably get them to do a longer chassis as a one off, It's only MCV that do Volvo B8L chassis for the UK now as far as I'm aware so I doubt ADL will step in although would be a decent order to keep the Falkirk factory open but that ship has probably already sailed

All of my sources say they're shorter, so probably 12.9m or thereabouts.

 

[computerSaysNo]

Is there a problem with the tracking again this morning? A lot of buses set on the 12 are tracking as still sitting in Marine garage, and there is only one bus in total tracking eastbound. I did think it could be Festival delays but there's nothing showing on the Service Updates page!

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

Is there a problem with the tracking again this morning? A lot of buses set on the 12 are tracking as still sitting in Marine garage, and there is only one bus in total tracking eastbound. I did think it could be Festival delays but there's nothing showing on the Service Updates page!

The joys of manual tracking. Both those buses (46 and 50) were swapped. 179 and 905 now out covering those two runs.

 

[TheEastCoaster]

Wonder when we will hear about the September service change!

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

Wonder when we will hear about the September service change!

Nothing on this but I can tell you most of the planned vehicle moves from the first batch of BZL’s have now happened.

 

[overthewater]

IF we don't hear something within the next week, I dare say were looking towards the end of September for these changes. However West Lothian council were WRONG to state “a commercial operator is at a fairly advanced planning stage to enhance the commercial bus service in Livingston Village.” If something was to happens that would be 3 months later which is NOT AKA "advance planning stage".

 

[Bus9120UK]

IF we don't hear something within the next week, I dare say were looking towards the end of September for these changes. However West Lothian council were WRONG to state “a commercial operator is at a fairly advanced planning stage to enhance the commercial bus service in Livingston Village.” If something was to happens that would be 3 months later which is NOT advance planning stage.

The date is essentially confirmed to be September 7th. The latest I'd expect an announcement is Monday. Lothian tend to publish details on Monday or Friday.

 

[paravostok]

Wonder when we will hear about the September service change!

I've been fervently checking this site every few hours to make sure I've not missed anything haha, I was hoping it would be today, maybe tomorrow? as afaik It's usually done on a Thursday

 

[scosutsut]

All of my sources say they're shorter, so probably 12.9m or thereabouts.

With the standard fleet seats I'd imagine you'd hit similar seating capacity as the XLBs.

Hope they reimagine the livery (as they normally do when the fleet is renewed)

Never loved the current iteration although it was an improvement to the one before it, it was gastly and I could never forgive them for replacing the original Skylink livery with it, as it was smart.

 

[Avenger20]

Proposed industrial action at East Coast has been cancelled after Unite members vote to accept pay offer.

 

[overthewater]

The date is essentially confirmed to be September 7th. The latest I'd expect an announcement is Monday. Lothian tend to publish details on Monday or Friday.

Tech they have until NEXT Friday to make an announcement, giving them the minimum 21 day notice to the public. If anything appear in Vosa before that time is impossible to say.

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

Tech they have until NEXT Friday to make an announcement, giving them the minimum 21 day notice to the public. If anything appear in Vosa before that time is impossible to say.

If that’s the case I’d expect an announcement sometime this week then. Unlikely to be done at the latest possible time.

 

[TheEastCoaster]

Tech they have until NEXT Friday to make an announcement, giving them the minimum 21 day notice to the public. If anything appear in Vosa before that time is impossible to say.

Hopefully it will be sooner, we live for that juicy service info stuff!

Proposed industrial action at East Coast has been cancelled after Unite members vote to accept pay offer.

Well that's good, so does that mean all 3 Lothian groups are all under equal pay?

 

[Bus9120UK]

Hopefully it will be sooner, we live for that juicy service info stuff!


Well that's good, so does that mean all 3 Lothian groups are all under equal pay?

No, I think it will be a case of Lothian, Lothian Country and East Coast buses drivers all having different pay.

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

No, I think it will be a case of Lothian, Lothian Country and East Coast buses drivers all having different pay.

I don’t think that will go down well with Lothian Country staff. It was already bad when it was perceived as a two tier workforce. If it then comes across as a three tier workforce - ouch.

I’m aware that there’s multiple reasons why the pays are different but I think the general consensus had been that LC and ECB get the same. That now potentially being different probably just shifts the problem from ECB to LC rather than solving it.

 

[TheEastCoaster]

I don’t think that will go down well with Lothian Country staff. It was already bad when it was perceived as a two tier workforce. If it then comes across as a three tier workforce - ouch.

I’m aware that there’s multiple reasons why the pays are different but I think the general consensus had been that LC and ECB get the same. That now potentially being different probably just shifts the problem from ECB to LC rather than solving it.

It's only a matter of time untill a fuss is kicked up from LCB's end, honestly it is ridiculous that there isn't equal pay amongst the three boards, Lothian Country also has 3 routes within Edinburgh too so it makes even less sense.

 

[scosutsut]

To be fair it's more stress to drive in the City constantly, and it's a more expensive place to live. If there was no financial incentive to work City work, I'd imagine they would start to struggle to man City shifts over the East/West brands.

What I do disagree with is City having a long term service pay uplift factor but the others don't.

 

[stevenedin]

If you can help it avoid Princes Street. It's absolutely chaos with all buses diverted heading west. The bus trackers showing buses will still turn up but they don't as they have been cut short.