Expired Railcard settlement

[daffodil]

Advice requested please!

On 21st April 2025, I was travelling on a return ticket (purchased by my sister on her trainline account) on a SWR train. On the train, I was approached by a revenue protection officer, showed the ticket, and realised my 26 - 30 railcard had expired in February. I quickly renewed the railcard, in front of the officer, however he had already taken details.

On 21st July, my sister received an email saying it was being investigated by the SWR team. I replied from my email, and informed them that is was a simple, honest mistake and I had renewed immediately. They replied saying they were looking at trainline history (unsure whether this is mine or my sisters) to see whether there were previous infractions.

A few days later, I received a letter in the post with 'settle out of court' for £300.50.

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I have checked my own trainline history - I only have one other infraction while the railcard had expired - my sister travelled on this train, and I have proof that I was on a flight at the time of travel. This was also a GWR train, not SWR.

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Would really rather not have a £300 penalty fare! Any advice on what to do would be very gratefully received.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 1 Aug 2025 ==

Advice requested please!

On 21st April 2025, I was travelling on a return ticket (purchased by my sister on her trainline account) on a SWR train. On the train, I was approached by a revenue protection officer, showed the ticket, and realised my 26 - 30 railcard had expired in February. I quickly renewed the railcard, in front of the officer, however he had already taken details.

On 21st July, my sister received an email saying it was being investigated by the SWR team. I replied from my email, and informed them that is was a simple, honest mistake and I had renewed immediately. They replied saying they were looking at trainline history (unsure whether this is mine or my sisters) to see whether there were previous infractions.

A few days later, I received a letter in the post with 'settle out of court' for £300.50.

---
I have checked my own trainline history - I only have one other infraction while the railcard had expired - my sister travelled on this train, and I have proof that I was on a flight at the time of travel. This was also a GWR train, not SWR.

--

Would really rather not have a £300 penalty fare! Any advice on what to do would be very gratefully received.

The 'fined' incident occurred from Waterloo to Templecombe (SWR). The previous infraction (which I did not travel on, and my sister also holds a railcard) was Paddington to Castle Cary (GWR). To note, I have also held valid railcards almost continuously for the last 10 years.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

Advice requested please!

On 21st April 2025, I was travelling on a return ticket (purchased by my sister on her trainline account) on a SWR train. On the train, I was approached by a revenue protection officer, showed the ticket, and realised my 26 - 30 railcard had expired in February. I quickly renewed the railcard, in front of the officer, however he had already taken details.

On 21st July, my sister received an email saying it was being investigated by the SWR team. I replied from my email, and informed them that is was a simple, honest mistake and I had renewed immediately. They replied saying they were looking at trainline history (unsure whether this is mine or my sisters) to see whether there were previous infractions.

A few days later, I received a letter in the post with 'settle out of court' for £300.50.

---
I have checked my own trainline history - I only have one other infraction while the railcard had expired - my sister travelled on this train, and I have proof that I was on a flight at the time of travel. This was also a GWR train, not SWR.

--

Would really rather not have a £300 penalty fare! Any advice on what to do would be very gratefully received.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 1 Aug 2025 ==


The 'fined' incident occurred from Waterloo to Templecombe (SWR). The previous infraction (which I did not travel on, and my sister also holds a railcard) was Paddington to Castle Cary (GWR). To note, I have also held valid railcards almost continuously for the last 10 years.

Welcome to the forum.

I suspect that the railway have noted that they saw a railcard which expired in February, and have then looked at the Trainline account used to buy the ticket that they saw in April, and have then found that there were tickets totalling £150 - £200 bought with a Railcard for that account between February and April. They've then added an admin fee of £100 - £150, making the £300.50 which they want paid.

So what you need to do is explain (politely!) to the railway that they have got a bit muddled by assuming that Railcard holder and Trainline account holder are the same person: explain that all the other tickets were bought by your sister for her use, and provide evidence of her railcard covering February to April.

Assuming that your sister did have a valid railcard for the time involved (and all the other tickets were for her and not you), I'd hope that will persuade the railway to drop the matter.

 

[AlterEgo]

There’s no need to provide evidence of the sister’s railcard. It’s not relevant to the case.

 

[Snow1964]

Assuming that your sister did have a valid railcard for the time involved (and all the other tickets were for her and not you), I'd hope that will persuade the railway to drop the matter.

I think it would be better worded as drop the other journeys (relating to your sisters travel).

Regardless of which family member actually booked the tickets, if you travelled with a ticket requiring a railcard, but only had an expired one then ticket was not valid on the day you were caught. You should still expect to pay full fare for this journey plus £100-150 admin fee in you want the out of court option.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

There’s no need to provide evidence of the sister’s railcard. It’s not relevant to the case.

In a formal sense of getting the railway to stop bothering the OP, I'd agree, but without proof that the sister was also travelling legitimately, won't the railway just divert their query back to the sister?

This is one of the times where it seems to me that while the OP can stand on their rights, the practical way to minimise hassle all round is to go a little further than the bare minimum.

 

[daffodil]

A question if I may - would SWR only include SWR infractions, or would they also take into account GWR when looking at past history?

 

[AlterEgo]

In a formal sense of getting the railway to stop bothering the OP, I'd agree, but without proof that the sister was also travelling legitimately, won't the railway just divert their query back to the sister?

Why would they? They have no reason to suspect the sister of travelling illegitimately.

A question if I may - would SWR only include SWR infractions, or would they also take into account GWR when looking at past history?

It’s all rail journeys.

 

[daffodil]

So in essence, do you think they have already looked at my own trainline history and calculated my penalty fare with:
- 1 x Waterloo to Templecombe (which I was caught on)
- 1 x Paddington to Castle Cary (I did not travel, and have proof of my own flight times)

Hence, do I send evidence of my flight, and inform them of my sister that travelled on that (Paddington to Castle Cary) journey? She has a valid railcard. Do I politely request that this is removed?

OR
Is the £300 penalty fare incorrectly made up of my sisters trainline history?

Do I ask them to send over the journeys that they suspect?

 

[Snow1964]

If you have already checked the history (between date of railcard expiry and date of getting caught) then no point in asking for them to list it too.

If only one other ticket (your sisters trip to Castle Cary) ask for it to be excluded, but accept the journey you got caught on.

For clarity on another point, if you also have a trainline account, they probably won't know about it (they will have used the reference on the ticket which would of course shown your sisters account as she booked it). Therefore if you made other journeys on your own account wrongly claiming an in date railcard, probably not on their radar.

 

[AlterEgo]

So in essence, do you think they have already looked at my own trainline history and calculated my penalty fare with:
- 1 x Waterloo to Templecombe (which I was caught on)
- 1 x Paddington to Castle Cary (I did not travel, and have proof of my own flight times)

Hence, do I send evidence of my flight, and inform them of my sister that travelled on that (Paddington to Castle Cary) journey? She has a valid railcard. Do I politely request that this is removed?

OR
Is the £300 penalty fare incorrectly made up of my sisters trainline history?

Do I ask them to send over the journeys that they suspect?

I think asking them to send the journeys they’re claiming for is prudent.

 

[swt_passenger]

[…]
Would really rather not have a £300 penalty fare! Any advice on what to do would be very gratefully received.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 1 Aug 2025 ==


The 'fined' incident occurred from Waterloo to Templecombe (SWR). The previous infraction (which I did not travel on, and my sister also holds a railcard) was Paddington to Castle Cary (GWR). To note, I have also held valid railcards almost continuously for the last 10 years.

You haven’t got a penalty fare, unfortunately they can only be issued at the time. He reported you for investigation, and this is the result. It’s still not a fine though, it’s an alternative to a fine that they’re proposing. All you can do really is to get it down to an agreed correct figure, ie by having your sister’s journey ignored. But as others have said they can and do attempt to deal with journeys made on other company’s trains if they come to light.

 

[daffodil]

From your experience, is it worth questioning and pushing back, asking for a lower penalty fare? Or biting the bullet and just paying up? Do SWR ever give any kindness for honest mistakes?!

 

[Mcr Warrior]

From your experience, is it worth questioning and pushing back, asking for a lower penalty fare? Or biting the bullet and just paying up? Do SWR ever give any kindness for honest mistakes?!

@daffodil. It's not a fine. It's not a penalty fare. You're being asked to pay up for what SWR reckon are unpaid fares (because an inappropriately railcard discounted ticket was purchased/used) with an investigation and admin fee added on top. Usually SWR will charge you the full Anytime Day Single fare, with no allowance made for what was previously paid/underpaid. If you can prove or otherwise satisfactorily convince SWR that one or more of the railcard discounted tickets was actually correctly purchased/ used, you obviously shouldn't have to pay for that journey again.

 

[swt_passenger]

From your experience, is it worth questioning and pushing back, asking for a lower penalty fare? Or biting the bullet and just paying up? Do SWR ever give any kindness for honest mistakes?!

Based on reports here yes they will revise the proposed settlement if you can provide evidence you didn’t make one of the journeys. But they’ll still expect the adjusted settlement to be paid, which will be based on the anytime single fare with no allowance for the discounted invalid ticket. Their admin costs are usually considered on the higher side, around £120-150 is the usual. I’ll reiterate this is NOT a fine or penalty fare.

They’ll not let you off on the basis it’s an ‘honest mistake’, because there’s no way to differentiate between a one off error and the dozens of other out of date railcard users they find every day.

 

[daffodil]

Thank you so much for your kind advice. After asking SWR for further details on which dates the settlement was calculated, they "have decided to close this matter without any further action".

Absolutely delighted, and certainly won't be letting my railcard expire again!

 

[Starmill]

Thank you so much for your kind advice. After asking SWR for further details on which dates the settlement was calculated, they "have decided to close this matter without any further action".

Absolutely delighted, and certainly won't be letting my railcard expire again!

Given you corrected the issue at the time, this is a sensible outcome.

You probably wouldn't have got this if you'd not done so, and had the evidence of doing so available, so a good move.