Local services in the Huddersfield area post TRU

[Manutd1999]

I've sketched out how I would organise services post-TRU, trying to standardise everything on a half-hourly pattern.

Transpennine
2ph Liverpool - Victoria - Leeds - Newcastle/Hull, calling at Hudds and Dewsbury
2ph Airport - Victoria - Leeds - York - Newcastle/Middlesborough, calling at Hudds and Stalybridge
2ph Piccadilly - Huddersfield stoppers, extending 1ph to Leeds and 1ph to York via Wakefield
2ph Huddersfield - Leeds stoppers

Calder Valley
2ph Blackpool/Preston - Bradford - Leeds - Hull/York
2ph Chester - Victoria - Bradford - Leeds
2ph Salford - Victoria - Todmorden, extending 1ph to Leeds via Dewsbury and 1ph to Blackburn
2ph Huddersfield - Bradford - Leeds

There's space at the Manchester end for 2-4x extra stoppers on each line, terminating in the bay platforms at Rochdale/Stalybridge and heading back across Manchester to Wigan/Blackburn/Southport etc.

 

[LittleAH]

I've sketched out how I would organise services post-TRU, trying to standardise everything on a half-hourly pattern.

Transpennine
2ph Liverpool - Victoria - Leeds - Newcastle/Hull, calling at Hudds and Dewsbury
2ph Airport - Victoria - Leeds - York - Newcastle/Middlesborough, calling at Hudds and Stalybridge
2ph Piccadilly - Huddersfield stoppers, extending 1ph to Leeds and 1ph to York via Wakefield
2ph Huddersfield - Leeds stoppers

Calder Valley
2ph Blackpool/Preston - Bradford - Leeds - Hull/York
2ph Chester - Victoria - Bradford - Leeds
2ph Salford - Victoria - Todmorden, extending 1ph to Leeds via Dewsbury and 1ph to Blackburn
2ph Huddersfield - Bradford - Leeds

There's space at the Manchester end for 2-4x extra stoppers on each line, terminating in the bay platforms at Rochdale/Stalybridge and heading back across Manchester to Wigan/Blackburn/Southport etc.

View attachment 184329

Where’s the capacity

 

[61653 HTAFC]

This might be a bit of an aside, but it isn't entirely off-topic...

Has there been anything stated publicly about whether services between Brighouse and Huddersfield will call additionally at Deighton once the upgrade is completed? Whilst I don't believe there will be a huge amount of demand on day one, with the slow services being segregated from fasts there should be capacity to do so.

 

[YorksLad12]

This might be a bit of an aside, but it isn't entirely off-topic...

Has there been anything stated publicly about whether services between Brighouse and Huddersfield will call additionally at Deighton once the upgrade is completed? Whilst I don't believe there will be a huge amount of demand on day one, with the slow services being segregated from fasts there should be capacity to do so.

There's a difference between "will" and "will allow", of course. The works "will allow" that service to call at Deighton (and at Ravensthorpe for Wakefield-bound services) but I don't think anyone's come up with a timetable, or a potential bid. I think we're all assuming they will, because both would make sense; a better service between Deighton and Huddersfield, benefits to Wakefield-Thornhill traffic (Thornhill being around the corner from Ravensthorpe).

 

[AndyHudds]

This might be a bit of an aside, but it isn't entirely off-topic...

Has there been anything stated publicly about whether services between Brighouse and Huddersfield will call additionally at Deighton once the upgrade is completed? Whilst I don't believe there will be a huge amount of demand on day one, with the slow services being segregated from fasts there should be capacity to do so.

Considering it takes in Brighouse, a largish employment place, and when and if Elland is completed another employment area around the Lowfields area, where the station will be, I see no reason why it wouldn't call at Deighton on completion of thd improvements. I think the station numbers for Deighton, as you've pointed out numerous times, are misleading due to Metrocards being regularly used and these aren't included in passenger numbers so the usage is likely to be a lot higher, skewing rhe figures as it were, keeping them artificially low.

 

[Manutd1999]

Transpennine
2ph Liverpool - Victoria - Leeds - Newcastle/Hull, calling at Hudds and Dewsbury
2ph Airport - Victoria - Leeds - York - Newcastle/Middlesborough, calling at Hudds and Stalybridge
2ph Piccadilly - Huddersfield stoppers, extending 1ph to Leeds and 1ph to York via Wakefield
2ph Huddersfield - Leeds stoppers

Calder Valley
2ph Blackpool/Preston - Bradford - Leeds - Hull/York
2ph Chester - Victoria - Bradford - Leeds
2ph Salford - Victoria - Todmorden, extending 1ph to Leeds via Dewsbury and 1ph to Blackburn
2ph Huddersfield - Bradford - Leeds

Where’s the capacity

How much more capacity is really required?

Once you've got a service evey 15mins from Victoria to Leeds, adding more ad-hoc services in the gaps thas limited benefit. Lengthening selected TPE services would be a more cost-effective way of increasing capacity if needed.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

There's a difference between "will" and "will allow", of course. The works "will allow" that service to call at Deighton (and at Ravensthorpe for Wakefield-bound services) but I don't think anyone's come up with a timetable, or a potential bid. I think we're all assuming they will, because both would make sense; a better service between Deighton and Huddersfield, benefits to Wakefield-Thornhill traffic (Thornhill being around the corner from Ravensthorpe).

To be fair, those services could have been calling at Deighton right from day one back in 2000 (assuming the additional few minutes they'd have taken to get out of the way of fast Leeds services at Bradley junction wasn't critical). However they never did, and WYPTE's diagrammatic maps had the "curve" omitting Deighton. This led to the sort of anomaly loved by a certain type of transport nerd such as myself, when the "Grand Tour" service operated. During that time Brighouse and Deighton did have a (sort of direct) service but it involved passing through DTN without stopping, reversing at Huddersfield, and then calling at Deighton on the way back out towards Wakefield. As such, no normal person would use this service for any practical purpose... just sad gits like me!

 

[LittleAH]

How much more capacity is really required?

Once you've got a service evey 15mins from Victoria to Leeds, adding more ad-hoc services in the gaps thas limited benefit. Lengthening selected TPE services would be a more cost-effective way of increasing capacity if needed.

You’ve put four stopping services through a two track section between Dewsbury and Leeds. Never mind the increased pressure on the Calder Valley. No freight paths? It’s one of the biggest benefits of TRU…

 

[61653 HTAFC]

You’ve put four stopping services through a two track section between Dewsbury and Leeds. Never mind the increased pressure on the Calder Valley. No freight paths? It’s one of the biggest benefits of TRU…

Little or no freight runs via Dewsbury though, it all goes via Healey Mills.

 

[Manutd1999]

You’ve put four stopping services through a two track section between Dewsbury and Leeds.

the indicative TRU timetable has 6ph fast/semi-fast plus 2ph stoppers plus the Calder Valley service, so it's not that different.......

With electrification there should be enough space, assuming the stoppers are flighted to run 3 mins behind the fast trains at Dewsbury and the 4x extra stops lose 8-10 mins vs non-stop. If the fast services are delayed, the stoppers could be held on the slow lines around Mirfield to maintain reliability.

 

[LittleAH]

Little or no freight runs via Dewsbury though, it all goes via Healey Mills.

That’s not the point RE freight. There’s a reason why there still no solution to two stopping trains an hour between Huddersfield and Stalybridge, the reason being freight.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

That’s not the point RE freight. There’s a reason why there still no solution to two stopping trains an hour between Huddersfield and Stalybridge, the reason being freight.

Is that section still set to be three-tracked as part of TRU? In any case, most freight runs via Hebden Bridge and Brighouse, not via Huddersfield. The only section of the route that most freight touches is between Heaton Lodge and Ravensthorpe. AIUI there's a desire to run more freight via Standedge as that's a significantly shorter route, but most of it currently goes the long way round. Quite a bit of that freight, specifically the Drax biomass flows, have an uncertain future anyway.

I personally don't see that there's much advantage to be gained by joining the stoppers up either side of Huddersfield, maybe if we get the 2tph stoppers it's worth running one of them through (with the other going to York via Castleford) but anyone from Slaithwaite or Marsden wanting to get to Leeds quickly would be better served by changing onto a fast at Huddersfield.