Paris to Dieppe, rolling stock and tickets

[williamn]

Astonishingly they have removed the service already because of poor passenger numbers

I'd be interested to know what the service was like - was it the typical SNCF regional thing that's incredibly infrequent?

 

[Gloster]

I'd be interested to know what the service was like - was it the typical SNCF regional thing that's incredibly infrequent?

TER Normandie is still showing a service until the end of August. It is basic even by French rural standards: several early and evening trains, but nothing in the middle of the day, not even the old lunchtime return trip

 

[stuu]

TER Normandie is still showing a service until the end of August. It is basic even by French rural standards: several early and evening trains, but nothing in the middle of the day, not even the old lunchtime return trip

The TER Normandie site links to a bus timetable, there aren't any passenger trains

 

[Gloster]

The TER Normandie site links to a bus timetable, there aren't any passenger trains

So it does: I missed that the only indication is at the bottom.

 

[Gordon]

I believe that the northern section of the line closed in 1988 after SNCF decided to divert the remaining through trains to the Rouen route and the région it wasn’t prepared to bear the full costs of the line. Only a year or two before that I travelled over the line in a USI coach on a through train from Paris.

Astonishingly they have removed the service already because of poor passenger numbers

The direct line closed - essentially - for the usual French reasons:

1) the demography of rural France. The population is thinly spread across a vast land area. On rural lines across much of France the passenger numbers boarding trains at each wayside station is woefully low
2) the pathetic timetable
3) the French railways' 'vicious circle': pathetic (infrequent services) timetable = no passengers = pathetic (infrequent services) timetable. No one dares to get a train 'out' because of the risk of the infrequent service leaving one 'marooned' at the other end of one's journey
4) cost of upkeep (related all the above)
5) lack of political will to change any of the above


.

 

[williamn]

It does amaze me that SNCF gets idolised so much in the UK when quite a lot of it is really quite bad. Can you imagine a rail reopening getting reversed after a coiple of years in the UK?!

The vicious circle outlined above feels very much like BR in the 60's and 70's.

 

[Jamesrob637]

It does amaze me that SNCF gets idolised so much in the UK when quite a lot of it is really quite bad. Can you imagine a rail reopening getting reversed after a coiple of years in the UK?!

The vicious circle outlined above feels very much like BR in the 60's and 70's.

It's open for freight, it turns out, south of Serqueux.

 

[Sir Felix Pole]

It does amaze me that SNCF gets idolised so much in the UK when quite a lot of it is really quite bad. Can you imagine a rail reopening getting reversed after a coiple of years in the UK?!

Well yes, Corby. Happily now re-reversed and electrified to boot!

 

[stuu]

It does amaze me that SNCF gets idolised so much in the UK when quite a lot of it is really quite bad. Can you imagine a rail reopening getting reversed after a coiple of years in the UK?!

The vicious circle outlined above feels very much like BR in the 60's and 70's.

Having now read the French wikipedia page about it, it seems the restarted passenger service amounted to 4 trains a day, Monday to Friday only, which didn't connect very well with the trains to Paris. Sounds a lot like SNCF didn't want it to work

 

[James H]

Not just down to SNCF - the regional authorities specify the TER service

 

[Gordon]

In another example of the the French 'vicious circle', transport proponents and enthusiasts have been commenting on the 'disastrous' plan to close the passenger service on the line from Busseau sur Creuse to Felletin.

This 'hand wringing' often happens in France (and elsewhere of course) , but although I am an enthusiast I am also a realist and a pragmatist, and I can absolutely see the sense in not retaining a service on such lines from a financial point of view.

This is the remaining stub of the railway from Busseau sur Creuse to Ussel. Felletin to Ussel was closed in the closure wave of 1979/80. The line was retained with a sparse - almost parly - service for (as usual) mainly schoolchildren and market day provision. However the closure of the south section of the line and now the north section is hardly a surprise nor unjustifiable from a financial point of view.

The line is in central France which is notoriously depopulated. Furthermore, Creuse departement is the one of the most rural and sparsely populated departments in France, population 115,000 - which is half the population of Luton...


The following comparative stats speak for themselves:

Population of Felletin: 1,552
Population of Aubusson, the largest town on the line: 3,000
Population of an example rural English town with a station: Wem (Shropshire) 5,142

Creuse: 21 inhabitants per km²
Cumbria: 73 inhabitants per km²

 

[WesternLancer]

If memory serves me correctly, I last took the boat train service from London to Paris via Newhaven-Dieppe in 1993. I remember Dieppe Maritime being amazingly convenient from ship to train. It really is a shame that all the old dockside terminal stations serving the cross-Channel trade have now disappeared. "Progress" they call it.

Very much agree with this. The quayside station in dipped was a stylish building and the ability to just walk over to many high quality cafes and bistros along the harbour front there was a delight.

 

[eastwestdivide]

It really is a shame that all the old dockside terminal stations serving the cross-Channel trade have now disappeared. "Progress" they call it.

The other side of the "Progress" coin is that there are probably* more foot passengers on a single Eurostar than on any of the cross-channel ferries.
*Source: wild guess, happy to be proved wrong if anyone has any foot passenger statistics to contribute!

 

[williamn]

The other side of the "Progress" coin is that there are probably* more foot passengers on a single Eurostar than on any of the cross-channel ferries.
*Source: wild guess, happy to be proved wrong if anyone has any foot passenger statistics to contribute!

On my crossing yesterday to Dieppe there were two bus loads of foot passengers, so maybe 80? So yes way less than a Eurostar, though I’m sure still a welcome addition to Dieppe’s economy. The transfer bus in Dieppe only comes 1 hour after the ferry arrives by which time we’d already walked into town.

 

[AlastairFraser]

Very much agree with this. The quayside station in dipped was a stylish building and the ability to just walk over to many high quality cafes and bistros along the harbour front there was a delight.

Although the original harbour is still a lovely place to visit at night and the decent municipal bus system (free on Saturday!) makes getting about in the town very easy.

 

[williamn]

Although the original harbour is still a lovely place to visit at night and the decent municipal bus system (free on Saturday!) makes getting about in the town very easy.

I’m sure it’s actually considerably nicer without a station there, as nice as the station was!

I can’t imagine where all the waiting lorries and cars queued up, must have been a bit of a nightmare.

 

[WesternLancer]

Although the original harbour is still a lovely place to visit at night and the decent municipal bus system (free on Saturday!) makes getting about in the town very easy.

Thanks. Good to know all is well on that front. It’s a while since I’ve been now I think about it

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 20 Jul 2025 ==

I’m sure it’s actually considerably nicer without a station there, as nice as the station was!

I can’t imagine where all the waiting lorries and cars queued up, must have been a bit of a nightmare.

This is a good point but I never recall it seeming an issue!

But you make a good point when thinking about it. Picture here gives a sense of it

dieppe ferry-boat pénétrant dans l'avant-port | En vente sur Delcampe

A partir de 2,00 € - Catégorie : Cartes Postales > Europe > France > [76] Seine Maritime > Dieppe

www.delcampe.net

 

[Gordon]

I’m sure it’s actually considerably nicer without a station there, as nice as the station was!

I can’t imagine where all the waiting lorries and cars queued up, must have been a bit of a nightmare.

Well, it was the 1980s, not 2025 so the number of 'cars and lorries' was a lot fewer than today (each ship was smaller as well...). When vehicles still used the old landing point they went round in a loop to board from the East end; you can see the linkspan here: https://c8.alamy.com/comp/2AHTD91/t...-color-slide-film-frdric-beaumont-2AHTD91.jpg

As for the station, of course it was a nice way to go from boat to train in a few moments, but the layout was 'Victorian' and designed before the age of the car. (as per Folkestone Harbour, Dover Marine, Liverpool IOMSPC landing stage, Boulogne Maritime and Calais Maritime. If it was still the same now it would be unworkable.

 

[AlastairFraser]

I’m sure it’s actually considerably nicer without a station there, as nice as the station was!

I can’t imagine where all the waiting lorries and cars queued up, must have been a bit of a nightmare.

Most certainly.

Thanks. Good to know all is well on that front. It’s a while since I’ve been now I think about it

Time for another trip perhaps, this ongoing court case may be extremely damaging and threaten the route's future (although I'm not sure if BF are serious about it, or if it's just a spat based off DFDS eating their lunch in the Channel Islands).

Another bonus to heading on a Saturday that I forgot to mention is that their little dial a ride system that goes out further into the countryside about 10 miles around is also free on Sat (you need to book a few days in advance), so you can also do some more rural destinations easily.

 

[Sir Felix Pole]

Well, it was the 1980s, not 2025 so the number of 'cars and lorries' was a lot fewer than today (each ship was smaller as well...). When vehicles still used the old landing point they went round in a loop to board from the East end; you can see the linkspan here: https://c8.alamy.com/comp/2AHTD91/t...-color-slide-film-frdric-beaumont-2AHTD91.jpg

As for the station, of course it was a nice way to go from boat to train in a few moments, but the layout was 'Victorian' and designed before the age of the car. (as per Folkestone Harbour, Dover Marine, Liverpool IOMSPC landing stage, Boulogne Maritime and Calais Maritime. If it was still the same now it would be unworkable.

Here is a rather nice shot of the old ferry terminal. It was rebuilt in the '50s after war damage.

Ro-ro car ferries didn't start until 1964 when the classic passenger only ship SS 'Falaise' was converted.

 

[WesternLancer]

Here is a rather nice shot of the old ferry terminal. It was rebuilt in the '50s after war damage.

Ro-ro car ferries didn't start until 1964 when the classic passenger only ship SS 'Falaise' was converted.

Very nice. Any idea of date for that picture?

 

[Gloster]

That looks like the Villandry, which entered service in May 1965. However, I doubt if it was much later than that as you have a 68000 on the train.

 

[Gordon]

Very nice. Any idea of date for that picture?

The condition of the loco (original style windscreens) and coaching stock (ex Etat metallic coaches) date the photo to circa 1964 - 74


.

 

[WesternLancer]

The condition of the loco (original style windscreens) and coaching stock (ex Etat metallic coaches) date the photo to circa 1964 - 74


.

Many thanks.

 

[52290]

I took this photo of a 231D at Dieppe in 1963. Was this the last year of steam on the Paris trains?

 

[route101]

On my crossing yesterday to Dieppe there were two bus loads of foot passengers, so maybe 80? So yes way less than a Eurostar, though I’m sure still a welcome addition to Dieppe’s economy. The transfer bus in Dieppe only comes 1 hour after the ferry arrives by which time we’d already walked into town.

Took the crossing from Dieppe to Newhaven at 12 on Sunday and I heard the guy at Newhaven say 72 foot passengers. I walked to the port but saw no one else do so.

 

[williamn]

Took the crossing from Dieppe to Newhaven at 12 on Sunday and I heard the guy at Newhaven say 72 foot passengers. I walked to the port but saw no one else do so.

I was behind you on the delayed 18.00 (though we made up the 40 min delay enroute!). Three bus loads of foot passengers this time. Only saw two others waking to the port but also only two on the bus when it passed us!

 

[Gordon]

Since this thread started I have been thinking about a photo I took in 1979, and I finally had time this week to locate an old print which I have now scanned.

SNCF 'Caravelle' unit X4774 + XR 8774 forming the Seajet 'boat train' Dieppe - Paris St Lazare. 26 May 1979




The short lived Seajet jetfoil service Brighton Marina - Dieppe was (I believe) the simplest ever land-sea-land route between London and Paris with (apart from the Night Ferry and the Golden Arrow) the closest 'hop' between modes at each port.

Because a jetfoil was a small boat it could easily reach into the Marina at Brighton and the very inner harbour at Dieppe

The service was express road coach Victoria Coach station (London) - Brighton Marina. The coach drove right into the hear of the marina almost up to the jetfoil berth.

At Dieppe the boat came right into the inner harbour and berthed on the harbour wall adjacent to the exit of Dieppe Maritime boat train tracks. A quick walk up some steep steps and you were where I standing.

Sadly the train connection Dieppe - Paris lasted an even shorter time than the whole service, latterly you had to use regular SNCF trains to Dieppe


.

 

[WesternLancer]

Since this thread started I have been thinking about a photo I took in 1979, and I finally had time this week to locate an old print which I have now scanned.

SNCF 'Caravelle' unit X4774 + XR 8774 forming the Seajet 'boat train' Dieppe - Paris St Lazare. 26 May 1979

View attachment 185942


The short lived Seajet jetfoil service Brighton Marina - Dieppe was (I believe) the simplest ever land-sea-land route between London and Paris with (apart from the Night Ferry and the Golden Arrow) the closest 'hop' between modes at each port.

Because a jetfoil was a small boat it could easily reach into the Marina at Brighton and the very inner harbour at Dieppe

The service was express road coach Victoria Coach station (London) - Brighton Marina. The coach drove right into the hear of the marina almost up to the jetfoil berth.

At Dieppe the boat came right into the inner harbour and berthed on the harbour wall adjacent to the exit of Dieppe Maritime boat train tracks. A quick walk up some steep steps and you were where I standing.

Sadly the train connection Dieppe - Paris lasted an even shorter time than the whole service, latterly you had to use regular SNCF trains to Dieppe


.

Great photo and thanks for posting.

Despite having grown up locally to Newhaven at first I had no recollection of this cross channel service but after reflecting about it vague memories of it came back to me! I don’t think I ever actually saw it however.

I did do the jetfoil to Oostende once as part of a family trip by train to Germany in the 80s but of course that route ran for quite a long time.

 

[Sir Felix Pole]

Two rather nostalgic SNCF publicity films from 1965 highlighting the introduction of the 'Villandry' and 'Valencay'.

SNCF Dieppe

At 14:22 there is a superb sequence of the 'backing-out' procedure and at 29:54 an aerial view over the inner harbour.

(Ignore the verbiage at the beginning and end of the DVD in which these films are contained).

The second film also shows the Autotrain (from Dieppe Ville) to the Riviera - our intrepid family are travelling in a Hillman Imp so it was probably just as well they were using this service!