Yet more WCML delays (16/07/25)

[321362]

Multiple trains have picked up 30+ minute delays near Leighton Buzzard. Anyone know what's causing all this?

The WCML seems to be barely limping along at the moment. Seems that it's always got some issue or other that's delaying trains.

 

[hexagon789]

Multiple trains have picked up 30+ minute delays near Leighton Buzzard. Anyone know what's causing all this?

The WCML seems to be barely limping along at the moment. Seems that it's always got some issue or other that's delaying trains.

Trespass incident was affecting services, compounded by a recurring signalling fault between Lichfield and Stoke.

 

[AMD]

A crack in a crossing at Bilsworth, so a 20mph speed restriction has been imposed

 

[GRALISTAIR]

The WCML seems to be barely limping along at the moment. Seems that it's always got some issue or other that's delaying trains.

Judging by the sheer number of threads on this forum on this subject, it appears this statement is correct. How is it going to improve though?

 

[321362]

Judging by the sheer number of threads on this forum on this subject, it appears this statement is correct. How is it going to improve though?

What's the main cause of the issues? Is it infrastructure, or the trains themselves, or something else?

 

[Trainguy34]

Taking the average delay for the journey I'm going to be doing for the Greatest Gathering, the 18:46 Euston - Tamworth LM has an average (from the past week) delay of 13 minutes (using the non-stop 19:07 AWC if it's cancelled), annoyingly that's going to mean a missed connection over to Derby.

For the return on the 18:56 from Tamworth to Euston it's a 20 min delay using the next available train, not ideal but doable.

 

[Ianmel1969]

To my surprise my return from Euston to Glasgow Central was bang on time this week.

However that didn't stop one carriage being evacuated at Preston when the heavy showers outside started falling inside the train, through the gangway connector and on my return leg no less than 3 catering staff went sick at the last minute, making my rare treat of of a 1st class hot breakfast evaporate into a couple of slices of toast, a teacake or some porridge!

 

[Tilting007]

What's the main cause of the issues? Is it infrastructure, or the trains themselves, or something else?

Two trespass incidents in close succession is the biggest delay today, followed by the ESR on the DM at Blisworth.
Two further ESRs in the Stafford area and a few minor bits.
A lot of trains run so faults do get found and need actioned.
Without the trespass incidents I doubt the others would have been mentioned.

 

[merry]

Also ECML in a mess again today - signalling issues most of the day at Peterborough. But few forum members post about it.
A variety of issues every week, from trespasses to track or train defects, and signalling or OHLE issues. I have luckily dodged these in recent weeks, colleagues have been less fortunate.
To my eye the main lines are all suffering more this year.

 

[D1511]

Network Rail love to tell everyone that the WCML S is the busiest bit of railway in Europe......but whether it is or not, there's just no resilience whatsoever, and no real scope for service recovery once an incident happens.
I've been quite lucky recently though, by the looks of the threads on here. 21 late into Edinburgh on Friday last on the hottest day of the year wasn't a bad result.

 

[pnepaul]

I was onboard the 15.38 Glasgow to Euston ( as far as Carlisle). This was delayed for c40 mins due to a medical emergency. However, the police ( BTP?) declared the relevant carriage a scene of crime and the train was cancelled.

We were told to board the 16.40, which, to my surprise, managed to accommodate both sets of passengers with seats to spare. We then had a slight delay near Lockerbie waiting for Sir Nigel Gresley to go into the loop.

 

[Tilting007]

Network Rail love to tell everyone that the WCML S is the busiest bit of railway in Europe......but whether it is or not, there's just no resilience whatsoever, and no real scope for service recovery once an incident happens.
I've been quite lucky recently though, by the looks of the threads on here. 21 late into Edinburgh on Friday last on the hottest day of the year wasn't a bad result.

Depends what you mean but no resilience. It has fared well in the heat.
There are lots of challenges but any busy railway will struggle during and after an incident.
Without culling the service you have late trains, and if you take too many trains out you then can’t reintroduce them. Tough one to balance, and I am sure if the solution was simple it would have been sorted long ago.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Depends what you mean but no resilience. It has fared well in the heat.
There are lots of challenges but any busy railway will struggle during and after an incident.
Without culling the service you have late trains, and if you take too many trains out you then can’t reintroduce them. Tough one to balance, and I am sure if the solution was simple it would have been sorted long ago.

I remember Chris Gibb was hired* by NR to produce a report on how to improve WCML South resilience/performance.
How did those recommendations go?
I seem to remember a lot of new fencing was proposed south of Rugby to lessen the risk of suicide/trespass incidents.

* this was in 2012, when he was part of the Virgin Trains management team. He is now a non-exec director at DFTO.

 

[godfreycomplex]

Also ECML in a mess again today - signalling issues most of the day at Peterborough. But few forum members post about it.

WCML is the country’s busiest main line. ECML is the country’s fifth busiest main line. That may account for it

 

[Russel]

Multiple trains have picked up 30+ minute delays near Leighton Buzzard. Anyone know what's causing all this?

The WCML seems to be barely limping along at the moment. Seems that it's always got some issue or other that's delaying trains.

Judging by the sheer number of threads on this forum on this subject, it appears this statement is correct. How is it going to improve though?

Almost every time I use the WCML out of Euston, something goes wrong.

I mentioned the weekly WCML meltdowns in another thread and was told they simply don't happen!

 

[dk1]

Hasn’t it always been like this on the WCML? So much to go wrong and such a busy route.

 

[321362]

Network Rail love to tell everyone that the WCML S is the busiest bit of railway in Europe......but whether it is or not, there's just no resilience whatsoever, and no real scope for service recovery once an incident happens.
I've been quite lucky recently though, by the looks of the threads on here. 21 late into Edinburgh on Friday last on the hottest day of the year wasn't a bad result.

Castlefield is busier, no?

 

[zwk500]

Castlefield is busier, no?

WCML south is generally quoted as 'the busiest mixed-traffic railway' in Europe.
It is very busy and has very long trains and connects 5 of the biggest cities in the land (London, Birmingham, Manchester, Glasgow, Liverpool) so I wouldn't be surprised if in terms of Passenger-km and tonne-km it carried more than between Euston and Rugby than Castlefield. And possibly vehicle-km.
The GWML to Reading may get closest.

 

[A S Leib]

WCML is the country’s busiest main line. ECML is the country’s fifth busiest main line.

Which order are the Midland, Great Western, Great Eastern, South Western, South Eastern and Brighton Main Lines in?

 

[DarloRich]

I mentioned the weekly WCML meltdowns in another thread and was told they simply don't happen!

No you weren't.

I am daily user of the WCML between MKC and London each way and don't recognise the issues many here post. From my daily user point of view it is not as bad as correspondents here want to make out. Yes, OBVISOULY, things go wrong and when they do it can take time to sort out but generally my journeys are fine. I have many more problems with the Marston Vale line than i do with the WCML!

 

[43066]

Almost every time I use the WCML out of Euston, something goes wrong.

I mentioned the weekly WCML meltdowns in another thread and was told they simply don't happen!

You weren’t told that, though. You had made a similar claim to your first sentence above, and it was pointed at to you that 90% of WCML trains arrive within five minutes of booked.

Therefore presumably you’ve either been *incredibly* unlucky, or you’re complaining about delays/issues that haven’t affected you personally.

 

[A S Leib]

No you weren't.

I am daily user of the WCML between MKC and London each way and don't recognise the issues many here post. From my daily user point of view it is not as bad as correspondents here want to make out. Yes, OBVISOULY, things go wrong and when they do it can take time to sort out but generally my journeys are fine. I have many more problems with the Marston Vale line than i do with the WCML!

As somebody who fairly frequently uses the WCML between Hemel and Euston and north of Preston, and less regularly the bit between them, I'd say that the issues are less frequent on the southern section.

 

[DarloRich]

As somebody who fairly frequently uses the WCML between Hemel and Euston and north of Preston, and less regularly the bit between them, I'd say that the issues are less frequent on the southern section.

Agreed - but by that token I don't care what happens in Tebay. I DO care what happens at Tring

( I acknowledge that the reverse is also true!)

 

[The Planner]

Castlefield is busier, no?

Depends how you are looking at it, separate slow line timetable vs the fasts (the fasts will be up to 14 odd tph soon to Ledburn all at 110mph and more) or as a whole.

 

[Tilting007]

I remember Chris Gibb was hired* by NR to produce a report on how to improve WCML South resilience/performance.
How did those recommendations go?
I seem to remember a lot of new fencing was proposed south of Rugby to lessen the risk of suicide/trespass incidents.

* this was in 2012, when he was part of the Virgin Trains management team. He is now a non-exec director at DFTO.

Fencing was all done…

 

[godfreycomplex]

Which order are the Midland, Great Western, Great Eastern, South Western, South Eastern and Brighton Main Lines in?

Off the top of my head WCML first then Brighton, Western, South Western, ECML, then GE and Midland after them. SEML is a bit too hard to quantify

 

[SCDR_WMR]

No you weren't.

I am daily user of the WCML between MKC and London each way and don't recognise the issues many here post. From my daily user point of view it is not as bad as correspondents here want to make out. Yes, OBVISOULY, things go wrong and when they do it can take time to sort out but generally my journeys are fine. I have many more problems with the Marston Vale line than i do with the WCML!

I average 1-2 large delays (+40 mins) per year and I work on it an average 2 days per week. Either I've been very lucky or it's not really that bad.

 

[Russel]

No you weren't.

I am daily user of the WCML between MKC and London each way and don't recognise the issues many here post. From my daily user point of view it is not as bad as correspondents here want to make out. Yes, OBVISOULY, things go wrong and when they do it can take time to sort out but generally my journeys are fine. I have many more problems with the Marston Vale line than i do with the WCML!

You weren’t told that, though. You had made a similar claim to your first sentence above, and it was pointed at to you that 90% of WCML trains arrive within five minutes of booked.

Therefore presumably you’ve either been *incredibly* unlucky, or you’re complaining about delays/issues that haven’t affected you personally.

There are almost weekly threads on here about the WCML being in chaos, okay so it's not daily, but as it's one of the countries main rail routes, it simply isn't good enough...

When things do go wrong, at Euston especially, the staff vanish and those that are visible either aren't interested or give bad information.

I was caught up in disruption at Euston on June 21st and most recently on Monday evening, I was trying to get to Tamworth and the 19:46 had all of the trent valley stops removed, I asked a member of Avanti staff what the best plan of action was and he told me to get back on the 1946, stay on until Crewe and double back from there, the 1946 left Euston late and if it had picked up any more delays enroute, could have easily resulted in me missing the last train of the night off of Crewe back to Tamworth... I knew to ignore this poor advice but hundreds of others wouldn't!

 

[Tilting007]

There are almost weekly threads on here about the WCML being in chaos, okay so it's not daily, but as it's one of the countries main rail routes, it simply isn't good enough...

When things do go wrong, at Euston especially, the staff vanish and those that are visible either aren't interested or give bad information.

I was caught up in disruption at Euston on June 21st and most recently on Monday evening, I was trying to get to Tamworth and the 19:46 had all of the trent valley stops removed, I asked a member of Avanti staff what the best plan of action was and he told me to get back on the 1946, stay on until Crewe and double back from there, the 1946 left Euston late and if it had picked up any more delays enroute, could have easily resulted in me missing the last train of the night off of Crewe back to Tamworth... I knew to ignore this poor advice but hundreds of others wouldn't!

Strange advice, although the Avanti staff might not know if there is ticket acceptance.

 

[Russel]

Strange advice, although the Avanti staff might not know if there is ticket acceptance.

I'd say it's pretty poor advice really.

If the staff member didn't know, then it would be better to say that.