Class 450's on Guilford New Line, common?

[DaventryRabbit]

Hi
I notice today that 450028/42 are in service on one of the Guildford via Cobham diagrams. Is this a common occurance, its the first time I have seen a 450 on this line?

Cheers

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 5 Jul 2025 ==

Hi
I notice today that 450028/42 are in service on one of the Guildford via Cobham diagrams. Is this a common occurance, its the first time I have seen a 450 on this line?

Cheers

Edit
Just literally seen a second pair, 450090/54

 

[ctom_s]

I'm sure others with more information will be along shortly but with the withdrawal of the 455s and the rollout of the 701s, more 450s are ending up on the surburban lines now (been particularly noticeable over the last couple of months)

 

[DelW]

As well as suburban services, Portsmouth Direct trains run over the New Line in the weekday peaks and whenever Woking-Surbiton is closed, so Desiros have been running that way for a good many years.

 

[stadler]

The use of 450s on suburban services has become extremely common in recent years. It used to be very rare but now it happens every week. I think the withdrawal of all of the 456s and some of the 455s and 458s and the delay to the 701s has caused it. I have seen 450s working Guildford via Cobham and Guildford via Epsom and Dorking via Epsom services in recent months.

 

[Big Jumby 74]

Prior to the original 10 car suburban plan there were issues (platform length wise) with running 8 car 450's on New Line services at a couple of stations. Once the platforms had been lengthened/modified in relation to said 10 car plan, the running of 8 car 450's on the route was not a problem.

 

[NSE]

Yes, I was somewhat surprised to see how many are currently on the metro routes. Awaiting a service earlier on Platform 9, I saw three straight metro services working through Clapham Junction as 450’s. In fact, as one pulled in, a brace of 455’s working a Hampton Court fast shot through P9 and I did have a little double take seeing the 450 releasing its doors on a stopper as 455’s are going through non-stop. One for the bingo card there.

But back to the OP they seem to like the Guildford via Cobham diagrams the most, but the 450’s are also seen daily on Chessingtons, Hampton Courts etc. Not sure if they’re booked diagrams or can be operated by whichever cab comes off the depot rank first.

 

[Big Jumby 74]

Not sure if they’re booked diagrams or can be operated by whichever cab comes off the depot rank first.

Stock diagrams will be planned (to train/service), nothing is just by chance.

 

[Stephen42]

But back to the OP they seem to like the Guildford via Cobham diagrams the most, but the 450’s are also seen daily on Chessingtons, Hampton Courts etc. Not sure if they’re booked diagrams or can be operated by whichever cab comes off the depot rank first.

Plenty of booked diagrams for suburban work, there's a lot of interworking between Hampton Courts, Chessingtons and Guildfords. All metro routes have some booked 450 workings aside from Shepperton. Windsor is down to a couple of 450 workings in the current diagrams. Short term alterations sometimes increase the number of 450s as well.

 

[nw1]

As an aside until May 1984 the Cobham line was worked regularly by VEPs, which were effectively the predecessor to 450s. Being longer distance it used mainline stock while the inner suburbans barely had any; in those days the line was mostly self-contained or interworked with mainline routes.

Plenty of booked diagrams for suburban work, there's a lot of interworking between Hampton Courts, Chessingtons and Guildfords. All metro routes have some booked 450 workings aside from Shepperton. Windsor is down to a couple of 450 workings in the current diagrams. Short term alterations sometimes increase the number of 450s as well.

Interesting there are less on Windsors, I'd have expected 450s to be focused on the outer routes such as Windsor (and Guildford) rather than Hampton Court and Chessington but perhaps interworking patterns make that impossible.

 

[DaventryRabbit]

Thanks everyone for the detailed responses!

 

[TEW]

As an aside until May 1984 the Cobham line was worked regularly by VEPs, which were effectively the predecessor to 450s. Being longer distance it used mainline stock while the inner suburbans barely had any; in those days the line was mostly self-contained or interworked with mainline routes.



Interesting there are less on Windsors, I'd have expected 450s to be focused on the outer routes such as Windsor (and Guildford) rather than Hampton Court and Chessington but perhaps interworking patterns make that impossible.

Guildford via Epsom services interwork with Hampton Court, and Guildford via Cobham interwork with Chessington South and Woking. The Windsor route sees less 450s now because it's mainly 458/4, and they have very limited routes they can cover.

 

[Class15]

The use of 450s on suburban services has become extremely common in recent years. It used to be very rare but now it happens every week. I think the withdrawal of all of the 456s and some of the 455s and 458s and the delay to the 701s has caused it. I have seen 450s working Guildford via Cobham and Guildford via Epsom and Dorking via Epsom services in recent months.

I saw a pair of 450s on the Waterloo rounder via Kingston recently! Was very surprised!

 

[Bessie]

As a fairly new suffering commuter on Waterloo to Reading I'm not happy with this. I don't understand why surplus 450s don't work these services and we still have plenty of 455s making us bake on the 1 hour plus homeward journey!

 

[DelW]

As a fairly new suffering commuter on Waterloo to Reading I'm not happy with this. I don't understand why surplus 450s don't work these services and we still have plenty of 455s making us bake on the 1 hour plus homeward journey!

It's one of the many undesirable consequences of having sent the 707s off-lease long before the replacement 701s were available. The 455s should never have ended up working to Reading and it ought to be a priority to replace them on that route, either with 701s or 450s. Unfortunately SWR has never been responsive to passengers complaining about use of unsuitable stock.

 

[Big Jumby 74]

As a fairly new suffering commuter on Waterloo to Reading I'm not happy with this

I understand your POV, being someone myself who does not do heat/humidity very well at all. But having also been on the other side of the coin in the past (new train introduction), while the introduction of new trains (701's in this case) is in progress, every time an additional unit/units are introduced to service, this may have a knock on effect to diagrams (services) that other types of unit work in the suburban area (455/450), as a result of all types having to be in the correct places and in the correct numbers at close of play each night. New train introduction is never as simple as just slotting a new unit/diagram in to service without any impact on (some) other diagrams/services.
Until most of the 701's are in service, the overall allocation of unit types to diagrams/services is likely to be somewhat fluid from week to week/month to month.