But it's not the only option. These are the priority seats, not seats that are only for people with a disability and nobody will force such a person to sit there.
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Class 730/2 (LNR) experiences and opinions
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Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
In essence yes but there is far more length of tight pitch seats than on a 350. On a 350 there are 8 end sections, on a 730 there are only 6 and they are of similar size. Plus on a 350 one of the centre sections is lower density with two tables (I thought it was two but I just checked a TPE seating plan). Plus on the 730 the centre sections are longer. But then that's balanced with the first class actually being reasonable rather than being inferior to Standard.
It will be interesting to see how my views on them develop with more use. But my 350 seats of choice (priority with decent window view) don't seem to be present, whereas there are many such seats in a 350 to the point that I think I've sat in the tight middle section fewer than about 5 times ever.
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
Did a longer trip to Euston and most of my views stand. Sat in the "1st" area which is basically good Standard, basically the same as the 197. I did notice the ride was very smooth compared with a 350 on the same journey though like most stock they are smoother in the middle and rougher at the ends.
One noticeable issue was the ASDO not quite working properly. Elsewhere someone else mentioned that on the Euston approach you are warned of short platforms, this also happens at Apsley where the slow line platforms aren't short. And at Bletchley it was front unit only and not the rearmost door of that. The guard said that this was because the junction from the depot (rather than the carriage sidings) comes in a short way down the platform and so the rear coach could be a bit off, but it seems odd to lock out more than just the back coach or back two given that these units are ASDO capable. Or is there some sort of beacon issue so it's actually being done by GPS based on the possibility of being in platform 6?
One noticeable issue was the ASDO not quite working properly. Elsewhere someone else mentioned that on the Euston approach you are warned of short platforms, this also happens at Apsley where the slow line platforms aren't short. And at Bletchley it was front unit only and not the rearmost door of that. The guard said that this was because the junction from the depot (rather than the carriage sidings) comes in a short way down the platform and so the rear coach could be a bit off, but it seems odd to lock out more than just the back coach or back two given that these units are ASDO capable. Or is there some sort of beacon issue so it's actually being done by GPS based on the possibility of being in platform 6?
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
It is surprising - but I don't quite get why that requires locking out the rear 5 plus one door of the front 5 when it is ASDO so they could just lock out the back two? Or would the guard have manually done a unit deselect?
The unit was fully alongside the platform, but I can see why it might be too tight to guarantee the rear coach or two were, but not a whole unit.
Not sure what they're being told to do. I was under the impression it's the rear 2 coaches on a 10 that need to be locked out - it's been seen that they do automatically open as it's past the beacon but it's not actually on the correct track.
Same story as on the Cross-city then, rear doors locked out of use at certain stations for no apparent reason.
Currently unknown as Birmingham to Liverpool has been postponed. Crewe to Runcorn currently being used for staff training
How come it has been postponed?
As stated in the other 730 thread, the unions have not agreed to it on safety grounds. There have been several meetings to resolve this but the company/dft have yet to compromise on their position.
Kite159
Veteran Member
Tables are a bit on the small side compared to a 350, although legroom is good. Similar to the tables on the 196s.
Also I'm surprised there was no auto announcement about Watford Junction being the northern limit for Oyster cards.
Also I'm surprised there was no auto announcement about Watford Junction being the northern limit for Oyster cards.
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First trip on a LNWR 730 today (730233) between New Street and Wolverhampton. The seats in the declassified first class section are quite good, decently shaped and padded albeit there is practically no headrest, due to the lack of padding.
The addition of plug sockets/USB, 2+2 seating and tables are welcome compared to the 350/2s. Plenty of luggage racks and stacks. Ride quality is generally very good. Strange that the announcement cuts off after saying Runcorn, when the train calls at Liverpool South Parkway and Liverpool Lime Street.
The addition of plug sockets/USB, 2+2 seating and tables are welcome compared to the 350/2s. Plenty of luggage racks and stacks. Ride quality is generally very good. Strange that the announcement cuts off after saying Runcorn, when the train calls at Liverpool South Parkway and Liverpool Lime Street.
I travelled on the first diagram on Monday and the announcements stated front 3 coaches only on the approach to Crewe, however all of the doors opened so I assume it's just a bug with the PIS (or a "feature" where it announces the worst case scenario in case of a platform alteration) or the guard had manually overridden the ASDO to allow the doors in all 5 coaches to release? I managed to alight from the rearmost set of doors at Crewe.
Was manually overridden at several stations. Both trains did it at Crewe on Monday so it's clearly a software issue which I 'think' has been sorted (unfortunately I'm off work ATM so haven't seen any reports since Monday).
freetoview33
Established Member
Is there anywhere with a Class 730/2 seating layout?
778
Member
AJDesiro has made an accurate seating layout.
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Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
The legroom at the tables is good but the in centre section airline seats it's poor, like 350s. However unfortunately all the extra legroom airline seats bar one row in the middle coach and the "first class" bit are against blank walls
Remove just 20 seats per unit (4 per coach) and it'd be pretty generous. Shame they crammed them in to the extent they did.
The one thing I get from the 730/2 is they are far more suited to trings and mkc stoppers than the 350s, superior acceleration, the 350s tend to be better long distance also because doors take forever to open, personally would keep the 730/2s on tring, mkc and birmingham stoppers and keep the crewe service with 350s which are more comfortable and long distance suited, 730/2 also have the interior for short distance not long
I travelled on a 730/2 recently for the first time (730214 to be accurate), between Stafford and Crewe (was a Birmingham - Liverpool service).
My first impression was just how big and spacious the train felt, including big windows, lots of seats, and bright lighting. I liked the train information display on how/what level each carriage was in terms of capacity. Definitely feels like a new era train. The other thing that struck me was just how quick off the mark it was when leaving Stafford, very fast acceleration which felt great.
In terms of comfort though, I travelled in the normal standard class area/seats. The seats felt very thin and hard but tolerable for the journey I was taking, not sure how I would feel on a longer journey. They are much better then the 730/0s which are too small for someone my size.
The 350(/1, /3 and /4) seats are still to me far more comfortable to travel on longer journeys.
The fold down tables feel / are too small, I think I would prefer the 350 ones too, but at least the new ones are mobile phone / tablet friendly with the grooves.
I noticed the train was rattling and vibrating quite a lot which made the journey not too great, the 350 I travelled on in comparison on a previous journey was very smooth and hardly rattled at all and was unnoticeable , so for me the 350 wins here too.
I didn't get a chance to travel in the declassified first class bit so will need to give it another go and try this part next time.
Overall and as of now, I still prefer the 350s, but in comparison to the 350/2s, I think the 730/2s are a welcome addition and will certainly do a really good job with carrying lots more passengers on the routes it's destined for, especially London Euston - Crewe.
My first impression was just how big and spacious the train felt, including big windows, lots of seats, and bright lighting. I liked the train information display on how/what level each carriage was in terms of capacity. Definitely feels like a new era train. The other thing that struck me was just how quick off the mark it was when leaving Stafford, very fast acceleration which felt great.
In terms of comfort though, I travelled in the normal standard class area/seats. The seats felt very thin and hard but tolerable for the journey I was taking, not sure how I would feel on a longer journey. They are much better then the 730/0s which are too small for someone my size.
The 350(/1, /3 and /4) seats are still to me far more comfortable to travel on longer journeys.
The fold down tables feel / are too small, I think I would prefer the 350 ones too, but at least the new ones are mobile phone / tablet friendly with the grooves.
I noticed the train was rattling and vibrating quite a lot which made the journey not too great, the 350 I travelled on in comparison on a previous journey was very smooth and hardly rattled at all and was unnoticeable , so for me the 350 wins here too.
I didn't get a chance to travel in the declassified first class bit so will need to give it another go and try this part next time.
Overall and as of now, I still prefer the 350s, but in comparison to the 350/2s, I think the 730/2s are a welcome addition and will certainly do a really good job with carrying lots more passengers on the routes it's destined for, especially London Euston - Crewe.
1Y20 BHM-EUS when formed of Class 730s has been delayed leaving NMP a few times now, I experienced this a a couple of times last week, and then again today.
This is due to the train crew not being able to release the doors. Today the guard opened one door on the first carriage manually from the inside, and everyone had to board through there.
Another member of staff helping said this is due to the train's software after coupling not thinking it is safe to release the doors, and that the train would reset itself by the next stop, which it did.
This is due to the train crew not being able to release the doors. Today the guard opened one door on the first carriage manually from the inside, and everyone had to board through there.
Another member of staff helping said this is due to the train's software after coupling not thinking it is safe to release the doors, and that the train would reset itself by the next stop, which it did.
Kite159
Veteran Member
Just a shame there isn't a manual override option available for the train crew for cases like that (or even at Crewe when a southbound service arrives into platform 6 but the train defaults to front 3 coaches only, causing delays)
That's a signalling issue tbh, if the signaller would just path the train across the first set of points it will pass over the RFID beacon and all doors will open. For some reason they don't want to do so and NR are refusing to allow the beacon to be moved so it's now a stalemate.
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
Interesting, so these units use ASDO beacons, presumably having seen one overrides it defaulting to the shortest platform at that station, hence why when a unit comes off the depot into Bletchley P5 it doesn't pass the platform end beacon and so defaults to front 5 minus one door, which is presumably what would fit in 6, the shortest platform? Thanks. I did wonder why it was specifically that - I could understand one full unit being done manually but it is front unit minus the rearmost door.
Correct. If the train doesn't pass over an RFID it reverts to it's failsafe which is the shortest platform at that station.
There are other issues going on at other stations such as Acton Bridge and Liv South Parkway where the database has shorter lengths than can actually fit (parkway due to an SX board being added after the platform lengths were allocated), and there is also a GPS backup too.
Crewe platform 6 is frustrating as the conductor can still arm the doors from the back cab (as it's easily on the platform) but they can't override the ASDO so the rear 2 coaches won't arm, and they can't be opened by the Guard Operating Panel either.
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
Just to clarify, what is "arming" the doors? Is it now a two step process, arm then release?
Sorry, arming is releasing.
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