Flixtrain has ordered 65 Talgo 230 high-speed trains

[U-Bahnfreund]

Flix, the company behind Flixbus and Flixtrain, have ordered 65 Talgo 230 trainsets, the same as the ICE L that DB and DSB ordered. The volume is EUR 2.4 billion, with 30 units worth EUR 1.06 billion firmly committed.

The locomotives will not come from Talgo, instead these will be provided by Siemens

Press release Flix: https://corporate.flix.com/press_re...as-ordered-65-new-european-high-speed-trains/
Press release Talgo: https://www.talgo.com/en/flix-award...enance-of-up-to-65-european-high-speed-trains

 

[ainsworth74]

These replace their existing locohauled rakes I take it?

 

[43096]

Flix, the company behind Flixbus and Flixtrain, have ordered 65 Talgo 230 trainsets, the same as the ICE L that DB and DSB ordered. The volume is EUR 2.4 billion, with 30 units worth EUR 1.06 billion firmly committed.

The locomotives will not come from Talgo, instead these will be provided by Siemens

Press release Flix: https://corporate.flix.com/press_re...as-ordered-65-new-european-high-speed-trains/
Press release Talgo: https://www.talgo.com/en/flix-award...enance-of-up-to-65-european-high-speed-trains

There is a bit of a discrepancy in the Flix press release as the order - based on the Talgo statement - is for 30 sets confirmed plus another 35 on option.

Interesting that Flix have de-risked the order by using proven Siemens Vectrons rather than Talgo locos. Presumably these are the 230km/h version, similar to those ČD has on order.

 

[superalbs]

Cheap tat for the budget operator. It makes sense, but I certainly won't be rushing to travelling on them.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Cheap tat for the budget operator. It makes sense, but I certainly won't be rushing to travelling on them.

Wonder will they go for a 3+2 interior in these ones?

I agree they are cheap tat, though, those Spanish ones must be vying for the prize of the worst long distance modern rolling stock in Europe.

 

[AdamWW]

Wonder will they go for a 3+2 interior in these ones?

The 3+2 Talgo interiors are with extra-wide coaches though, aren't they?

 

[Bletchleyite]

The 3+2 Talgo interiors are with extra-wide coaches though, aren't they?

They are, but that's RENFE (for their premium operations, not just their budget ones) and this is Flix, a rock bottom cheap budget operation where price is basically the only factor.

 

[stadler]

A shame they have gone for Talgo stock. They are one of my least favourite trains. They always feel so cheap and have such poor ride quality. I think the weird arrangement of the wheels probably contributes to the poor ride quality.

 

[Bletchleyite]

A shame they have gone for Talgo stock. They are one of my least favourite trains. They always feel so cheap and have such poor ride quality.

They are cheap, that's why they've been selected

I think the weird arrangement of the wheels probably contributes to the poor ride quality.

It's basically a fancy Pacer. Rides like silk on German track (as apparently did Pacers on test on the WCML), but on that of any inferior country (in infrastructure terms) it's indeed terrible.

 

[superalbs]

Wonder will they go for a 3+2 interior in these ones?

I agree they are cheap tat, though, those Spanish ones must be vying for the prize of the worst long distance modern rolling stock in Europe.

Supposedly 2.9m wide, so very much possible by UK standards...

However, in Kazakhstan they only went for 2+2 seating, despite being an extra-wide bodyshell of 2.95m.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 27 May 2025 ==

They are cheap, that's why they've been selected



It's basically a fancy Pacer. Rides like silk on German track (as apparently did Pacers on test on the WCML), but on that of any inferior country (in infrastructure terms) it's indeed terrible.

They're even terrible on Spanish HSR, which is a pretty poor show to be honest. Some lines are better than others though, and indeed Madrid-Malaga on an S102 was somewhat tolerable for a trip of that length.

The smoothest Talgo I've ever had was one of the 40yr old ones on a classic line in Spain. Make that make sense.

 

[43096]

Cheap tat for the budget operator. It makes sense, but I certainly won't be rushing to travelling on them.

But gone for the reliable option for traction.

 

[superalbs]

But gone for the reliable option for traction.

Probably a wise decision. How late are the Danish ones?

 

[43096]

Probably a wise decision. How late are the Danish ones?

The Danes have gone for the same combination as Flix, so have not ordered Talgo locos. The Talgo stock is late, but Siemens delivered the locos on time (actually early for the first deliveries).

 

[HS2isgood]

When we send trains we do not send our best lol. I don't exactly like my country being known for crap trains and broken trams.

 

[Trainbike46]

When we send trains we do not send our best lol. I don't exactly like my country being known for crap trains and broken trams.

The CAF SNG for NS were pretty good, no? NS decided to order new IC stock in the same family, so if there were/are issues it was not sufficient for NS to not order more of them.

It's basically a fancy Pacer. Rides like silk on German track (as apparently did Pacers on test on the WCML), but on that of any inferior country (in infrastructure terms) it's indeed terrible.

Of course, these will be operating on German track, so maybe not too much of an issue?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Of course, these will be operating on German track, so maybe not too much of an issue?

Quite possibly not an issue indeed. I've been on the old DB InterCityNight Talgo sleepers twice, once in a seat and once in a couchette, and the ride was silky smooth. Along similar lines I think the ICE-L will be fine too.

 

[AdamWW]

The CAF SNG for NS were pretty good, no? NS decided to order new IC stock in the same family, so if there were/are issues it was not sufficient for NS to not order more of them.

As this was presumably a public procurement I doubt there would be an overt mechanism for refusing the bid that was best on paper.

That's not to say that the bid requirements might not have been angled towards or away from a particular bidder.

 

[Trainbike46]

As this was presumably a public procurement I doubt there would be an overt mechanism for refusing the bid that was best on paper.

That's not to say that the bid requirements might not have been angled towards or away from a particular bidder.

It was a public procurement, but if there were major issues with the SNG I'm sure they would have come up with a to make another CAF win unlikely.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 28 May 2025 ==

Or do what Jersey did and just cancel the procurement entirely if the outcome isn't what you wanted

 

[dutchflyer]

Wonder will they go for a 3+2 interior in these ones?

I agree they are cheap tat, though, those Spanish ones must be vying for the prize of the worst long distance modern rolling stock in Europe.

I suspect -and in fact this FLIX is not at all just aiming ultra-cheap travel, that a variety of ´classes´ but not labelled as 1st/2nd etc. will be on offer. Or even that they pre-plan and make them easy to change in seating if they find that demand is different as now predicted. There still is in DE=Germany a quite big market for very cheap longer distance travel in 1 go-bypassing the using multiple slow trains on the DE-ticket. Also often for small or school-groups etc. In fact comparable for a large part to the CZech based RegioJet, who also runs its own private trains in CZechia and SK=Slovakia (used them in its premium ´business´ last week and was pleasantly surprised by it, even it was also refurbished older coaches).
Also be aware-do I really need to tell this to those many railwayworkers here on this site?-that ride-quality is also for a large part set by the standard of the tracks. Plus that width of coaches is also limited by national standards.
Alltogether quite a big and innovative initiative to challenge the factual still near-monopoly of those burocratic state-owned mega-railways.

 

[StephenHunter]

Do Flixtrain still have those ex-DR carriages where they put WiFi in the former steam heating compartment?