TfW class 398 Stadler Citylink tram trains

[Peter Sarf]

They're wraps, aren't they? They've got wrinkles, and the left and right edges of them don't exactly match up with the left and right edges of the bumpers, and it's possible to see the way the holes were cut for the lights.

I wonder what the actual plan for changing the lights to the spec required for not requiring the yellow fronts is, and what progress (if any) is being made with that?
.......................

I will throw in the possibility of a yet to be agreed derogation on the lights/yellow-front ?.

 

[MikePJ]

The May 2025 edition of Rail Express has a short article about 398 testing. It says that the 398 test runs are now being used to familiarise instructors with driving the trains.

"The first unit to be involved in the testing was 398005. The testing will allow driver-trainers to gain experience on the trains before the full driver training programme begins later in the year. "

A later section says

"...it is planned for the units to enter service between Cardiff Central to Merthyr, Aberdare and Treherbert later this year. Once sufficient Class 398s are in service the Class 231 DMUs and Class 756 bi-modes currently used will be cascaded to other routes."

 

[chargesmith]

"...it is planned for the units to enter service between Cardiff Central to Merthyr, Aberdare and Treherbert later this year. Once sufficient Class 398s are in service the Class 231 DMUs and Class 756 bi-modes currently used will be cascaded to other routes."

Probably splitting hairs here but I thought they were going to start on the Cardiff Bay to Pontypridd services?

 

[MikePJ]

Probably splitting hairs here but I thought they were going to start on the Cardiff Bay to Pontypridd services?

That was certainly the plan a while back. There's still a lot of work going on to upgrade the Bay line (it's got one set of overhead wires now, but is still waiting for the second track to be laid, the pointwork, and the second set of wires, not to mention all the junction upgrades that are supposed to happen at Queen St) so it's possible that plans have changed. It's also entirely possible that Rail Express's journalist has mangled the facts.

 

[ExRes]

Possible move tonight/tomorrow? RailAdventure schedules on RTT 2100 6V37 Kings Norton OTPD to Pengam Sdgs, 0237 7Q38 to Kings Norton and 0825 7Q39 to Old Dalby

 

[StripeyNick]

Possible move tonight/tomorrow? RailAdventure schedules on RTT 2100 6V37 Kings Norton OTPD to Pengam Sdgs, 0237 7Q38 to Kings Norton and 0825 7Q39 to Old Dalby

Cancelled apparently

 

[ExRes]

Cancelled apparently

Thanks, not filtered through to RTT or Rail Record as yet

 

[StripeyNick]

Thanks, not filtered through to RTT or Rail Record as yet

I got that from someone on one of the South Wales groups......a chap who works for GBRf and has been involved in some moves posted that so I'd take it as a credible source

 

[ExRes]

I got that from someone on one of the South Wales groups......a chap who works for GBRf and has been involved in some moves posted that so I'd take it as a credible source

Looks as though they were dead right, 2100 6V37 was activated the dreaded 3 hours before departure and hasn't moved ** and subsequently cancelled **

 

[MikePJ]

There’s a piece in Modern Railways describing the plan for the introduction of the 398s.

On 22 May, Dan Tipper, TfW Chief Infrastructure Officer, said the initial phase had been completed, which entailed making sure the vehicles worked with the infrastructure. “Right now we’ve got proving runs going on, and have for the last six weeks or so,” he said.

Two units have achieved well over 3,500 miles of fault-free running and the other units would need to achieve 1,500 miles each, he said. “What then follows is finalising the driver training package and agreeing that with our trade union partners and then we implement the training programme.”

Approximately eight senior drivers would be trained initially to test the training programme and then to roll out training to the remainder of the Valleys’ approximately 350 drivers. Train Manager training will also follow later.

They also explain the plan for the cascade:

Roughly half of the CVL drivers will need to be trained on the ‘398s’ before the first units go into passenger service. TfW is aiming for approximately five to enter service initially, enabling swapping out of Class 756 tri-mode units which are operating temporarily on the Treherbert, Aberdare and Merthyr Tydfil lines until electrification is completed on the Rhymney line.

There’s also a note that the Bay line will close to passengers to allow the drivers to be trained on the line-of-site driving once the new signalling has been installed. No date is given for this.

 

[tigermonstera]

There’s also a note that the Bay line will close to passengers to allow the drivers to be trained on the line-of-site driving once the new signalling has been installed. No date is given for this.

The most recent date that I've seen comes from TfW's board minutes from April 2024 (link) which state that:

The CAR 1 commissioning blockade (Queen St, Bay Line and remaining elements of CAR 1 footprint) is being booked for Oct/Nov 2025.

However, this date could have changed since then.

 

[MikePJ]

The most recent date that I've seen comes from TfW's board minutes from April 2024 (link) which state that:

However, this date could have changed since then.

Thanks! That was supposed to take place in April 2025 so has slipped back six months. I was beginning to get concerned that there wasn't any progress on this.

Relatedly, TfW are being really sloppy with their board minutes - none of the 2025 ones are online.

 

[CapitalStar378]

I'm assuming that as half on the CVL drivers (175) are required to be trained before the 398s enter service, this means that it may be some time yet until their introduction. Unless it's a short course!

 

[MikePJ]

I'm assuming that as half on the CVL drivers (175) are required to be trained before the 398s enter service, this means that it may be some time yet until their introduction. Unless it's a short course!

TfW were previously talking about entry in "late 2025", so assuming that they mean "at the timetable change on Dec 14th", that gives 23 weeks from now until then. To train 175 drivers in that time means doing between 7 and 8 drivers per week on average.

 

[Bob Price]

TfW were previously talking about entry in "late 2025", so assuming that they mean "at the timetable change on Dec 14th", that gives 23 weeks from now until then. To train 175 drivers in that time means doing between 7 and 8 drivers per week on average.

Remembering there is the six week summer blockade on the Rhumney line, I wonder if they will have a good go then. Does anyone know how long it takes to get a driver up to speed and signed off?

Also if the initial plan is Cardiff Bay to Pontypridd for the 398's do they need all of them trained by December?

 

[MikePJ]

Also if the initial plan is Cardiff Bay to Pontypridd for the 398's do they need all of them trained by December?

That was the plan quite a while ago but I wouldn’t be so sure it’ll work out that way now. It may be that they come in as direct substitutions for 756s on one of the TAM routes.

 

[positron]

Aiming for Bay running would explain why they're electrifying a single bay line track before finishing the second one. Else they'd presumably have waited for that.

 

[MikePJ]

Aiming for Bay running would explain why they're electrifying a single bay line track before finishing the second one. Else they'd presumably have waited for that.

You are correct! The new project plan shows that 398s are due to start on the Cardiff Bay - Pontypridd service around 8th November.

 

[BillStampy]

Possible move tonight/tomorrow? RailAdventure schedules on RTT 2100 6V37 Kings Norton OTPD to Pengam Sdgs, 0237 7Q38 to Kings Norton and 0825 7Q39 to Old Dalby

Similar thing tomorrow, although this time around there's a path in from Taffs Well Depot down to Pengam.

 

[ExRes]

Similar thing tomorrow, although this time around there's a path in from Taffs Well Depot down to Pengam.

Yes thanks, I noticed the 6V37 Kings Norton to Pengam Sdgs and 6Q38 on to Old Dalby schedules but nothing showing after that as yet, the Taffs Well path does make it a little bit more likely to run this time

* Update * 2039 6G29 Old Dalby to Kings Norton now showing for tomorrow, looking good to go

 

[StripeyNick]

398028 has been delivered this afternoon.....well, it's been photographed nearby awaiting access to Taffs Well depot

 

[The_Train]

Are 023-027 now built and delivered as well or are we out of sequence?

 

[alm37]

Yes thanks, I noticed the 6V37 Kings Norton to Pengam Sdgs and 6Q38 on to Old Dalby schedules but nothing showing after that as yet, the Taffs Well path does make it a little bit more likely to run this time

* Update * 2039 6G29 Old Dalby to Kings Norton now showing for tomorrow, looking good to go

398019 passing through Cardiff Central at 10.00 en route Taffs Well Depot to Pengam Sidings.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 8 Jul 2025 ==

Are 023-027 now built and delivered as well or are we out of sequence?

Confirm 023 and 027 are at Taffs Well this morning. Believe 024 and 025 are at Old Dalby. 026 has been reported as being at Taffs Well but couldn’t see it myself today.

 

[The_Train]

398019 passing through Cardiff Central at 10.00 en route Taffs Well Depot to Pengam Sidings.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 8 Jul 2025 ==


Confirm 023 and 027 are at Taffs Well this morning. Believe 024 and 025 are at Old Dalby. 026 has been reported as being at Taffs Well but couldn’t see it myself today.

Thanks @alm37

Anyone got any rough dates for when 019 and then 023-027 arrived at Taffs Well please?

 

[StripeyNick]

I haven't seen any reports to say that 026 has arrived

 

[Pinza68]

Thanks @alm37

Anyone got any rough dates for when 019 and then 023-027 arrived at Taffs Well please?

This may be very rough dates
023 seen at Taff Wells 31/01/24
024 delivered to Old Dalby 3/2
025 delivered to Old Dalby 10/2
026 seen at Taff Wells 24/6
027 delivered to Taff Wells 24/2
026 looked like it hadn't been there long, as it was round the side next to the Dual carriageway

 

[tigermonstera]

Looks like a Class 398 will be at The Greatest Gathering:

We’re thrilled to announce our next exhibit as a Class 398 courtesy of Transport for Wales will be on display at our three day event, subject to operational availability.

(Source)

 

[J663738]

Looks like a Class 398 will be at The Greatest Gathering:

It would be nice if they were in use to passengers on the Metro, rather than used as exhibits.

The TfW 'guide to our fleet of trains' had them down to be introduced in 2023.

 

[Dai Corner]

It would be nice if they were in use to passengers on the Metro, rather than used as exhibits.

The TfW 'guide to our fleet of trains' had them down to be introduced in 2023.

"TfW apologise that this service is cancelled due to fewer than the expected number of fleets being brought into service"

 

[Envoy]

What is stopping them starting to use the 398’s on say the Pontypridd to Cardiff Bay service?