Fair Evasion Prosecution - South Western Railway

[led210]

Last week I was stopped and given a Report for Prosecution receipt for short faring. I was stopped as they advised my ticket had not been scanned at the nearer station. I had initially tried to cover myself but the officer threatened to turn on his body camera and make it a criminal case. My story is the usual story that I am having financial difficulty and commuting is extremely expensive and the trains are very overcrowded meaning you pay ridiculous money to stand. I have short fared for an extended period (maybe over 1 year) and I assume they will be able to see this on the train line record. Will they be able to know all previous travel was short faring as they would not have been scanned at the departing station?

This experience has left me very shaken and I feel very embarrassed and ashamed. I will never do anything like this again but am worried about the outcome of a potential criminal record. Can anyone advise me of the next steps and likely outcome?

 

[Cuthbert]

Hello there,
People that help here will need more information.
The train company used, where you travelled from and to and what you actually paid for.
Any paper work that they gave up if you can upload this to the forum but please redact all of your information and the case/reference number.

They will check your purchasing history and send you a spread sheet of all the trips they think you evaded.
You have then the chance to say yes or no with proof.

They will normally charge a standard single fare for the full trip per journey so if you travelled and returned they will want two standard singles.

They normally do not discount tickets already paid for or allow any rail cards.

Others will write here to help you more.

 

[willontrains]

Will they be able to know all previous travel was short faring as they would not have been scanned at the departing station?

I have short fared for an extended period (maybe over 1 year) and I assume they will be able to see this on the train line record

I do not believe that Trainline would handover any data in regards to previous tickets - unless you gave them your trainline account number etc? (Moderator note: this is incorrect)

Instead of Short Faring I'd always recommend looking into a season pass, using railcards and any other discounts which may be relevant to you

 

[Cuthbert]

The "Report for Prosecution receipt for short faring" is for the individual short faring not all of the previous ones?



I do not believe that Trainline would handover any data in regards to previous tickets - unless you gave them your trainline account number etc?

Instead of Short Faring I'd always recommend looking into a season pass, using railcards and any other discounts which may be relevant to you

The revenue guys said the ticket was not scanned at the nearer station. I assume they found this out by scanning the ticket themselves which will give this information.

Now they have the scanned ticket they can request Trainline to give the account details.

 

[willontrains]

The revenue guys said the ticket was not scanned at the nearer station. I assume they found this out by scanning the ticket themselves which will give this information.

Now they have the scanned ticket they can request Trainline to give the account details.

Do you remember if they said they would investigate if this had happened previously?

the officer threatened to turn on his body camera and make it a criminal case

Did they end up turning the bodycam on? It seems extremely manipulative.

 

[Cuthbert]

If you read these forums you will see this is the norm.

 

[led210]

Thanks so much it’s nice to discuss this. I don’t believe they put their body cam on but they did take a photo of my ID and of my train line account which I think showed about 10 or so tickets from the same station of origin. This was South Western Railway

 

[methecooldude]

I do not believe that Trainline would handover any data in regards to previous tickets - unless you gave them your trainline account number etc?

Trainline will provide purchase history to TOCs that request it, as allowed not only by the GDPR (for the detection and prevention of crime) and Trainline's own terms and conditions which anyone who uses their platform to buy a ticket accepts when purchasing. As @Knoodlepot mentions, all that's needed is the scan of the ticket, mainly the ticket reference, this is linked to the account.

 

[AlterEgo]

This experience has left me very shaken and I feel very embarrassed and ashamed. I will never do anything like this again but am worried about the outcome of a potential criminal record. Can anyone advise me of the next steps and likely outcome?

Which stations are involved, and where were you stopped? Please also note we need the following to be able to give detailed advice:

• The stations* where you actually started & finished your journey
• The stations* where you changed trains (if applicable);
• If you presented a ticket(s), the information* stated under "Ticket type", "From", "To", "Route", and any other relevant details;
• Details of any Railcard(s) held;
• When and where ticket(s) were purchased, including whether this was prior to the journey commencing;
• What happened in any encounter with railway staff;
• Upload copies of any paperwork (with personal details redacted) with your post.

 

[skyhigh]

I do not believe that Trainline would handover any data in regards to previous tickets - unless you gave them your trainline account number etc?

Total rubbish. They frequently do. The train operator can get all the data they need to investigate purchase history from any eTicket number.

This second of the forum is for giving factual advice to people seeking assistance. Not giving advice based on "well I think..."

 

[led210]

The travel for the previous offences were from Hinchley Wood to London Waterloo but a ticket to Vauxhall was purchased instead.

Then recently a move of address has meant travel from Woking to London Waterloo in which a ticket from Woking to West Byfleet was purchased to get through barriers at Woking and then a further ticket for Vauxhall to London Waterloo.

It was the Vauxhall to London Waterloo ticket that was flagged but I confessed I had travelled from Woking.

 

[Haywain]

I do not believe that Trainline would handover any data in regards to previous tickets

You're new around here, aren't you? Please read the threads for a while before posting so that you can see what happens in the real world.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 30 Jan 2025 ==

The travel for the previous offences were from Hinchley Wood to London Waterloo but a ticket to Vauxhall was purchased instead.

So, this isn't the first time you've been caught doing this?

 

[led210]

You're new around here, aren't you? Please read the threads for a while before posting so that you can see what happens in the real world.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 30 Jan 2025 ==


So, this isn't the first time you've been caught doing this?

No this was the first time being caught but I have short fared before

 

[Titfield]

No this was the first time being caught but I have short fared before

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 30 Jan 2025 ==

What are the chances of going to court?

If you engage with the Train Operator, are contrite and acknowledge the wrong doing then there is a good probability that the TOC will offer you an out of court settlement for the fares avoided (at full fare rate and with no offset of the fares paid already)plus an admin fee of C£120 - £200.

You will need to wait until the TOC writes to you before responding. If you upload the letter when received with all personal details and reference number obscured, forum members will give you detailed advice as to how to respond (ie what to say and what not to say).

 

[Snow1964]

No this was the first time being caught but I have short fared before

What are the chances of going to court?

If they have taken a photo of multiple similar journeys, then you are going to have to engage with them when they write to you. This letter could be anything upto 6 months (but is typically 4-6 weeks).

They could take you to court (it's their choice, not your decision), but if you apologise and agree to pay a settlement offer (it's an offer instead of going to court) then the settlement is instead of court. But bear in mind your history, if you have lots of iffy journeys could easily be few hundred or even couple of thousand pounds in missed fares they ask for. So start saving as will only get a short period to pay up, and will need to pay in one go, if you are given an offer and accept it to keep it out of court

If you decline to pay offer (or they feel you are not engaging) a court could add a criminal conviction, and fine and victim surcharge to compensation amount (if found guilty, which on evidence so far appears to be case).

There is not a lot you can do until they write to you, apart from looking into raising funds to cover missed fares.

 

[led210]

I was just hoping to get a general idea of what people’s experiences have been with SWR. Do people usually end up in court with criminal records for circumstances where short faring has occurred multiple times? Thanks

 

[Titfield]

I was just hoping to get a general idea of what people’s experiences have been with SWR. Do people usually end up in court with criminal records for circumstances where short faring has occurred multiple times? Thanks

Not normally no. The key seems to be engagement, honesty and contrition (as well as paying the offered out of court settlement). Forum members occasionally see "industrial scale" fare evasion which, perhaps surprisingly, is still settled out of court.

 

[led210]

Thanks appreciate the advice

 

[WesternLancer]

Thanks appreciate the advice

The only way to guarantee ending up in court is usually to ignore them after you’ve been caught. Engage and every chance you can avoid court.

 

[HelpWithAMista]

Last week I was stopped and given a Report for Prosecution receipt for short faring. I was stopped as they advised my ticket had not been scanned at the nearer station. I had initially tried to cover myself but the officer threatened to turn on his body camera and make it a criminal case. My story is the usual story that I am having financial difficulty and commuting is extremely expensive and the trains are very overcrowded meaning you pay ridiculous money to stand. I have short fared for an extended period (maybe over 1 year) and I assume they will be able to see this on the train line record. Will they be able to know all previous travel was short faring as they would not have been scanned at the departing station?

This experience has left me very shaken and I feel very embarrassed and ashamed. I will never do anything like this again but am worried about the outcome of a potential criminal record. Can anyone advise me of the next steps and likely outcome?

Hi Led210,

I hope your case is going well. I find myself in a similar situation and thought I'd let you know that I haven't heard from SWR yet in case you were in the same situation and panicking like me.

I hope this helps

 

[led210]

I have received the following from SWR. Please could you advise how best to respond and how much information to give. Should I just respond with the railcard details or give them all the info about fair evasion history?

We kindly ask for your cooperation by providing any current and historical railcards since the … , including their start and expiry dates. You can access this information by logging into your railcard account on the railcard website here:Login (railcard.co.uk) , or your Trainline account here: (Digital Railcards : Trainline Customer Service | Help, Support and FAQs (thetrainline.com) , or if you purchased your railcard through another provider, please contact that provider. If no Railcard was held, please explicitly state this.



Please do not ignore this communication. Assistance and guidance can be obtained on the internet and from the Citizens Advice Service, here: https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/. You may also wish to seek independent legal advice.



South Western Railway takes fare evasion and fraud very seriously. If you fail to respond, this matter may proceed to court, and formal proceedings may follow.



As part of the investigation, you may also provide mitigation regarding your travel history which will be forwarded onto our Prosecutions Team, who review each case individually.

 

[alholmes]

Have you received this in connection with a specific journey where you’ve been stopped for a potential ticketing irregularity? Or is it a letter that’s arrived completely unprompted?

 

[led210]

Have you received this in connection with a specific journey where you’ve been stopped for a potential ticketing irregularity? Or is it a letter that’s arrived completely unprompted

Yes I was stopped on a particular journey where I had short fared but I have also previously short fared.

 

[alholmes]

Ok, so that you can receive best advise you’re going to need to provide more information.

We need to know all relevant facts in order to assist you, including, for example:

• The stations where you actually started & finished your journey
• The stations where you changed trains (if applicable);
• If you presented a ticket(s), the information* stated under "Ticket type", "From", "To", "Route", and any other relevant details;
• Details of any Railcard(s) held;
• When and where ticket(s) were purchased, including whether this was prior to the journey commencing;
• What happened in any encounter with railway staff;
• Upload copies of any paperwork (with personal details redacted) with your post.

 

[jfollows]

Yes, as @alholmes says, please read https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/please-read-before-posting-in-disputes-prosecutions.77759/ also.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

I have received the following from SWR. Please could you advise how best to respond and how much information to give. Should I just respond with the railcard details or give them all the info about fair evasion history?

We kindly ask for your cooperation by providing any current and historical railcards since the … , including their start and expiry dates. You can access this information by logging into your railcard account on the railcard website here:Login (railcard.co.uk) , or your Trainline account here: (Digital Railcards : Trainline Customer Service | Help, Support and FAQs (thetrainline.com) , or if you purchased your railcard through another provider, please contact that provider. If no Railcard was held, please explicitly state this.



Please do not ignore this communication. Assistance and guidance can be obtained on the internet and from the Citizens Advice Service, here: https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/. You may also wish to seek independent legal advice.



South Western Railway takes fare evasion and fraud very seriously. If you fail to respond, this matter may proceed to court, and formal proceedings may follow.



As part of the investigation, you may also provide mitigation regarding your travel history which will be forwarded onto our Prosecutions Team, who review each case individually.

Is this from the same incident as you posted about back in January in https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/fair-evasion-prosecution-south-western-railway.280936/? If so, we can ask the moderators to merge the threads so that everything is in one place and it's easier for everyone to understand.

 

[Hadders]

Moderator Note: I've merged a couple of threads started by @led210 as they seem to refer to the same incident so that discussion relating to the case is in one place.

 

[30907]

As they specifically ask about your railcard you could start by giving them the details (I assume you had one at all relevant times?) but say that you will be happy to clarify matters further.

If you didn't have a railcard, a search for posts by Hadders you will soon find one in which he suggests some points to make in replying, but again I would be cautious in admitting to short faring when they apparently haven't picked that up from the original incident.

 

[led210]

Hi

I’m currently dealing with SWR for historical fare evasion.

I had been emailing with an investigator at SWR and sent him all the information he requested including a spreadsheet that set out all the fares etc. he then said the information was going to be passed on to the prosecutor for final decision.

Two weeks later I have now received a letter from the prosecutor which states that the letter is not a request for payment and I need to respond to the letter in 21days which requests my personal contact information etc.

Does this mean they will prosecute?

 

[notmyrealname]

Hi.

Is this the same issue you posted about earlier in the year? Please show us the letter, with personal details and any reference numbers redacted. It could be that they're still considering what to do and need more information from you, it's not uncommon.