Stopped whilst using fake railcard

[Sharif94]

Hi all,

I’m new here and just seeking some advice regarding a situation I’ve unfortunately found myself in with Avanti West Coast. I was recently stopped and informed that the 26–30 Railcard I was using appeared to be invalid and expired even though it appears in date hence possibly altered. This came as a shock to me.

To give context, I had renewed the railcard through an upload QR code circulating uni which allowed you to input your details and upload a screenshot or image and then you were sent the up to date card. At the time it was sold at £25. At the time, others from uni were also talking about it, so I thought it was simply a good value offer —especially if it did the same thing as the official railcard (which may have been stupid to assume)

Image had been checked on the prior outgoing journey with no issue. I don’t travel on the train much uni and hadn’t downloaded the Railcard app, so I didn’t take much thought into it and actually didn’t realise there was a problem until It was scanned and was told it had supposedly expired. Train manager also mentioned that if it’s not on the app it’s not valid which no one has informed me of that prior.

I’ll be honest — at the back of my mind, I did wonder if this was a genuine route at the time about as was unusual but I assumed everything was in order as was reassured that it was just a student offer and didn’t take more thought into it as I should’ve as per my own due diligence.

As soon as I became aware of the issue on the train, which was when I was told it was expired and couldn’t log in to Railcard UK,

I :

• Bought a new valid 26–30 Railcard immediately
• Sent an email to the official Railcard helpdesk to if there’s account with my email - just for my personal information. Still awaiting a reply.

I have no previous offences of any kind and I’m taking this very seriously as the more I think about it the more I realise how stupid it was of a mistake to trust a link and how stupid it was to not go through the most official channel given the difference was basically nothing.

My question is:
- Has anyone had experience with similar railcard-related

- Could this go to court and what do I need to provide if it gets to that ?

- What’s the likelihood of Avanti being understanding and resolve it ?

- How long does it take to receive a response- as the train manager didn’t take any details just a picture of the railcard screenshot and reported someone will get in contact to get more information

Should I contact them first or wait for formal correspondence?

I’d appreciate any advice or shared experiences, especially around how these cases are typically handled.

Thanks in advance for your time.

 

[Adam Williams]

To give context, I had renewed the railcard through an upload QR code circulating uni which allowed you to input your details and upload a screenshot or image and then you were sent the up to date card. At the time it was sold at £25. At the time, others from uni were also talking about it, so I thought it was simply a good value offer —especially if it did the same thing as the official railcard (which may have been stupid to assume)

Out of interest, do you still have the barcode and/or details of the payment you made (and the merchant it was made to) on your bank statement?

 

[AlterEgo]

You also need to go to the police about getting defrauded. Obviously someone's doing some photoshops for £25, nice little earner. There's no other explanation.

 

[John R]

- How long does it take to receive a response- as the train manager didn’t take any details just a picture of the railcard screenshot and reported someone will get in contact to get more information

Did he scan your ticket? If so then they will be able to contact you through the online platform you used to purchase the ticket. If not, and they didn't take Name and Address then I doubt they would be able to contact you through the railcard screenshot, as it won't be linked to you.

How many tickets have you used using this fraudulent railcard? You will very likely be asked to pay again for all those journeys, at the full Anytime Single fare for each journey, which if you have done long distance travel could be very expensive. You'll also be asked to pay an admin fee, which is typically £150, but does vary. That's if you are offered a settlement, instead of being prosecuted. Settlement is usually offered, but this is clearly a more unusual case, as it appears to be a well thought out fraud, so I would imagine Avanti will take a closer interest in it than cases where a railcard has expired (or even where one has been selected where no railcard has ever been held.)

 

[WesternLancer]

You also need to go to the police about getting defrauded. Obviously someone's doing some photoshops for £25, nice little earner. There's no other explanation.

I agree with this. It might help persuade avanti not to take further action (in terms of prosecuting the op for example) against the op if the op can show a crime report number for this matter. Ie that the op has done something active / serious about this.

The OP has potentially been defrauded of the railcard price they were asked for but also probably become liable for the much greater sum of replacement tickets that Avanti may well (quite likley?) charge them for - that could result in a substantial sum being asked for by Avanti.

 

[Adam Williams]

It's probably worth contacting the bank as well. There ought to be a chargeback and potentially a subsequent follow-up complaint to the payment provider, if you can work out which one is involved

 

[Ben Rhydding]

Avanti website on subject of Revenue Protection

We will only prosecute ....... if it would be in the public interest and in the interest of justice to prosecute.

If the OP has been the victim of fraud, it would be very difficult to see how a prosecution could satisfy Avanti`s published prosecutions policy.

Likewise, a demand for an out of court settlement against the threat of prosecution should also fail.

But the OP must report the crime of which he has been victim

 

[John R]

Avanti website on subject of Revenue Protection

We will only prosecute ....... if it would be in the public interest and in the interest of justice to prosecute.

If the OP has been the victim of fraud, it would be very difficult to see how a prosecution could satisfy Avanti`s published prosecutions policy.

Likewise, a demand for an out of court settlement against the threat of prosecution should also fail.

But the OP must report the crime of which he has been victim

I hope you’re right, and we’ve seen elsewhere today that Avanti do appear to take a more pragmatic view than other companies.

Though I guess it’s whether they believe the OP that they did not know what was going on - I can well imagine that some scams doing the rounds of unis are well known to be a scam which people willingly join up to (in the same way that the practice of how to short fare might be shared and then repeated.)

 

[WesternLancer]

In relation to your questions

My question is:
- Has anyone had experience with similar railcard-related

Most cases we see on here that are similar involve people who have doctored a railcard themselves, as opposed to have been scammed into buying a forged one - so that's different

- Could this go to court and what do I need to provide if it gets to that ?

It could potentially go to court, depending on how they engage with you and how you respond. You can't rule that out (but others have made comments on this) - this is also why you are being suggested to report the matter to the Police (Action Fraud maybe?)

- What’s the likelihood of Avanti being understanding and resolve it ?

Hard to know for sure, you have been a victim of a scam from what you say - I'm not sure how they would approach it myself but good points made in post #7

- How long does it take to receive a response- as the train manager didn’t take any details just a picture of the railcard screenshot and reported someone will get in contact to get more information

It can take some time unfortunately - it's hard to know how they might contact you if no details were taken and the railcard is fraudulent - but the scan of your associated ticket should give your e-mail address at least listed to that ticket purchase website - so watch that e-mail address and also spam

Should I contact them first or wait for formal correspondence?

The usual advice is to wait for them to contact you so that paperwork can be matched up their end with the report that the railway staff member will presumably send in to their investigations / revenue protection team.
The only pro active thing it would seem to me that you can and should do now is report the scam you have been a victim of to the police

I’d appreciate any advice or shared experiences, especially around how these cases are typically handled.

Thanks in advance for your time.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 12 May 2025 ==

Though I guess it’s whether they believe the OP that they did not know what was going on - I can well imagine that some scams doing the rounds of unis are well known to be a scam which people willingly join up to (in the same way that the practice of how to short fare might be shared and then repeated.)

This is a point well made - and of course might impact on the OP's attitude / approach to reporting it to the police

 

[furlong]

Your best chance may be to provide them with full details of what you did in the form of a witness statement to help them, with the assistance of the police, track down and potentially jail the people who created and promoted this scheme you've described, hoping they'll treat you lightly as a naive victim.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 12 May 2025 ==

Unless they were particularly sophisticated, the £25 paid ought to be traceable, and the authorities will be able to see how many similar payments were made to gain a quick idea of the scale of the fraud.

 

[CharlieSpotted]

Though I guess it’s whether they believe the OP that they did not know what was going on - I can well imagine that some scams doing the rounds of unis are well known to be a scam which people willingly join up to (in the same way that the practice of how to short fare might be shared and then repeated.)

Indeed, see also the "TfL method" widely touted by younger people on social media last year. In fact, "method" seems to have become synonymous with "scam" in these type of viral posts.

 

[Russel]

Train manager also mentioned that if it’s not on the app it’s not valid which no one has informed me of that prior.

I'd be interested to know what the TM meant by this comment and what they define as "the app", as there are multiple, I have one on the official Railcard app and another on the Trip.com app.

 

[Sharif94]

Out of interest, do you still have the barcode and/or details of the payment you made (and the merchant it was made to) on your bank statement?

I am definitely scouring to find that info and have asked uni mates to also check if anyone has it. So I’m hoping to get it as I can't find it on my phone.

 

[Sharif94]

You also need to go to the police about getting defrauded. Obviously someone's doing some photoshops for £25, nice little earner. There's no other explanation.

Don't I have to get the evidence together first ?Also how can I report it ?

 

[John R]

I'd be interested to know what the TM meant by this comment and what they define as "the app", as there are multiple, I have one on the official Railcard app and another on the Trip.com app.

I would suggest it simply means an official app from a rail accredited retailer, of which you've quoted two examples.

And in particular, if you simply show a photograph of it, it isn't valid.

 

[Watershed]

I'd be interested to know what the TM meant by this comment and what they define as "the app", as there are multiple, I have one on the official Railcard app and another on the Trip.com app.

I think the point being made is that all Digital Railcards are viewed from within an app, since industry rules prevent apps from letting you download them as a PDF or add them to Apple/Google Wallet.

 

[AlterEgo]

Don't I have to get the evidence together first ?Also how can I report it ?

You should report it to the police https://www.gov.uk/report-crime

 

[WesternLancer]

Don't I have to get the evidence together first ?

Well not really no (I would think that is the police's job)

You appear to basically have been a victim of being sold a forged product (presumably) in this case you sent the image of yourself and money and in response they faked up a railcard that you did not know was a fake - so you would simply explain when reporting it that you bought a Railcard online and when you were using it it aroused suspicion of a railway inspector who advised you it was not valid because it wasn't a legitimate railcard (or whatever you were told on the train), so you believe you have been cheated out of the sum you paid.

They would then (presumably) ask you any further questions they needed to try and investigate this - and secure any evidence they could.

You would be issued with some sort of crime reporting number, which is something you can then supply to Avanti to support your story that you have been the victim of a scam

But my advice here is based on what you have said happened about how you acquired the railcard, which I am assuming is the truth.

Also how can I report it ?

as per post #17

 

[signed]

It's probably worth contacting the bank as well. There ought to be a chargeback and potentially a subsequent follow-up complaint to the payment provider, if you can work out which one is involved

I doubt most of those underground transactions are done on the card network, OP should count that money lost (unless they used like PayPal Goods and services, but that is unlikely)

It is indeed the best idea to do a police report however

 

[Sharif94]

Did he scan your ticket? If so then they will be able to contact you through the online platform you used to purchase the ticket. If not, and they didn't take Name and Address then I doubt they would be able to contact you through the railcard screenshot, as it won't be linked to you.

How many tickets have you used using this fraudulent railcard? You will very likely be asked to pay again for all those journeys, at the full Anytime Single fare for each journey, which if you have done long distance travel could be very expensive. You'll also be asked to pay an admin fee, which is typically £150, but does vary. That's if you are offered a settlement, instead of being prosecuted. Settlement is usually offered, but this is clearly a more unusual case, as it appears to be a well thought out fraud, so I would imagine Avanti will take a closer interest in it than cases where a railcard has expired (or even where one has been selected where no railcard has ever been held.)

Ticket was scanned but they did not take any other information.
In terms of use- not used it much. Mixture of long journeys from Lon-Liv and Lon- Man with shorter journeys.

Avanti website on subject of Revenue Protection

We will only prosecute ....... if it would be in the public interest and in the interest of justice to prosecute.

If the OP has been the victim of fraud, it would be very difficult to see how a prosecution could satisfy Avanti`s published prosecutions policy.

Likewise, a demand for an out of court settlement against the threat of prosecution should also fail.

But the OP must report the crime of which he has been victim

Sorry so what does that mean. Avanti will unlikely try and escalate this ?
Will Avanti be able to access police records? How will they know re update of the case as I am happy to report but I dont want this hanging over my head from Avanti POV.

I hope you’re right, and we’ve seen elsewhere today that Avanti do appear to take a more pragmatic view than other companies.

Though I guess it’s whether they believe the OP that they did not know what was going on - I can well imagine that some scams doing the rounds of unis are well known to be a scam which people willingly join up to (in the same way that the practice of how to short fare might be shared and then repeated.)

Pragmatic approach how if you don't mind clarifying.

In relation to your questions

Most cases we see on here that are similar involve people who have doctored a railcard themselves, as opposed to have been scammed into buying a forged one - so that's different


It could potentially go to court, depending on how they engage with you and how you respond. You can't rule that out (but others have made comments on this) - this is also why you are being suggested to report the matter to the Police (Action Fraud maybe?)


Hard to know for sure, you have been a victim of a scam from what you say - I'm not sure how they would approach it myself but good points made in post #7



It can take some time unfortunately - it's hard to know how they might contact you if no details were taken and the railcard is fraudulent - but the scan of your associated ticket should give your e-mail address at least listed to that ticket purchase website - so watch that e-mail address and also spam


The usual advice is to wait for them to contact you so that paperwork can be matched up their end with the report that the railway staff member will presumably send in to their investigations / revenue protection team.
The only pro active thing it would seem to me that you can and should do now is report the scam you have been a victim of to the police



== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 12 May 2025 ==


This is a point well made - and of course might impact on the OP's attitude / approach to reporting it to the police

So if Avanti or companies are lenient with people who have doctored it themselves, then they should be more understanding?

In terms of point 2, can you please clarify on what you mean by depending on how they engage and how I respond?

Well, the ticket was scanned and the Train manager reported that the railcard has been expired for 3 years and has my full name and picture. Is there a timeline to expect a reply by ?

Sorry what do you mean by

of course might impact on the OP's attitude / approach to reporting it to the police

As in reporting it to Action Fraud will help or do the opposite?
Clearly looking back- it was a stupid but wouldn't the steps I am taking help ?

Thank you

 

[Adam Williams]

Will Avanti be able to access police records? How will they know re update of the case as I am happy to report but I dont want this hanging over my head from Avanti POV.

No, but you could give them the crime reference number, for example.

 

[John R]

Pragmatic approach how if you don't mind clarifying.

It was blindingly obvious that short-faring was going on, but actually securing a prosecution for it might be difficult. So they backed down.

Ticket was scanned but they did not take any other information.
In terms of use- not used it much. Mixture of long journeys from Lon-Liv and Lon- Man with shorter journeys.

OK, so they will be able to contact you via email through the ticket scan.

The long journeys might be problematic if Avanti take a hard line and expect you to pay the full Anytime Single cost for each journey. As an example, London to Manchester is currently £193. I'm not saying they will, but they might if they take the view that you were complicit in the fraud, rather than an innocent caught up in it.

 

[furlong]

(I'd be taking the line of entering a dialogue with Avanti and assuming they are interested, assisting them to take it to the Transport Police. Presumably there'll be many more instances of this and there might already be an open investigation. Local police/Action Fraud may have little interest beyond logging it. In a University context, the University's IT service might take an interest too if University email or networks were used or multiple students were affected. )

 

[Sharif94]

It was blindingly obvious that short-faring was going on, but actually securing a prosecution for it might be difficult. So they backed down.



OK, so they will be able to contact you via email through the ticket scan.

The long journeys might be problematic if Avanti take a hard line and expect you to pay the full Anytime Single cost for each journey. As an example, London to Manchester is currently £193. I'm not saying they will, but they might if they take the view that you were complicit in the fraud, rather than an innocent caught up in it.

So I should expect an email from Avanti not a letter, correct ?

so I will most likely report this to Action fraud anyways but what is the likelihood of it going to court or them expecting me to pay if they weren't happy with my naivety?

I have had a read on this forum and noticed others have been in worse scenarios and not been taken to court but were expected to a settlement.

I ideally would not want to be anywhere close to a court room so whats the most realistic scenario and when do I find out whats happening.

 

[WesternLancer]

So if Avanti or companies are lenient with people who have doctored it themselves, then they should be more understanding?

I have not said Avanti would be lenient with people who have doctored Railcards themselves. Doctoring a Railcard is a serious matter. But you say you have not doctored your railcard - you said that you bought one on line. And it seems that one seems to be some sort of fake railcard made by whoever sold it to you

In terms of point 2, can you please clarify on what you mean by depending on how they engage and how I respond?

'How they engage with you' - I mean depending on how they consider the issue you are saying, if they believe you etc, and 'how you respond' I mean how clearly you explain to them what has happened and what evidence you can supply to support your story.

Well, the ticket was scanned and the Train manager reported that the railcard has been expired for 3 years and has my full name and picture. Is there a timeline to expect a reply by ?

Not really a timeline - but they would aim to contact you within 6 months - but it's likely to be shorter than that - a few weeks perhaps (eg maybe 4 to 8 weeks but I am guessing this and each company will have different timescales depending on how many staff they have following up this sort of thing.

Sorry what do you mean by

As in reporting it to Action Fraud will help or do the opposite?

Reporting it to the police (the British Transport Police is a good idea as mentioned by @furlong as they have a special remit relating to railway related crime) or Action Fraud (which I think is portal run in connection with the police) will help your case in my personal view, because what you describe is a situation where you have bene a victim of crim and it's generally a good idea to report crime against you, whatever it is, in the hope that such crime is investigated and stopped

Clearly looking back- it was a stupid but wouldn't the steps I am taking help ?

• Bought a new valid 26–30 Railcard immediately
  Sent an email to the official Railcard helpdesk to if there’s account with my email - just for my personal information. Still awaiting a reply.

These are certainly good steps to take and also getting advice on here is a good step too, to help you understand what might happen and how you can best deal with it.

 

[Sharif94]

Thank you all for your advice. Will wait for a reply and see what they say.

 

[Haywain]

I doubt most of those underground transactions are done on the card network, OP should count that money lost (unless they used like PayPal Goods and services, but that is unlikely)

I agree with this. I expect that the OP paid for this railcard by something like PayPal.