Royal Mail to cease using trains

[The_Train]

If so, they can roll-off some goods at Brighton station, replacing the artic that has to reverse into the entrance to the former taxi rank, to re-stock the small store in the station!

Come on you know how this country operates. If the M&S Express did reach Brighton, they'd still unload the train, pack everything onto wagons, take it to some central depot (probably the other side of London) and then send the stock for the Brighton station store back by wagon the next day

 

[sh24]

If so, they can roll-off some goods at Brighton station, replacing the artic that has to reverse into the entrance to the former taxi rank, to re-stock the small store in the station!

Haha! Sadly food stores run on a different distribution network so you'll just have to keep dodging the artic!

 

[XCTurbostar]

Which units can we confirm are at PRDC being de-branded?

 

[Whi]

The unit you saw was almost certainly 325005.
It’s at the country end of Platform 2, further up than normal, as there are 3 uncoupled units in a platform designed for 12 carriages (3x 4-car units)

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 11 Mar 2025 ==

Interesting chat with a guy doing the wraparounds on the 325s. He says they’ve been given 4 weeks to complete the work, and that removal of the Royal Mail branding/identity was a condition of the sale.
He genuinely doesn’t know who the buyer is, but expects to get some branding decals to put on as the last part of the process.
Alas, I’m on an extended holiday now, so won’t be able to offer any updates until late April… by which time the 325s may have been moved out of PRDC
(I was mistaken about the locks. The square panels are where the distinctive blue lights that indicated if the roller shutter was open were sited).
Interesting to note this article https://www.ft.com/content/9a40dc0c-d96a-4a47-b7ea-ae1623627276 about high speed freight, in the Financial Times. It mentions Varamis Rail starting a new service between Birmingham International and London Liverpool Street in May…

I'm in PRDC every Monday & Tuesday night with the truck, I'll keep an eye on what's happening. I have pics from this week of 001 & 002 in grey and prep work on the remaining units, but as Skimpot says I can t really post them yet

 

[L+Y]

I saw mentioned elsewhere that news is afoot on future use of the class 93s- putting two and two together, could these stories be linked in some way?

 

[sad1e]

Any updates on the future of the 325s, 325015 is now visible in willesden pdrc along with 325005

 

[Class15]

Any updates on the future of the 325s, 325015 is now visible in willesden pdrc along with 325005

Are both of those still in the red livery?

 

[sh24]

Wonder if/where the ex GWR Class 769 at Leicester fit into this. They look to have been kitted out for parcel trollies.

 

[sad1e]

Are both of those still in the red livery?

Yes no visible painting , at least from the view from the country end of the Watford DC lines.

 

[Nym]

Wonder if/where the ex GWR Class 769 at Leicester fit into this. They look to have been kitted out for parcel trollies.

They have, and "who knows" is the current state of these units as far as I can tell.

 

[CheshireCrusty]

I wonder how many road hauled containers a 325 would replace?
I suspect the pressure to convert to electric powered rail freight comes from the eventual customer (such as Marks and Spencer) who have to report on both their current carbon intensity and their plans to move towards "net zero" in their TFCD (Task Force on Climate Disclosure) reports. Switching distribution from diesel power road to electric powered rail is an obvious win.
Perhaps we are likely to see an increasing number of rail connected distribution depots.

 

[Trainman40083]

Wonder if/where the ex GWR Class 769 at Leicester fit into this. They look to have been kitted out for parcel trollies.

You'd have to ask GBrF the question.

 

[HSTEd]

I wonder how many road hauled containers a 325 would replace?

Not many.
I did this calculation early in this thread.

Optimistically, 13 lorries per 12-car formation, it is likely significantly less.

 

[Skimpot flyer]

This is pure guesswork on my part, but I can think of a possible reason for the units in platform 2 you can see from the country end of the Watford DC lines still being in red livery.

Before I left to start my holiday in China, the two uncoupled units in Platform 1 (not visible from outside PRDC) both had grey painted roller shutter doors and the grey wraparound complete, on the platform-facing side only.

I spoke on Sunday 9th March with the chap doing this work, and we speculated as to how he would get access to the other side of the units, as there is hardly any space between the units and the outside wall.

(A similar difficulty would exist for the three uncoupled units in platform 2. This time, the sides against the platform are easily accessible, but the opposite side has no platform edge; instead, it has one of the two tracks that lie against the Platform 3/4 island).

That track into Platform 3 was also part-occupied by the sixth unit still stabled at PRDC at that time.

So some shunting moves would be required, out to the reception sidings, then back inside again to a different road, with the (red) as yet unpainted side now being visible from the Bakerloo/Lioness line ?

The other way would involve a 3-point turn via Kensal Junction, Willesden Junction high-level and North Pole Junction, to present the opposite side of the train(s) to the same platform!

 

[sad1e]

This is pure guesswork on my part, but I can think of a possible reason for the units in platform 2 you can see from the country end of the Watford DC lines still being in red livery.
Before I left to start my holiday in China, the two uncoupled units in Platform 1 (not visible from outside PRDC) both had grey painted roller shutter doors and the grey wraparound complete, on the platform-facing side only.
I spoke on Sunday 9th March with the chap doing this work, and we speculated as to how he would get access to the other side of the units, as there is hardly any space between the units and the outside wall.
(A similar difficulty would exist for the three uncoupled units in platform 2. This time, the sides against the platform are easily accessible, but the opposite side has no platform edge; instead, it has one of the two tracks that lie against the Platform 3/4 island).
That track into Platform 3 was also part-occupied by the sixth unit still stabled at PRDC at that time.
So some shunting moves would be required, out to the reception sidings, then back inside again to a different road, with the (red) as yet unpainted side now being visible from the Bakerloo/Lioness line ?
The other way would involve a 3-point turn via Kensal Junction, Willesden Junction high-level and North Pole Junction, to present the opposite side of the train(s) to the same platform!

Hopefully they do do some moves via Willesden, I would like to get some photos of the 325s mid repaint.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Hopefully they do do some moves via Willesden, I would like to get some photos of the 325s mid repaint.

If they do moves like this, wouldn't it be likely they'd do it at a very early hour in the night precisely to minimise the chances of people seeing and photographing the new livery?

Then again, we might get lucky and they might do a Selhurst...

( For those who aren't old enough, about a week before Network SouthEast was unveiled and everything about the image was top secret, Selhurst accidentally left a freshly painted unit - either a 455 or a 319 - outside their paint shop in full view of the running lines for several hours. No social media and camera phones in those days, though... )

 

[60159]

The unit you saw was almost certainly 325005.
It’s at the country end of Platform 2, further up than normal, as there are 3 uncoupled units in a platform designed for 12 carriages (3x 4-car units)

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 11 Mar 2025 ==

Interesting chat with a guy doing the wraparounds on the 325s. He says they’ve been given 4 weeks to complete the work, and that removal of the Royal Mail branding/identity was a condition of the sale.
He genuinely doesn’t know who the buyer is, but expects to get some branding decals to put on as the last part of the process.
Alas, I’m on an extended holiday now, so won’t be able to offer any updates until late April… by which time the 325s may have been moved out of PRDC
(I was mistaken about the locks. The square panels are where the distinctive blue lights that indicated if the roller shutter was open were sited).
Interesting to note this article https://www.ft.com/contentssas in Lindon /9a40dc0c-d96a-4a47-b7ea-ae1623627276 about high speed freight, in the Financial Times. It mentions Varamis Rail starting a new service between Birmingham International and London Liverpool Street in May…

I was in London 21-24 March and a unit was sticking out at the London end.Any idea which?

 

[Skimpot flyer]

I was in London 21-24 March and a unit was sticking out at the London end.Any idea which?

From my post on 9th March

The unit you saw was almost certainly 325005.
It’s at the country end of Platform 2, further up than normal, as there are 3 uncoupled units in a platform designed for 12 carriages (3x 4-car units)

So, unless the units have been moved around as per my post (#524) above, it would still be 325005

 

[RT4038]

Is the relivery for a filming contract of some sort?

 

[Trainman40083]

Is the relivery for a filming contract of some sort?

Maybe another operator plans to run them.

 

[Skimpot flyer]

As I understand it, the six units have been sold to an as yet undisclosed buyer. A condition of the sale was that all Royal Mail branding be obscured.
There has been speculation further up this thread that Freightliner is the buyer.

 

[ls2270]

If they do moves like this, wouldn't it be likely they'd do it at a very early hour in the night precisely to minimise the chances of people seeing and photographing the new livery?

Then again, we might get lucky and they might do a Selhurst...

( For those who aren't old enough, about a week before Network SouthEast was unveiled and everything about the image was top secret, Selhurst accidentally left a freshly painted unit - either a 455 or a 319 - outside their paint shop in full view of the running lines for several hours. No social media and camera phones in those days, though... )

That unit at Selhurst would presumably have been Class 455 5850 as Class 319s didn't appear until 1987/88.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

That unit at Selhurst would presumably have been Class 455 850 as Class 319s didn't appear until 1987/88.

Yes, of course...

When you get to your late 50s, all the earlier years tend to merge into one!!

 

[156444]

From my post on 9th March

The unit you saw was almost certainly 325005.
It’s at the country end of Platform 2, further up than normal, as there are 3 uncoupled units in a platform designed for 12 carriages (3x 4-car units)

So, unless the units have been moved around as per my post (#524) above, it would still be 325005

Two were visible at the end today, 325001 and 325015.

 

[Sun Chariot]

That unit at Selhurst would presumably have been Class 455 5850

Was that the one named / branded ISO 5850 Quality Assured, or something similar? If so, did it happen in conjunction with its NSE repaint? My memory's a bit dimmer these years!

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 31 Mar 2025 ==

When you get to your late 50s, all the earlier years tend to merge into one!!

I'm a couple of years behind but I recently looked through all my 1980s to early 1990s photos - and I was shocked at how many I have absolutely no recollection of being at the ruddy locations, never mind photo'ing the trains!

 

[60159]

From my post on 9th March

The unit you saw was almost certainly 325005.
It’s at the country end of Platform 2, further up than normal, as there are 3 uncoupled units in a platform designed for 12 carriages (3x 4-car units)

So, unless the units have been moved around as per my post (#524) above, it would still be 325005

Many thanks for that. My confusion is that I presumed the country end would be north not south tho’ I thought the north end was blocked off tho’ only ever seen it from a passing mainline train.

 

[ls2270]

Was that the one named / branded ISO 5850 Quality Assured, or something similar? If so, did it happen in conjunction with its NSE repaint? My memory's a bit dimmer these years!

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 31 Mar 2025 ==


I'm a couple of years behind but I recently looked through all my 1980s to early 1990s photos - and I was shocked at how many I have absolutely no recollection of being at the ruddy locations, never mind photo'ing the trains!

No, you’re thinking of 5750 with that nameplate (it was renumbered from 5743 I think). That was long after the NSE launch.

 

[Sun Chariot]

No, you’re thinking of 5750 with that nameplate (it was renumbered from 5743 I think). That was long after the NSE launch.

Ah yes, that's the one, thanks.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

No, you’re thinking of 5750 with that nameplate (it was renumbered from 5743 I think). That was long after the NSE launch.

...and not long after it was renumbered, 455 750 disgraced itself in my backyard by derailing in the sidings at Epsom one morning peak...

( Yes, it was formerly 455 743 ).

Although that's getting somewhat away from the subject of the livery of the 325s!!

Speaking of which... it occurs to me that they don't need to do this move taking them some distance to turn them to get access to the other side to paint them. All they have to do is reverse them out of the platform at the Willesden mail centre and run them back in again on one of the other platforms, with the opposite face. Even if they have to shuffle stock from two platforms to do this, that's relatively straightforward and can be done out of sight in the small hours. They don't even need to leave the confines of the yard...

 

[Mag_seven]

As Royal Mail have now ceased using rail we will bring this particular discussion to a close.

There are two other open threads that can be used to discuss the situation going forward which can be found here:

What is happening with the Royal Mail 325s left at PRDC?

Moderator Note: Split from https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/royal-mail-to-cease-using-trains.270595/ Two were visible at the end today, 325001 and 325015. That would indicate some shuffling around of the individual units, via the reception sidings, has taken place. A couple of weeks ago...

www.railforums.co.uk

and

Did BR Sectorisation Kill Mail by Rail? Can it Return?

Was BR sectorisation instrumental in the start of the demise of mail, parcels etc by rail? I know it carried on for a while after sectorisation and privatisation, but did the rot set in earlier? Under BR, staff, facilities and trains themselves catered for passengers AND mail at the same time...

www.railforums.co.uk

thanks