using child ticket as an adult

[user127]

i’m 18 years old but only turned 18 last week, i thought child’s tickets were for under 18s and was so used to booking these. i understand that as an 18 year old i shouldn’t have booked a child’s ticket for my transport, and i am willing to own up to the consequences of it. but i was caught yesterday using a child’s ticket and was told to give my information which is when i realised what i had done and regretted it immediately. she then told me to show all of my bookings, to which i listened, and i have 8 bookings using child’s tickets (including 2 refunded trips) since i was 15. she told my friend (who is 17, also thought children under 18 used child’s tickets) he owed £50 and gave him a receipt. but i was told something about court which i cannot remember because i was so anxious at the time and focused more on how i was supposed to come up with the money, and now i am wondering what will happen to me? i understand that i will have to pay for my last trip, but will i also have to pay for the other 5(?) trips i went ahead with child’s tickets for? and what are any additional costs i may be told to cover? i’m afraid my mum will be disappointed, i’ve already told her about yesterday and she was understanding but she only thinks it’s £50 i owe. can anyone help me out by telling me what i should expect next?

 

[WesternLancer]

i’m 18 years old but only turned 18 last week, i thought child’s tickets were for under 18s and was so used to booking these. i understand that as an 18 year old i shouldn’t have booked a child’s ticket for my transport, and i am willing to own up to the consequences of it. but i was caught yesterday using a child’s ticket and was told to give my information which is when i realised what i had done and regretted it immediately. she then told me to show all of my bookings, to which i listened, and i have 8 bookings using child’s tickets (including 2 refunded trips) since i was 15. she told my friend (who is 17, also thought children under 18 used child’s tickets) he owed £50 and gave him a receipt. but i was told something about court which i cannot remember because i was so anxious at the time and focused more on how i was supposed to come up with the money, and now i am wondering what will happen to me? i understand that i will have to pay for my last trip, but will i also have to pay for the other 5(?) trips i went ahead with child’s tickets for? and what are any additional costs i may be told to cover? i’m afraid my mum will be disappointed, i’ve already told her about yesterday and she was understanding but she only thinks it’s £50 i owe. can anyone help me out by telling me what i should expect next?

Hi - would you be able to answer the basic questions here, then people can give you the best and most relevant advice

Please read before posting in Disputes & Prosecutions

Guidance for those asking for advice: Please bear in mind the following, when asking for advice in this section: We need to know all relevant facts in order to assist you, including, for example: The stations* where you actually started & finished your journey The stations* where you changed...

www.railforums.co.uk

It sounds like your friend was given a Penalty Fare (£100 + cost of new ticket reduced to £50 if paid promptly) but you were not. There could be a number of different reasons for this but the most likely one is that as your friend is under 18 its more difficult for them to prosecute your friend in court. As you are over 18 that does not apply to you I'm afraid, so they have reported you for investigation (which can ultimately result in court prosecution, but if you co-operate with them there is a good chance this can be avoided).

Separately - did your friend pay the £50 then and there?

Having said that you are some way off prosecution, and it is often possible to avoid that with help from here.

What you and your friend should urgently do is buy Railcards to legitimately reduce the cost of your train fares (check the Railcard official website to see which card is applicable and how it works). In your case this is something you can say to them - when they contact you about these child tickets - that you have done to show that you have learned from your mistake and taken steps to prevent it happening again.

 

[user127]

Hi - would you be able to answer the basic questions here, then people can give you the best and most relevant advice

Please read before posting in Disputes & Prosecutions

Guidance for those asking for advice: Please bear in mind the following, when asking for advice in this section: We need to know all relevant facts in order to assist you, including, for example: The stations* where you actually started & finished your journey The stations* where you changed...

www.railforums.co.uk

It sounds like your friend was given a Penalty Fare (£100 + cost of new ticket reduced to £50 if paid promptly) but you were not. There could be a number of different reasons for this but the most likely one is that as your friend is under 18 its more difficult for them to prosecute your friend in court. As you are over 18 that does not apply to you I'm afraid, so they have reported you for investigation (which can ultimately result in court prosecution if you don't co-operate with them).

Separately - did your friend pay the £50 then and there?

Having said that you are some way off prosecution, and it is often possible to avoid that with help from here.

What you and your friend should urgently do is buy Railcards to legitimately reduce the cost of your train fares (check the Railcard official website to see which card is applicable and how it works). In your case this is something you can say to them - when they contact you about these child tickets - that you have done to show that you have learned from your mistake and taken steps to prevent it happening again.

hi, yes i’m travelling with west midlands railway. and to answer your second question, no my friend did not pay upfront. they handed him a receipt and asked him
for his information and said to expect a letter in the post. how could i avoid prosecution? i’m definitely going to purchase a railcard, but i doubt my friend will. i understand that this is serious and i am willing to face the consequences, but i really don’t want to go into this blind and unsure about what expenses are owed. will they charge me £50 for every trip i’ve taken with a child ticket (6 times altogether) since i was 15? how much do you think i will have to pay, and what are some ways i could avoid additional costs.

 

[WesternLancer]

hi, yes i’m travelling with west midlands railway. and to answer your second question, no my friend did not pay upfront. they handed him a receipt and asked him
for his information and said to expect a letter in the post.

So it's not clear to me what they asked him £50 for but if he wants advice on that then best he uses this forum and starts his own thread to get clarification as to what happened and what he should expect / what to do. he should not ignore what he was given or the matter will escalate and likely cost more to resolve eventually. But how he deals with it is up to him.

how could i avoid prosecution?

Basically by replying to the letter they send you, apologising for what you did, convincing them you will never do it again, convincing them you understand what you did was wrong and why it was wrong, offering to pay the fares you owe, and then asking if they will be prepared to settle the matter without prosecuting you. See lots of other threads for examples.

i’m definitely going to purchase a railcard, but i doubt my friend will.

Of course up to your friend how they want to handle it

i understand that this is serious and i am willing to face the consequences, but i really don’t want to go into this blind and unsure about what expenses are owed. will they charge me £50 for every trip i’ve taken with a child ticket (6 times altogether) since i was 15?

No - but they will want the full adult fare for every trip they identify - so you can calculate how much that will be, plus usually an 'admin fee' for their costs in investigating all this - often around £150 is what we see on these threads

how much do you think i will have to pay,

see above answer

and what are some ways i could avoid additional costs.

The main risk of additional costs for what you have done is if it went to court - as the court punishment costs are likely to add up to more than getting an out of court settlement.

 

[user127]

No - but they will want the full adult fare for every trip they identify - so you can calculate how much that will be, plus usually an 'admin fee' for their costs in investigating all this - often around £150 is what we see on these threads

hi, thank you so much for your response. is that £150 on top of the £50 and the adult fare for all of the trips? how would i calculate the adult fare from the child’s fare because the prices are all different despite paying for the same trip routes. [eg from birmingham new street to tame bridge parkway, sometimes costs £2.05, sometimes costs £2.15, etc] would i just search an adult ticket for the next train and assume that’s the price they will charge? or should i just double the price of what i paid?

 

[Lewisham2221]

hi, yes i’m travelling with west midlands railway. and to answer your second question, no my friend did not pay upfront. they handed him a receipt and asked him
for his information and said to expect a letter in the post. how could i avoid prosecution? i’m definitely going to purchase a railcard, but i doubt my friend will. i understand that this is serious and i am willing to face the consequences, but i really don’t want to go into this blind and unsure about what expenses are owed. will they charge me £50 for every trip i’ve taken with a child ticket (6 times altogether) since i was 15? how much do you think i will have to pay, and what are some ways i could avoid additional costs.

They will investigate your account and come to a conclusion about how often you have done this. They will then write to you with a Notice of Intended Prosecution. This will give details of the incident where you were stopped, what offence they believe you have committed and can be prosecuted for, and also any further offences they believe you may have committed. They will give you the opportunity to reply to them with your version of events - this is your chance to apologise for what you have done, explain that you misunderstood the rules and regret not making sure that you understood the rules and used the correct tickets, that you have or will consider purchasing a railcard to legitimately save money on future rail fares, and politely ask if it would be possible to settle the matter without going to court. If they agree (most TOCs usually do), they will write to you again offering you an out of court settlement. This will detail all of the fares they think you have underpaid and offer you a settlement figure that is likely to be the full Adult Anytime Single fare for each of those journeys, plus an admin fee (to cover the costs of their revenue/fraud team) - this admin fee can vary but is typically between £100 - £200. WMR are not likely to take into account the money you already paid when purchasing the child tickets.

 

[WesternLancer]

hi, thank you so much for your response. is that £150 on top of the £50 and the adult fare for all of the trips? how would i calculate the adult fare from the child’s fare because the prices are all different despite paying for the same trip routes. [eg from birmingham new street to tame bridge parkway, sometimes costs £2.05, sometimes costs £2.15, etc] would i just search an adult ticket for the next train and assume that’s the price they will charge? or should i just double the price of what i paid?

Forget about the £50 (without seeing what paperwork your friend was given we can't know if this has any relevance to you or how your case will be handled). But that sounds like a sum associated with a Penalty Fare which unless you can show us you have been given a Penalty Fare does not apply to you

The Anytime Single adult fare from Tame Bridge Parkways to Birmingham New Street is £4.40.

This is the sum they will use for each one way journey they believe you did not pay the correct fare and this is what they will seek from you if they offer to settle it out of court plus an Admin fee. Any other fare you have seen or could have bought is some sort of discounted fare and they will not use discounted fares to calculate what you have avoided paying by not buying the correct fare before you travelled on the train.

 

[user127]

i’m 18 years old but only turned 18 last week, i thought child’s tickets were for under 18s and was so used to booking these. i understand that as an 18 year old i shouldn’t have booked a child’s ticket for my transport, and i am willing to own up to the consequences of it. but i was caught yesterday using a child’s ticket and was told to give my information which is when i realised what i had done and regretted it immediately. she then told me to show all of my bookings, to which i listened, and i have 8 bookings using child’s tickets (including 2 refunded trips) since i was 15. she told my friend (who is 17, also thought children under 18 used child’s tickets) he owed £50 and gave him a receipt. but i was told something about court which i cannot remember because i was so anxious at the time and focused more on how i was supposed to come up with the money, and now i am wondering what will happen to me? i understand that i will have to pay for my last trip, but will i also have to pay for the other 5(?) trips i went ahead with child’s tickets for? and what are any additional costs i may be told to cover? i’m afraid my mum will be disappointed, i’ve already told her about yesterday and she was understanding but she only thinks it’s £50 i owe. can anyone help me out by telling me what i should expect next?

i’ve finally received the letter in the mail. it has information about the return address, and it has questions about my name, d.o.b, occupation, etc. do i need to return the letter or is that just incase i have mitigating factors i want to address? i have paid the fine. does anyone have any suggestions, such as if i should return the letter or not, and if so, what i should write at the back?

 

[Titfield]

Please confirm you have paid the £180. If so there is no need to do anything else.

 

[user127]

Please confirm you have paid the £180. If so there is no need to do anything else.

i received a confirmation email. do i need to write that i confirm the payment on the reverse of the letter and send it?

 

[Titfield]

i received a confirmation email. do i need to write that i confirm the payment on the reverse of the letter and send it?

No if you have paid and received confirmation of the payment (a receipt) by email or hard copy then the matter is closed. You do not need to reply.

 

[tram21]

A pretty good outcome here given you travelled multiple times on a child ticket. That's quite a low settlement; glad it's sorted

 

[WesternLancer]

i received a confirmation email. do i need to write that i confirm the payment on the reverse of the letter and send it?

Just keep your proof of payment and all the paperwork long term. At least a year.