London North Eastern Railway (LNER) First Class service

[shinkansen1966]

Quick question - is the full breakfast served out of Kings cross on the 10:00 Kings Cross to Aberdeen service or is it the lighter one?
The shading on the EC timetable on the website uses the same colour for all morning trains so you can't tell what is served (unlike the virgin timetables which uses a different shading for their lighter breakfast service trains).

The other day, I asked East Coast trains this very same question and had this reponse:

Dear Mr ...,


As your journey is shaded red in our timetable you should indeed be served the full English breakfast.

However I would like to add that as with all our complementary meals this is subject to availability on the day.

Kind Regards
...
Customer Relations
East Coast

 

[jon0844]

I knew they'd start to use the argument that as it's free, you should be grateful to get anything as they have no obligation to provide anything.

However, I'd be somewhat peeved if I bought a ticket purely for the freebies having seen one of their new advertisement campaigns.

 

[shinkansen1966]

I knew they'd start to use the argument that as it's free, you should be grateful to get anything as they have no obligation to provide anything.

However, I'd be somewhat peeved if I bought a ticket purely for the freebies having seen one of their new advertisement campaigns.

Indeed.

The EC first class food and drink is free at the point of consumption. You paid for in your ticket.

 

[maddeningcrowds]

As with all our complementary meals this is subject to availability on the day.

• Misleading [...] advertisements
• Promotions that are unfairly run or special offers that have left you disappointed
  

Advertising standards anybody?
http://www.asa.org.uk/Complaints/How-to-complain.aspx

 

[Failed Unit]

• Misleading [...] advertisements
• Promotions that are unfairly run or special offers that have left you disappointed
  

Advertising standards anybody?
http://www.asa.org.uk/Complaints/How-to-complain.aspx

Very tempted, if my compliants are shrugged of definately. As it is advertised on TV we could go for 2 sandwiches is a snack not a meal. No subject to availability clause on the adverts either.

We have got the longer journeys they advertise so half way there.

 

[amcluesent]

Well, talk about things going backwards! First service out of KGX since 22May I've been on where no food has been offered to pax by arrival at PBO.

16:58, board is showing 17:03 to LDS as on time. 16:59 Cancelled! Needless to say a lot of PBO traffic piles into the 17:19 to Hull. Coffee OK, Drinks OK, anything else...nope.

 

[williamn]

I do think they have rather over-promised with the adverts talking of a free 'meal'. On the vast majority of services this meal seems to consist of two sandwiches...

 

[DaveNewcastle]

having read and re-read the 'offer' on eastcoast.co.uk for 'First Class Complimentary Food and Drink', I'm still unable to find the exception for the 28% of trains which run at weekends:-

First Class

Complimentary food and drink

You'll be served refreshments at your seat by our friendly on-board team. For shorter journeys you'll be offered non-alcoholic drinks and snacks, while on journeys over 70 minutes you can look forward to something a little more substantial.

Breakfast
Before around 9.30, count on a Great British breakfast including vegetarian and lighter options.

Mid-Morning
Until around 11.00 a lighter breakfast menu will be served including bacon butties.

During the day
From around 11am, choose from a selection of sandwiches, a light lunch or a hot meal rounded off with a piece of fruit or a cake. Selected services will serve afternoon tea between 15.00 and 16.30.

Evening meal
On selected evening services leaving London King's Cross from around 17.00 until 19.00, choose from an evening meal, a selection of sandwiches or a light salad topped off with a delicious dessert or cheese and crackers. The majority of evening services from around 19.00 serve tasty food at your seat, accompanied by complimentary drinks from our trolley.

Drinks
A wide selection of drinks are available to accompany your food - choose from a selection of wines, beers and soft drinks. Complimentary alcoholic drinks are served to First Class customers, aged 18 or over, on weekday services from around 11.00. Passengers on shorter journeys will be able to choose from a range of complimentary non-alcoholic drinks.

Please note, we aim to deliver our complimentary offer on all journeys. However we may substitute some items on the menu at our discretion. On shorter journeys (of 70 minutes or less) we will endeavour to provide complimentary drinks and snacks.

Only if you specifically click on another link for 'Weekend and Bank Holiday service' will we find this :

Weekend and Bank Holiday service

On weekends and bank holidays, passengers are served a breakfast roll first thing and thereafter a choice of sandwiches, crisps and cake. Alcoholic drinks and hot food are available to purchase from our CafeBAR.

 

[jon0844]

When I looked up the £25 fares, there were none on a Friday and limited numbers on other days. On the weekend I checked, it seemed the £25 fares were on every single EC service.

But why would they want you to pay £25 for a weekend first class ticket to get a breakfast roll and some sandwiches. Wouldn't you think 'that's not much' and be put off every trying FC again - namely in the week.

I'd have made the '25 reasons' for weekdays only if it really was to showcase this amazing new at seat service.

 

[Yew]

When I looked up the £25 fares, there were none on a Friday and limited numbers on other days. On the weekend I checked, it seemed the £25 fares were on every single EC service.

But why would they want you to pay £25 for a weekend first class ticket to get a breakfast roll and some sandwiches. Wouldn't you think 'that's not much' and be put off every trying FC again - namely in the week.

I'd have made the '25 reasons' for weekdays only if it really was to showcase this amazing new at seat service.

Maybe we could make 25 reasons not to go first class on ec? (another thread perhaps?

 

[Furrball]

having read and re-read the 'offer' on eastcoast.co.uk for 'First Class Complimentary Food and Drink', I'm still unable to find the exception for the 28% of trains which run at weekends:-
Only if you specifically click on another link for 'Weekend and Bank Holiday service' will we find this :

This is the same with the 25 reasons promotion - you have to download the PDF timetable to get the information regarding weekend provisions.

I have submitted a complaint to the ASA off the back of this - wait and see what happens.

 

[silentone]

On the issue of soup, back a few pages. It has been deemed unsafe and the union shall not approve it. It only takes one incident and it's gameover.

EC also have the highest number of staff accidents on the railway, (or did) and clearly don't want to create any further potential accidents. I believe there was a risk assessment on carrying soup through the train and the vestibules caused the biggest problem. The rubber parts on the floor of the MK4's vestibule tend to curl slightly at the edges, I've tripped quite a few times on them. As for the MK3's there is quite often a step between carriages, particularly between J & L. I frequently find myself being hurled into doors because of this.

 

[38Cto15E]

Are any members old enough to remember when soup was served out of a large terrine which the restaurant car staff held in their bent arm?

Approaching Kings Cross many years ago on train from Edinburgh I was in the front carriage doorway ready to make a quick exit once we were stationary, then I was joined by a steward carrying a boxed Gateaux, I guess his family had a nice tea that night.

 

[StrollerEd]

soup is a wondeful thing - but here we must all agree that removal of the seated dining car and the prospect of staff rushing the full length of the FC carriages with soup is itself a recipe too far
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Something with mash would seem like an option.

You could offer mash potato with all sort of things (sausage, pie, haggis(as an evening meal on the Chieftain this could be good! The sleeper haggis neeps and taties comes out of a tin but there is nothing wrong with it!))

Or new potatoes during the summer with a beef casserole or the likes, or chicken breast.

Veggie Chilli or veggie spag bol

And then of course chips with anything . . .

Ok, not 'fancy' food but good, honest food.

+1

"Potato ends train famine"

 

[Sapphire Blue]

During the last fortnight I have had the mushroom soup on the St Pancras to Nottingham and the Scotch broth on the sleeper south from Aberdeen.

I realise now how lucky I am to have survived and I apologise to my fellow passengers for endangering them.

(Give me strength!!!!)

 

[Essexman]

I too have recently enjoyed mushroom soup on East Midlands Trains. The steward carried it through two coaches without spilling a drop.

Anyway I've thought of a solution:

All those who want soup sit in a special eating area in the coach nearest the kitchen. Once they've finished the soup they would be able to choose from a selection of four or five high quality meals, served to them by dedicated and attentive staff. They can finish of the meal with a nice desert, proper cheese & biscuits or coffee. Obviously no one would expect this to free, but £25 a head on business expenses, perhaps with a discount for full first class ticket holders would sound reasonable. It called be called a RESTAURANT and East Coast could advertise what a civilised way this is to travel and how much beter than flying. Good idea?

 

[schwa]

I too have recently enjoyed mushroom soup on East Midlands Trains. The steward carried it through two coaches without spilling a drop.

Anyway I've thought of a solution:

All those who want soup sit in a special eating area in the coach nearest the kitchen. Once they've finished the soup they would be able to choose from a selection of four or five high quality meals, served to them by dedicated and attentive staff. They can finish of the meal with a nice desert, proper cheese & biscuits or coffee. Obviously no one would expect this to free, but £25 a head on business expenses, perhaps with a discount for full first class ticket holders would sound reasonable. It called be called a RESTAURANT and East Coast could advertise what a civilised way this is to travel and how much beter than flying. Good idea?

It's a good idea, up to the question of whether it makes any money or not..

 

[StrollerEd]

I too have recently enjoyed mushroom soup on East Midlands Trains. The steward carried it through two coaches without spilling a drop.

Anyway I've thought of a solution:

All those who want soup sit in a special eating area in the coach nearest the kitchen. Once they've finished the soup they would be able to choose from a selection of four or five high quality meals, served to them by dedicated and attentive staff. They can finish of the meal with a nice desert, proper cheese & biscuits or coffee. Obviously no one would expect this to free, but £25 a head on business expenses, perhaps with a discount for full first class ticket holders would sound reasonable. It called be called a RESTAURANT and East Coast could advertise what a civilised way this is to travel and how much beter than flying. Good idea?

+1

the cost is not a standalone item on the balance sheet - it is a factor of producing and successfully selling a product - and doing so against the competition.

 

[Skimble19]

I too have recently enjoyed mushroom soup on East Midlands Trains. The steward carried it through two coaches without spilling a drop.

Anyway I've thought of a solution:

All those who want soup sit in a special eating area in the coach nearest the kitchen. Once they've finished the soup they would be able to choose from a selection of four or five high quality meals, served to them by dedicated and attentive staff. They can finish of the meal with a nice desert, proper cheese & biscuits or coffee. Obviously no one would expect this to free, but £25 a head on business expenses, perhaps with a discount for full first class ticket holders would sound reasonable. It called be called a RESTAURANT and East Coast could advertise what a civilised way this is to travel and how much beter than flying. Good idea?

Yeah, that was scrapped for a reason. The idea is to attract lots of new customers to 1st, not just the same old few to sitting in the restaurant loosing EC money.

 

[philjo]

Perhaps soup could be carried on the 1st trolley in thermos jugs & poured out at the table?
That would make it easier/safer to carry along the train & also keep it hotter for a longer period. Other than the fact it is thicker there would be no difference from serving coffee.
I have seen it done that way at outside events without any problems.

 

[Failed Unit]

Yeah, that was scrapped for a reason. The idea is to attract lots of new customers to 1st, not just the same old few to sitting in the restaurant loosing EC money.

Yep, get lots of new customers and stave them

 

[amcluesent]

What about cupasoups? If they did teabags too, the tea jug could be used for hot water?

BTW the carbonnade of beef with potatoes and two veg is looking pretty much like a proper meal this week!

NB Avoid onion bahji sarnies!

 

[silentone]

They did Cup-a-Soups but nobody bought them.

The Standard Class catering is about to get a tweaking for Summer. All the current Hot Drinks are being replaced with new brands.

I also propose this thread has run its course and be closed (much like the Restaurant Car) because it's going round and round in circles over the same old ground.

 

[jon0844]

I propose people simply stop posting and wait and see what EC does in the future. Closing the thread would merely mean another one being created in a few weeks/months.

 

[richa2002]

I agree, keep the thread going as it's interesting to hear how the new arrangement's going. I've still yet to see reports of the hot snack being regularly available on all-day menu services.

 

[williamn]

Cup-a-soup is not a replacement for the real thing!
I don't see why soup is any more dangerous than hot water.

 

[Pumbaa]

They did Cup-a-Soups but nobody bought them.

The Standard Class catering is about to get a tweaking for Summer. All the current Hot Drinks are being replaced with new brands.

Does this mean the return of a proper coffee machine?! Most irritated at having only Kenco instant the other week!

 

[silentone]

Cup-a-soup is not a replacement for the real thing!
I don't see why soup is any more dangerous than hot water.

Soup would have to be carried in a bowl uncovered to the person having it. If they did soup, staff would have to carry more than one bowl or they would spend the entire trip delivering one bowl of soup at a time.

Even with one bowl it would take just one jerk of the train and a passenger could find themselves covered in boiling liquid. Factor in that a crew member could carry several bowls on a tray and that risk is suddenly hugely increased.

No point in debating it further. Soup is well and truly off the menu.

Hot drinks in First Class are delivered in sealed jugs and require the button on the top to be pressed to release the seal.

All other hot drinks which are not directly placed onto a table infront of the customer must have a lid and be placed in a bag.

Edit: All of the Coffee Machines are being removed. There is currently no replacement for them and this will be the case until they find a suitable replacement, although such a search has been going on for sometime and the general impression I've gotten is that there's no rush to replace them. The new coffee's are those little sachets like Starbucks Via which they were looking into, but it's not that. Can't remember the brand but it's one of the big names. The Tea I think is Taylors of Harrogate but I don't think it's the brand Yorkshire Tea.

 

[bnm]

Soup would have to be carried in a bowl uncovered to the person having it. If they did soup, staff would have to carry more than one bowl or they would spend the entire trip delivering one bowl of soup at a time.

Even with one bowl it would take just one jerk of the train and a passenger could find themselves covered in boiling liquid. Factor in that a crew member could carry several bowls on a tray and that risk is suddenly hugely increased.

No point in debating it further. Soup is well and truly off the menu.

Totally dismissing the point made upthread that EMT manage to serve soup. As do FGW on their Pullmans. Oh, and soup shouldn't be served 'boiling'. Ruins the flavour. It should be served at a temperature that won't burn the lips. So, worst case scenario is a dry cleaning bill - the same should any other hot food be accidentally dumped on a passenger.

 

[ApAp]

The Standard Class catering is about to get a tweaking for Summer. All the current Hot Drinks are being replaced with new brands.

Standard class catering? Where do the hungry people from first class go?