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Kings Cross to Cleethorpes - LNER - (Update)

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I__

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Following on from my thread last year about the test runs for the London Kings Cross to Cleethorpes LNER service, it looks like the service has been approved.

The following is from: https://mylocal.co.uk/feed/208742/cleethorpes-to-london-train-service-set-to-arrive-this-year
"A direct train service from Cleethorpes to London King’s Cross, via Grimsby Town railway station, could arrive at last at the end of this year.

Conservative candidate for Greater Grimsby and Cleethorpes parliamentary constituency, Lia Nici, says it is “arriving in December”. She said that this is based on conversations with Department for Transport and LNER Azuma officials.

No official announcement has been made, though, and Labour Greater Grimsby and Cleethorpes candidate, Melanie Onn, has said it has been a 40 year campaign. But Conservative Brigg and Immingham candidate Martin Vickers has said it has received ministerial approval and awaits timetable sign-off, after operator negotiations with Network Rail.

Ms Nici made the claim it is “arriving in December” in a tweet highlighting a 2019 post-election Grimsby Telegraph article. Asked to clarify the basis for this, given there has been no official announcement yet, she said: “Following discussions I’ve had with representatives and Ministers at the Department for Transport and LNER, I have received assurance from these organisations that the line will be set to open in December.

“It is my understanding from these meetings that approval for the line has been received from both the Department for Transport and the Treasury, and that the tests on the line are complete. The only thing remaining is for drivers to be trained on the new stretch of line before the service can be opened at the end of the year.”

There was a guage test in June 2023, of the route. There has been a false dawn before, when hopes for a May 2022 relaunch were dashed by problems including cracks on board new Hitachi Azuma trains.

“As an MP, I had to travel between Grimsby and London on a weekly basis, so I understand completely the frustration the lack of a direct rail route has caused,” continued Ms Nici. “Since my election, I’ve tirelessly lobbied ministers in government, and the rail operator to make sure that this issue remains at the top of their agenda. My colleagues in government have appreciated our concerns and have worked to make sure that work gets completed as soon as possible.”

She argued it was “one step of many” she had made to help regenerate the town. “Getting Grimsby connected is a key part of that regeneration, and I’m delighted that this will be delivered by the end of this year.”

Labour’s Melanie Onn, who also pushed for its return when she represented Grimsby at Westminster, was critical of the Conservative government’s handling of rail. “This has been a 40 year campaign and the reality is that there is still no direct line between Cleethorpes and London.

“Under the Conservatives, we are paying more than ever for our rail journeys on unreliable services that don’t work for passengers. That’s why Labour’s plan to take back control of our rail is so important to make sure that it works in the interests of the people who use them and encourage more people back into public transport.” Labour head into the election with a promise to create an arm’s length body, Great British Railways, to run the rail network.

Mr Vickers has raised the issue of getting a direct Cleethorpes to London rail route in parliament, repeatedly. He was asked what his understanding of the situation was. “It has received ministerial approval,” he said of the route.

LNER and other operators were currently negotiating with Network Rail the timetables for December. It would go ahead as soon as all the necessary arrangements have been made on the network.

“One of my first jobs if I’m re-elected on July 4, will be to get in touch with the new Transport Secretary,” he said, to press for its timetable confirmation.

The National Rail train timetables are organised twice a year, meaning if it is not in the December 2024 onward timetable, the next earliest date would be approximately May 2025.

The Department for Transport referred to a parliamentary debate on March 21, when Mr Vickers asked for an update on the proposed service. Transport Minister Huw Merriman stated in his answer: “We are now going through the stages with those who use the lines to ensure we do not have any timetabling issues like those that arose in May 2018. I hope we will come to a position on this in some weeks and that I can give him more detail, but I very much hope to see those direct services to Cleethorpes.”
 
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I__

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Would this go via Scunthorpe, or be an extension of a Lincoln service?
An extension of the Lincoln service.

Wasn't the original plan going to be a token early morning/late night extension of a Lincoln service which otherwise goes ECS to the depot at Doncaster?
I think so, I heard somewhere that it would possibly be the first and last train of the day as it could go via Scunthorpe to the depot at Doncaster.
 

800001

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‘I have received assurance from these organisations that the line will be set to open in December.’

I thought they were introducing one service each way, not building a new line
 

I__

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‘I have received assurance from these organisations that the line will be set to open in December.’

I thought they were introducing one service each way, not building a new line
The line exists, I can see it out of my window! :lol:
 

bramling

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Bets on which year there are threads on here “Consultation announced into withdrawal of Cleethorpes service”.

In principle it’s a good thing, but I can’t see one token journey at times convenient to the operator rather than passengers being a great success.
 

Kite159

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Bets on which year there are threads on here “Consultation announced into withdrawal of Cleethorpes service”.

In principle it’s a good thing, but I can’t see one token journey at times convenient to the operator rather than passengers being a great success.
Especially if it's one which gets pulled at any sign of disruption on the ECML.
 

class26

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Especially if it's one which gets pulled at any sign of disruption on the ECML.
I know several people living in Lincoln who still drive to Newark as so many of the direct Lincoln trains get pulled by LNER. If you advertise it you have to run it !
 

Elybob

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Sort of related - does anyone know what's going on with the planned Huddersfield service?
 

trawler

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Nothing confirmed yet mainly because of the ESG (New East Coast Timetable) so at least May 2025 but may well be December 2025. I'm close to this.
 

YorkRailFan

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 RAIL is reporting as of 9th October 2024, that the plans have been put on hold:
RAIL has been told that LNER’s plan to reintroduce a though service from North East Lincolnshire is on hold because of timetabling, financial, operational and infrastructure issues.

However, the service does not appear in online timetables for December 2024 and LNER has confirmed to RAIL that the plans are on hold, saying:

“The industry is working to address timetabling, financial, operational and infrastructure issues that need to be resolved before any service to Cleethorpes could be introduced.”

The MP who used to represents Cleethorpes but whose new constituency takes in Barnetby, Martin Vickers, has campaigned for years for a through service to be reinstated. RAIL spoke to Mr Vickers, who told us: “Prior to the election, Huw Merriman, then Rail Minister, told me that the Transport Secretary had approved the service and instructed LNER to work with Network Rail to bring it in from the forthcoming Winter Timetable (December 2024).“There are issues surrounding stopping the train in Market Rasen due to it having no footbridge or subway and the short platform. This I’m sure could be overcome but if not, we could start the service and introduce stops at Market Rasen when safety features have been provided.

“I get the impression from LNER that unless the new minister instructs them similarly, it won’t happen.”

Martin Vickers MP says he’s been told repeatedly that the new service depends on capacity on the East Coast Main Line (ECML), but he disputes this: “..there is no additional pressure on the ECML since we are talking about extending the existing service between King’s Cross and Lincoln.”

This move seems to be part of a wider shift by LNER, from December 2024, Glasgow, Stirling and Sunderland will be ditched. It looks like LNER isn't keen on low frequency extensions of existing services.
 

800001

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 RAIL is reporting as of 9th October 2024, that the plans have been put on hold:




This move seems to be part of a wider shift by LNER, from December 2024, Glasgow, Stirling and Sunderland will be ditched. It looks like LNER isn't keen on low frequency extensions of existing services.
More likely the finance from dft to pay for the extension has not been granted.
 

A S Leib

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It looks like LNER isn't keen on low frequency extensions of existing services.
I've mentioned it before, but it makes it strange that the Middlesbrough service was brought in when it was.

I can't remember if they planned to bring Bradford Forster Square services up to bihourly or not, but I wonder how much longer the Skipton and Hull services have (if ORCATs is the only reason for keeping it, why drop Sunderland and not Hull?*).

*I know Hull has well over twice as many journeys to / from King's Cross as are bought between Sunderland and KGX – lots are presumably Metro tickets + fares from Newcastle – and Sunderland – Newcastle's more frequent and cheaper than Hull – Doncaster.
 

Masbroughlad

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I wonder how such decisions, indeed timetable plans will be made under GBR.

Shame Cleethorpes is going to miss out here. Used love getting the Intercity out of Cleethorpes, twisting through the docks to Grimsby.

Maybe it will be revisited in the future or GBR might be hoping for another OA attempt?
 

ainsworth74

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I've mentioned it before, but it makes it strange that the Middlesbrough service was brought in when it was.
That had the advantage of having a regional mayor which was a rising star in the Tory party...
 

trawler

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The Cleethorpes service is on hold and no decision has been taken to bin the possible extension. This also relates to the decision to defer the ECML timetable (ESG).
 

HST43257

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I've mentioned it before, but it makes it strange that the Middlesbrough service was brought in when it was.

I can't remember if they planned to bring Bradford Forster Square services up to bihourly or not, but I wonder how much longer the Skipton and Hull services have (if ORCATs is the only reason for keeping it, why drop Sunderland and not Hull?*).

*I know Hull has well over twice as many journeys to / from King's Cross as are bought between Sunderland and KGX – lots are presumably Metro tickets + fares from Newcastle – and Sunderland – Newcastle's more frequent and cheaper than Hull – Doncaster.
Bradford FS I think is supposed to improve frequency, that’s got something to do with the platform work I think.
The Middlesborough was supposed to go bihourly in the recast
 

Failed Unit

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Just an update on this, from the local press in Lincolnshire, as we expected this service will not start until at least 2026. Apperntly Market Rasen needs work on the platforms costing about 20M. No idea what these works are, the platforms are very low and not long enough for a 5 coach train. I assume SDO can sort out the later problem (It can take 3x 23m trains at the moment).

I am sure detail will come out, but 20M seems a lot of money.
 

ainsworth74

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Is the station accessible? That sounds like the sort of price tag you might get for putting in the full shooting match to make it accessible with lifts and whatnot.
 

BPN2022

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Just an update on this, from the local press in Lincolnshire, as we expected this service will not start until at least 2026. Apperntly Market Rasen needs work on the platforms costing about 20M. No idea what these works are, the platforms are very low and not long enough for a 5 coach train. I assume SDO can sort out the later problem (It can take 3x 23m trains at the moment).

I am sure detail will come out, but 20M seems a lot of money.
£20m!!? That surely will not provide a return in tickets. Wouldn’t be surprised if this route is binned off soon.
 

trawler

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It's still sat with the DfT after LNER gave a price and awaiting direction. Local MP effectively asked for an update but there is no news. As reported Market Rasen needs extensive infrastructure but whether that is a game changer is unknown. Barnetby could be an option. Hopefully will happen particularly after my charity and the Chamber of Commerce have been working on this for over 6 years! We keep in regular contact with LNER.
 

Failed Unit

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£20m!!? That surely will not provide a return in tickets. Wouldn’t be surprised if this route is binned off soon.
I would agree. It will just go through non stop unless someone else funded the work such as Lincolnshire county council. Not knowing what it is that is only going to happen if it benefits all trains that stop there, such as level boarding.

Even then I can’t see £20M making a return on investment.
 
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