Some of the routes and variations make sense (such as the 3 and 21 groups of routes) but others are a bit of a mess. Even using your explanation that 'h' routes go to the hospital. While yes they do, there are also non 'h' routes which go to the hospital like the 5, 5C so if you were waiting for a H service, you'd be letting buses pass you, when they will be going to the right place.
Looks like the H suffixes
terminate at the hospital, whilst the non-suffixes are (hourly) through services? There is a summary timetable, though (something else that's a declining thing in other areas), so you couldn't really be "confused", and it may be designed to dissuade longer-distance passengers?
The 1h for example. It only runs northbound. Southbound from the hospital is just numbered '1'. In which case, remove the 'h' and say the number 1 goes to the hospital on all trips. All current trips on the 1 which don't run to the hospital, could easily be renumbered to be one of the other numbers for the corridor and be short hop versions of another route number (Bus Vannin don't seem to mind 1 route number having trips which terminate early, or having some variations of a route, under a single route number).
Rather than the 1, 2, 11 and 12 all having the 'a' variant to go via Shore Hotel, standardise the trips so maybe the 1 and 11 always go via Shore Hotel. or maybe always the 11 and 12 go that way. You get what I mean. You don't need 4 routes, each with a variation going via Shore Hotel when you can significantly simplify the timetable down so fewer trips have to change. Especially when you look properly into the timetable and can see that through it's kind of standardised but then in the evening, each route swaps whether it goes via Shore Hotel (if a bus runs as an 11 in the day, it becomes 11A at night and the 2A in the day, becomes a 2A at night etc etc).
This all seems reasonable, but presumably there is a reason? Even if it doesn't make sense to us! I noticed on Sundays, for example, that the timetable could be simplified (and match Mon-Sat) if the Shore Hotel journeys were on their usual services, not swapped. However, as there are only two buses and hour doing three buses and hour's thing, maybe it's journey-time related?
14 and 14B. You'd assume the 14B to be a close relative of the 14 but instead they aren't that similar at all and really should be completely different route numbers. 14 runs a completely different way out of Douglas, to the way it runs back in.
Fair. The 14B appears to be a variant of the 4B, though, rather than the 14!
The 15 and 15B, completely separate routes which couldn't be more different. The only thing which is similar between the two, is that they both run Monday, Wednesday and Friday.
I'm not sure they are separate, though, just presented as such. The 15B clearly runs on from the 15 in both directions, so maybe a B to determine which way it leaves Douglas (and a B because it serves Ballabrooie?
The issue I had was that a 17k was noted on the map but not on the timetables page, I found the timetable hidden in the 18k timetable. On the Douglas Town map the 14 isn't shown and 29 seems to not show it's full route. They've tried but there seems to be some issues that they may wish to look at (Praise to them though for doing a lot more than other operators, but maps with missing details, don't help)
All fair. The 29 being shown at all surprises me, as it seems to be a schooldays only route. Unless there are some summer journeys on the Port Soderick section? My 2018/9 timetable shows there used to be two Tuesday/Friday services on the section to Port Soderick.
In fairness, a lot already seems to have been done to simplify services on the Island, especially compared to that 2018/9 timetable. Indeed, some of the services mentioned here stem from those revisions, and there are far fewer things like the 1 having two terminii both with the same number, or that one journey an hour started from the hospital as a 1 but none terminated there, presumably interworking with something else (perhaps service 10)! (Services 26 and 27 were replaced). Service 10 looked like a circular bus wasn't (or if it was, wasn't presented as such with one part continuing to the 1 and the other side disappearing off as something else.
Ultimately, its always necessary to be cautious determining what the cause of the problem is from afar, in a network you may not use regularly (or not at all). My point, broadly, is to question whether it is "network complexity" that it the cause of the issue, or whether it is simply down to the Isle of Man department in charge deciding to have a fully comprehensive network for relatively low fares... I note the 2024 fare increase "from" prices are still the same as in my 2018/9 timetable. I'd guess precisely nowhere on "the mainland" kept fares at the same level for 6 years, and certainly not where the maximum fare (Douglas to Port Erin) is £3.60 (and less is purchased on a Go Places bundle, £2.75 each on a Go Places 12)
Looks like very different designs front designs rather than just printing a small photo onto the card. So unless they print full designs onto cards each time? We have members here who are/were from IoM and so I will let them confirm.
Can't be much different to print a photo to a whole design.
Explore maybe makes sense, and you've used that one as one example, out of the 5, to disprove the point. Just label tickets what they are, Day ticket, week ticket, 28 day ticket etc. 'Go Places' ticket doesn't give any indication that this ticket is packs of singles. 'Go Saver'... well surely all of the tickets that aren't singles or returns will be saver tickets in some way. That 6 single ticket smartcard is a load of rubbish, most you save is 80p. Not even worth offering the card.
Wasn't "disproving" anything, just referring to something similar to what I've seen before. And since when did ticket names ever make sense... Oyster? Key? Tripper? I could say there are more than 6, because there are school and Manx versions, too!
There is no open data feeds I believe. Hence why even on Google Maps you can't plan bus journeys. Normally if anyone can find a feed, Google would be the one. What's more annoying is, they use Ticketer. And given the don't seem to be a dodgy company, I'd recon that they have Ticketer set up fully including schedule adherence or at least having the timetables in their ticketer system, they could probably provide open data quite easily with Ticketers wonderful open data link.
So there are no journey planning feeds, by the looks of it - services are on bustimes (with maps), so presumably it's just a question of how things are linked - possibly a format issue? (i.e. does findmybus use a different format to the BODS GPS format?) Perhaps they have enough experience to know that regular passengers know, tourists will ask (or vaguely work it out), and as an island, you can only go so far wrong?
The findmybus.im link is ok but it doesn't link to a timetable and no destination is shown
Yes - I did find that strange!
and so 2 buses on the same route number close by isn't great, how do you know which bus is coming for you.
There is an arrow showing direction of travel, although I accept there are a few town centre loops (e.g. Peel) where it might be open to confusion.
Is the bus going another way but on diversion? It's a good start, but it's nowhere near what it should be.
Are there any bus company apps that show you that? I live in Arriva-land where the app is so bad the drivers suggest you use bustimes, so I don't generally use company offerings. Who decides what it "should" be? The big question should surely be "Are BV users happy with it" - if they are, then the occasional (or armchair) visitor's opinion doesn't really count.
As you say, though... keen to see what our IoM posters/regular visitors think, or any links to Department of Infrastructure/House of Keys reports. I hope
@Tetchytyke and
@John Luxton won't mind the ping, as neither seem to be regulars on the bus side of the forum.
