Assessments & Medicals discussion

[GunsofNavarone]

There are more Stage One assessments being held next week, so it might be after that.

Ofc, the dates offered for stage one included the 10th-11th December. That makes sense. Thank you

 

[Joeok]

I recently sat my Psychometric tests (passed all of stage 1 and all computer tests first time). However, just got an email saying I had not passed the MMI.

I’m a bit confused as to how because I had relevant examples, always referred to following rules and procedures and adhering to health and safety, spoke about how I can stay calm in emergency and unexpected situations. Genuinely don’t understand how I failed.

My assessor kept on asking me “how would you feel if…” and “how did you do this” and I stayed calm, kept on answering but sometimes when I got asked these questions, it didn’t actually make sense with the context of the answer I had given. But I still formed an answer regardless.

Also, surely passing all the psychometric tests shows that I have relevant skills and experiences to work as a depot driver.

Lastly, I tried following the STAR technique but it’s difficult when you get interrupted with hypothetical questions.

Any advise would be helpful, and would be good to know if there’s anyone else that is / has been in a similar position to me.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 4 Dec 2024 ==

I recently sat my Psychometric tests (passed all of stage 1 and all computer tests first time). However, just got an email saying I had not passed the MMI.

I’m a bit confused as to how because I had relevant examples, always referred to following rules and procedures and adhering to health and safety, spoke about how I can stay calm in emergency and unexpected situations. Genuinely don’t understand how I failed.

My assessor kept on asking me “how would you feel if…” and “how did you do this” and I stayed calm, kept on answering but sometimes when I got asked these questions, it didn’t actually make sense with the context of the answer I had given. But I still formed an answer regardless.

Also, surely passing all the psychometric tests shows that I have relevant skills and experiences to work as a depot driver.

Lastly, I tried following the STAR technique but it’s difficult when you get interrupted with hypothetical questions.

Any advise would be helpful, and would be good to know if there’s anyone else that is / has been in a similar position to me.

*relevant skills, not experience

 

[MH117]

I’m in the same boat, it was for trainee driver at TPE. Answered brilliantly, after passing everything else first try to an enhanced standard.
Was told I failed despite getting ‘5/6’ with the failed question being the first one which is when you’re getting into the rhythm of it. Quite obvious I can do what they need as I passed the next 5. Very harsh process

 

[Joeok]

I’m in the same boat, it was for trainee driver at TPE. Answered brilliantly, after passing everything else first try to an enhanced standard.
Was told I failed despite getting ‘5/6’ with the failed question being the first one which is when you’re getting into the rhythm of it. Quite obvious I can do what they need as I passed the next 5. Very harsh process

I understand having to pass all written and computer tests as it highlights whether you’re competent enough to do the job but the MMI just seems very harsh, especially when you have to do a DMI anyway. I’ve asked for feedback and been told it can take weeks to receive a call.

 

[marcy]

I recently sat my Psychometric tests (passed all of stage 1 and all computer tests first time). However, just got an email saying I had not passed the MMI.

I’m a bit confused as to how because I had relevant examples, always referred to following rules and procedures and adhering to health and safety, spoke about how I can stay calm in emergency and unexpected situations. Genuinely don’t understand how I failed.

My assessor kept on asking me “how would you feel if…” and “how did you do this” and I stayed calm, kept on answering but sometimes when I got asked these questions, it didn’t actually make sense with the context of the answer I had given. But I still formed an answer regardless.

Also, surely passing all the psychometric tests shows that I have relevant skills and experiences to work as a depot driver.

Lastly, I tried following the STAR technique but it’s difficult when you get interrupted with hypothetical questions.

Any advise would be helpful, and would be good to know if there’s anyone else that is / has been in a similar position to me.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 4 Dec 2024 ==


*relevant skills, not experience

Been there very recently , this was my second attempt, passed 1st stage, passed DMI, passed all 2nd stage computer tests, 3 of us all shook hands at being told we passed. Then the MMI, which I had been told was like an ‘informal chat’, it was anything but, over an hour of constant grilling, other 2 candidates left well before me,
Thought I had answered all the questions to the best of my ability , but 8 days later got the email saying I didn’t meet standard on 2 questions. Very brutal process after passing all the other tests,
What I find strange is it’s one person from the recruitment team who has the final say on whether you pass the whole assessment process.
Still not over it !!

 

[AverageJoe]

With the MMI there is certain markers that need to be hit. The assessor is not able to be swayed or have a preference, it’s literally down to did you score enough.

The DMI however is more your chance to impress your future managers.

Although you may feel you did well it doesn’t necessarily you did, as none of us know exactly what they are looking for.

And as regards the comments about proving one has a what it takes to do the job, well unfortunately for those there are still many that pass all the tests and do get the job, there is no shortage of them.

Hopefully you will have better success next time.

 

[KenKenny]

I have my second stage assessment on Friday for Irish rail train driver. Its OPC. Im trying to get info or software to practice the VSE stage. My wife did it today and said its very challenging. You have to follow a route on one side of the screen and check for errors on the other side at the same time.

I cant find anything to practice with. Is there any torrents or programs online?

 

[Doyle]

Hello Everyone

I have been monitoring this forum for some time now and it has been a great help.

I have just applied for an Apprentice Driver Role at a local TOC, but have a query regarding medical standards if I may.

When I was 9 years old I had a single tonic-clonic seizure (convulsions) I was admitted to a hospital where a number of tests were conducted. This was put down as a single episode and I never received any medication or further treatment. The doctors said that sometimes due to development in children, they can have one-off seizures. It certainly wasn't put down as epilepsy or anything like that. Since that day I have never suffered any other medical episodes and have a flawless medical record.

I have searched the forum and seen a question regarding someone with diagnosed epilepsy asking a similar question, but would anyone have any knowledge as to whether this would prevent me from meeting the required standard for a driver?

I have looked up the standards on the RSSB and they state the medical practitioner would need to believe you have a condition that could lead to blackouts, sudden loss of consciousness etc etc. I would struggle to see how someone could believe I would suffer from one of those bearing in mind it was over 30 years ago!

All the best

Hi,

How did your medical go? Did you have to get documentation from your GP to prove your one off incident wouldn’t occur again?
Or did it bar you from becoming a driver and failing the medical?

 

[niceman]

Hi all
Do they give you your results on the day or do they not?

Is everything you are tested on a simple pass or fail... fail 1 thing you fail the whole medical.

Thanks

 

[AverageJoe]

It can take a few weeks. Your drug test will need to be sent to a lab and there are others likely being tested in the meantime so the toc will contact you when they have information and time probably.

Unless you went in there with concerns a or previous issues you can probably tell from the medical examiners reaction if it was ok or not.

 

[SuperS16v]

Yes they will tell you straight away after every test if you meet the required standard. Obviously this is pending your drugs test that will need to be sent off. No news is good news with that one.

If you have any other medical conditions they may ask you to obtain additional evidence.

 

[Spider1806]

Brief overview of Assessment Center Stage 2 now that I've completed it twice both times passing.

If stage one is what you're looking for then an overview is here: Stage One Assessment Day Overview

The Day starts off with the WAFV, followed by ATAVT and then 2 hand coordination test. In both my experiences the results are shortly given to you on a one to one meeting after the tests. It lasts about 52 Mins to 1Hr for the assessment part of the day, if your TOC does the MMI on the same day then that will happen after X amount of time on that day and only after the SJE and Pre Questionnaire sheet is filled.


WAFV
Known as a Vigilance test, it lasts about 30mins and you're expected to react only when the flashing grey square turns Black. As others have said on this forum, you will be given a practice set before starting the real test and it shows you clearly the difference between the Grey square and Black Square. An example shown below:

View attachment 151541
The Normal Shade, you do not react to this at all.

View attachment 151539
The Black square, you're expected to react to it by pressing a Green Button.

View attachment 151542

I completed the examples and started the test. It felt faster for me, time duration-wise, than the times I practiced it. I practiced for 1 week every day before the assessment using a tool called Rail Test Preparation, which has a few other tests on it and, in my opinion, replicated the WAFV very well. But then again, it's really only a flashing grey square that turns dark black .

The frequency of the black square was very manageable. I found ways to keep up my attention by adding in a tiny bit of distraction. For example, I ended up learning exactly how far away, test-wise, those sitting the test with me were. As I started first, I knew the person next to me was about 10 seconds behind, and the one after them, 25 behind, and the other 10 seconds behind that individual. Moving my focus to different corners of the squares rather than a whole head adjustment also corrected any loss of focus or blurriness, which will start to happen if you focus too long.

I personally didn't experience it, but some experienced a color disorientation in which the square appears to be getting darker and darker than it truly is. This led to misclicks, and in some cases, I heard several presses of the green button by a lass in the corner, of which I knew I hadn't encountered any part of the test that required that amount of button pressing. Thus, as we later discovered, they were false clicks as the disorientation had happened. Sadly, went down by 3 after that test, out of 5 down to mainly that.

I often like to understand why I do a test, and from the experience, I could tell that this test, as the name suggests, will test your ability to concentrate for an extended period of time and your reaction over that said time. As something gets monotonous, your mind can tend to lag, and the test wants to see if what starts off as a simple task can then become a difficult task for an individual, which could highlight an area of risk in train operation.

Tips for the test from my experience:

1. Get yourself comfortable and in position, this matters a lot as you don't want to make any adjustments as much later, Your hand that will be used to press the button should be relaxed and of free movement to do so.
2. Make sure you've used the toilet, kept a bottle of water near you but not distractingly close and any distractions on yourself like a Phone etc has been removed. You'll need to be of full attention.
3. Don't overthink the test, there is only ever two shades and the two shades are exactly the same two you will see in the practice examples. They do not change mid test.
4. Use the headphones for some noise dampening
5. Relax once again, wait only for the square to go black before you react, It also gives you a bit of a hint that you've reacted to the Black square by the screen staying white for about 1 second more than usual before flashing to whatever the next shade of square is.

ATAVT
The test I worried about on both occasions but ended up passing it to very high standard. Its a test of visual perception. You are shown an image for about 1 second of a street or traffic and asked to later state what you see. The options were similar to:

View attachment 151544

ATAVT Similar Video

You're given practice examples, as with the WAFV. It's important to note that the practice run will tell you that you've got the question wrong if you do not get all the items correct and will reshare the photo for you to select the correct ones. However, this does not mean that in the real test you need every item!!! Just select honestly what you saw and do not try to guess. You're negatively marked down on wrong answers, not missed answers. Just because you may have seen a pedestrian crossing a road doesn't mean they did so at a traffic light; it could have been a zebra crossing. Unless you remember exactly what it was, then don't assume.

On the device its these buttons for the test:

View attachment 151545

The green button is only used to move to the next image; you're allowed to control when you move to the next set of images. I think there were 17-20 images in all, with about 12 minutes total time estimated. I just focused on the center of the images. My eyes were able to make out the big objects like cars and glowing objects like traffic lights, while I could check for people, cyclists, and road signs. It went quite well in my opinion, much better than what I expected. Once again, a test that you really shouldn't overthink.

I think it's self-explanatory with why you're tested on this, but briefly, as a driver, you'd be expected to have a decent level of visual recall, especially at some operational speeds of over 100mph. You'll need to be able to pick out details that often will be oblivious to others, and all that in a restricted amount of time while staying calm.

Tips for the test from my experience:

1. Get yourself comfortable and in position, if you're using glasses then wipe those as you don't want fog to cause you issues.
2. Don't overthink the test, only click the number relevant to the answer that you've seen(this becomes clear on the day but on the test device the numbers correspond to the answer you want to select).
3. Take as much time as you realistically need before moving onto the next but not too long as you'll find yourself pandering over what you've seen and in some cases you might recreate the actual image you last remember seeing in your head.
4. Make sure if you haven't already to have adjusted the sound in your headset. The audio beep that plays before the image is shown is important and you don't want it too quiet yet too loud.
5. Relax, ideally you should have found a focus point on the test practice examples in which you will be aiming to focus on for all the images. Use the practice examples to the max before starting the real test on the day!

2 Hand Coordination
Like the ATAVT there isn't much that can prepare you for this test, you either have the ability or don't but your day to day life may have used the certain fine motor skills and hand eye coordination required for the test itself. The main area that makes it hard to practice the test is that the Joysticks:

View attachment 151546

Do not feel like most conventional joysticks and are thus harder to replicate with dual-shock joysticks like those on the Playstation, etc. However, they do flick back slowly to the neutral position, so bear in mind this if you let go during the test. The left joystick controls only the right and left movement of the ball and is restricted to this axis, while the right controls the up and down movement of the ball and is also restricted to this axis.

The real test will look somewhat similar to below:

You are given a practice round first, which involves simply moving the ball to a Point marked B. There's no track in this example. Use the examples to get a feel for positioning; I found that holding the joysticks halfway worked best for me, so you'll need to experiment for yourself. These examples are not timed, and it's up to you to move on by moving the ball to the destination marked B.

Another example after the first practice stage is the circuit itself, and this is your last chance to adjust your audio, find a feel for placement on the joystick, and get to grips with the test. Once you complete the circuit, the test is next. It should take about 10 minutes, estimated, and there are a few tracks. You'll go out for sure in this test; I went out on the first 4 about 3 times each, and there is a clear audio beep telling you this. Try not to panic and just get back on track. I'm very sure they can see how you react to the audio beep, especially if the ball right after increases the distance it's already fallen off the track by.

Going off track isn't too much of a problem; just try not to be too frequent with it. How quickly you get back on track is very important. You'll feel yourself getting better. All 10 track test attempts are the same, The circuit doesn't change at all, its the same Circuit/ Track as the first attempt and which at the time of writing is again similar to the picture above. By test attempt 7, I was going off the track only once on each, with the 10th not coming off at all. You'll improve as you go along.

I don't really have any tips for this one as it's basically a game of ability here.

Hopefully, you're called in after the suite of tests is done and are told you've passed. In which case, you may do the MMI on the day and be told how the final part of that day will proceed. The MMI is so well covered in this forum that I'd be repeating lots of already valuable information on here. Best of luck!

The joystick one is there a timer?

 

[Brum_AVFC]

I have my second stage assessment on Friday for Irish rail train driver. Its OPC. Im trying to get info or software to practice the VSE stage. My wife did it today and said its very challenging. You have to follow a route on one side of the screen and check for errors on the other side at the same time.

I cant find anything to practice with. Is there any torrents or programs online?

Dynamic Visual Search Awareness And Comparison Test | Trainee Train Driver Info

This product is for anyone: who wants to become a train driver, a signaller, a controller who has an interest in getting a job in the railway industry seeking to improve their cognitive skills such as attention, visual and observational skills wanting to improve their reaction time in a calm and...

traineetraindriverinfo.com

 

[Spider1806]

Hi can anyone tell me the computer 2 hand coordination test is there a timer with it?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 8 Dec 2024 ==

eyesight test at medical - is this a straight forward eye test?

 

[Samsanbor]

Yes, there is a timer.

Eye test, is a standard eye test plus color blindness test.

 

[Spider1806]

Yes, there is a timer.

Eye test, is a standard eye test plus color blindness test.

so is the idea you have to do it as quickly as possible? The test that is

 

[Samsanbor]

so is the idea you have to do it as quickly as possible? The test that is

No, the test is about a balance of speed and accuracy.
You will have to guide the ball through the circuit for X number of times within a Y time limit and trying to go off the track as little as possible.

 

[Spider1806]

I get you…. Heard it’s the same track 10 times

 

[Unobrow]

I get you…. Heard it’s the same track 10 times

Nobody knows any of the criteria for any of the tests. Just concentrate on doing what you’ve got to do and don’t listen to “I’ve heard it’s……….” You’ll just put pressure on yourself for no reason.

 

[Amnesiac]

I get you…. Heard it’s the same track 10 times

This is from the process tips thread linked in post 1 of this thread

2HAND – The practice materials tell you what this test is about. The joysticks are very sensitive, which I think is the point! The left joystick goes left and right; the right joystick goes up and down. My best tip is that if you go outside of the lines, just come back in again as quickly as you can. You have 2 practice attempts which is good to get used to the joysticks. In the test, you do it 10 times and will likely get better as you go along. On a couple of my attempts I went out of the lines several times, but still passed, so don’t panic if you do – just bring the ball back in and keep going. You wear headphones for this and hear a beep if you go out the lines.

 

[DNCharingX]

As of yesterday’s update to the standard, do people now have three lives?

 

[Brum_AVFC]

As of yesterday’s update to the standard, do people now have three lives?

Can’t see any topics/news about this?

 

[nolypops83]

Can’t see any topics/news about this?

I think he's referring to this.

Log in to keep reading

Register to the RSSB website and access more content.

www.rssb.co.uk

 

[Ducatichick]

I think he's referring to this.

Log in to keep reading

Register to the RSSB website and access more content.

www.rssb.co.uk

Edited. Sorry just seen a thread posted about the changes.

 

[Unobrow]

This is from the process tips thread linked in post 1 of this thread

You’re correct, I should have worded that better. No one knows what the criteria is for errors and management of them. I didn’t even count how many times I had gone round, just concentrated on what I was doing (it felt like an eternity) and correcting any errors I made. If you’re thinking about how many times you’ve been round, and are nearly finished, you’re concentrating less on the task at hand.

 

[Doyle]

Hi there,
I’m looking at applying for a trainee driver position, but would like to know about the medical and wether they disqualify you if you have had one blackout in your life or if they do further investigations and tests to see if you are compromised or are fit to proceed in a driver capacity?

 

[12guard4]

As of yesterday’s update to the standard, do people now have three lives?

New applicants get 3 lives.
If you have ever attempted a test before you have 2 lives still.

 

[LCC106]

Hi there,
I’m looking at applying for a trainee driver position, but would like to know about the medical and wether they disqualify you if you have had one blackout in your life or if they do further investigations and tests to see if you are compromised or are fit to proceed in a driver capacity?

Just declare everything truthfully and they will take everything on a case by case basis. It may depend on how long ago it was, the circumstances surrounding it etc. A blackout on one occasion alone that can be explained may not necessarily hold you back.

 

[joseph0210]

Just done mine this afternoon passed everything but the bourdon test. So wasn’t allowed to do the MMI, Very frustrating to have to wait a minimum of a year to get this over the line but is what it is unfortunately hopefully be worth the wait. We go again

 

[Stubbs91]

Just done mine this afternoon passed everything but the bourdon test. So wasn’t allowed to do the MMI, Very frustrating to have to wait a minimum of a year to get this over the line but is what it is unfortunately hopefully be worth the wait. We go again

What company was this for mate?