Delay repay query

[modernrail]

I posted a slightly inaccurate version of this query so am reposting to clarify.

Since the new nonsense on tickets being fake sold out has started, I have started to buy off peak tickets for the weekend, in person from the booking office at my local station. I did it last week because Avanti were at it on the Glasgow service and today the same on some of the Liverpool services. I am not buying from Euston as I don’t want to deal with any Avanti staff, nor whatever version of whatever they fancy programming into the ticket machines has appeared since I was last there. In contrast I go to the friendly guy at my local station who gives me a ticket when I ask for a ticket that I am permitted to buy, which is now a mind blowing concept on the railway.

The train I wanted to catch has been cancelled. I couldn’t travel any earlier because of commitments in London. I have caught the train an hour later.

There were options in between but they involve changes onto trains I know might be packed and not much time saving.

As far as I am concerned I have been delayed by an hour and caught the next available service. Am I entitled to delay repay?

 

[_toommm_]

You're absolutely entitled to claim delay repay - the fact that you were on a flexible ticket without a 'mandatory reservation' doesn't change that.

Delay Repay is done mostly on the honour system, so unless you've got a vast history of fraudulent claims, I can't see an issue arising with you claiming.

 

[modernrail]

You're absolutely entitled to claim delay repay - the fact that you were on a flexible ticket without a 'mandatory reservation' doesn't change that.

Delay Repay is done mostly on the honour system, so unless you've got a vast history of fraudulent claims, I can't see an issue arising with you claiming.

Thanks for the reply toommm, much appreciated.

 

[Belperpete]

Agreed that you are entitled to claim. However, they will calculate your delay based on the next available service to get you to your destination. If you chose to travel on a later train than that, then any extra delay was your choice, and is unlikely to be factored into the delay calculation. You may therefore not get paid for an hour's delay.

 

[modernrail]

Agreed that you are entitled to claim. However, they will calculate your delay based on the next available service to get you to your destination. If you chose to travel on a later train than that, then any extra delay was your choice, and is unlikely to be factored into the delay calculation. You may therefore not get paid for an hour's delay.

Even if that involved a number of changes? I sort of get that but also don’t. That assumes that there was capacity on the connections for 9 or 11 coach loads of passengers to fit into what was probably already a packed more local service. The call I made was to stay and get the next service rather than risk being left on a platform on route - which I think is very reasonable.

 

[Haywain]

There were options in between but they involve changes onto trains I know might be packed and not much time saving.

It's difficult to comment on whether that's reasonable or not without knowing the journey involved. But it's not unfair to argue that if you chose to further delay your journey that is down to you and not the train operator.

 

[modernrail]

It's difficult to comment on whether that's reasonable or not without knowing the journey involved. But it's not unfair to argue that if you chose to further delay your journey that is down to you and not the train operator.

It is London to Liverpool.

The change is either onto the Birmingham service at Stafford. That service is often rammed and leaves people behind on the weekend. That would save 20 mins on the next direct service.

The other option is two changes onto Northern at Warrington and Newton le Willows onto northern. That would get you in 6 mins before the next direct service. If both northern services turn up. Which would be verging on a miracle these days.

As it happens, I have just checked RTT and the Birmingham service was cancelled. It was showing as running when I checked at Euston. So it turns out I did not ‘chose to further delay my journey’. I correctly guessed the railway is unable to deliver reliable connections at the moment because cancellation levels are way too high on lots of routes.

I do think where it is a cancellation, you should be entitled to get the next direct service and claim delay repay for the full gap. After all, it is the railway, not me that chose to delay my journey in the first place.

Is the other point that with an advance or Avanti only ticket, I couldn’t have used it on those connections anyway? I happened to have a ticket I could use with any operator but might not have. It is unreasonable to expect passengers to find new connections, check the connections are running, check ticket acceptance is in place where needed and then get to that train. In this case that next train left 3 minutes later. With Euston closing the gate 2 mins before - basically impossible. Even if 20 mins or so would rely on staff being around to confirm acceptance etc.

Yes you can potentially check some of this online but delay repay should not be set up to expect you to have done this. You should be able to turn up for an advertised service and then deal with the fall out there and then. That should be the base assumption.

 

[JBuchananGB]

Submit the claim to Avanti. The system asks you to insert your intended itinerary and then decides on your claim. Don’t be surprised it comes out at 59 minutes if the one hour later train made good time!

 

[Belperpete]

I do think where it is a cancellation, you should be entitled to get the next direct service and claim delay repay for the full gap. After all, it is the railway, not me that chose to delay my journey in the first place.

That.might work for routes where there are regular through services, but would not be reasonable for routes on which most journeys involve a change, and only a few through services, such as Euston - Chester. Where do you draw the line?

The alternatives you have mentioned seem involve taking very different routes, rather than just requiring an additional en-route change or two which your original post suggested. As far as I can tell from my claims, they seem to base the calculation on you taking the same route as your original itinerary. Again, there are probably exceptions to this where it would not be reasonable to do so.

 

[modernrail]

That.might work for routes where there are regular through services, but would not be reasonable for routes on which most journeys involve a change, and only a few through services, such as Euston - Chester. Where do you draw the line?

The alternatives you have mentioned seem involve taking very different routes, rather than just requiring an additional en-route change or two which your original post suggested. As far as I can tell from my claims, they seem to base the calculation on you taking the same route as your original itinerary. Again, there are probably exceptions to this where it would not be reasonable to do so.

Thanks. Let’s see what happens. Sounds like there is more discretion in the system than I probably realised which is interesting.

 

[1955LR]

The alternatives you have mentioned seem involve taking very different routes, rather than just requiring an additional en-route change or two which your original post suggested. As far as I can tell from my claims, they seem to base the calculation on you taking the same route as your original itinerary. Again, there are probably exceptions to this where it would not be reasonable to do so.

A couple of times my train from Birmingham New St to Great Malvern has been cancelled, next direct train is usually 1 Hour later . Checked with ticket office & they have suggested getting the next Cardiff train from New St, changing at Worcester Parkway onto the GWR Hereford train arriving at Great Malvern 45 mins later than planned. Put in a delay claim to West Midland Trains for the 30 plus mins delay and paid out 1hr Plus payment. I have quired this and advised the calculation is correct. The delay system does seem to work on getting the next direct train rather than rerouting. Ticket type - Anytime day Return Great Malvern -Birmingham International .

 

[Haywain]

The delay system does seem to work on getting the next direct train rather than rerouting.

I don't think it is reasonable to assume that because one case was applied on that basis it will apply across the board.