Marshlink - Longer trains, extra services

[TheJRB]

We spent a couple of hours at Ashford today (specifically to see the Orient Express) and noticed that the Ashford to Brighton services have been extended from two cars to four with some being a combination of two 171/7s and others just a 171/8 (here's a video I took of a 171804 at Ashford today:
http://youtu.be/goh8hlrgm0Y)

But that wasn't the only surprise; Southern have also introduced the Rye shuttle off-peak. I don't know if this is still provided by a single 171/7 as both hours we were there, the service was cancelled due to delays.

I'm extremely pleased that Southern have increased the capacity of these services and introduced an off-peak Rye shuttle, even though it's only a trial. If I remember correctly though, didn't Network Rail advise against increasing services on the Marshlink Line? Seems like Southern thought otherwise.

Anybody have any further details about this, or is this all that is known at the moment?

 

[OxtedL]

Ermm... I have no clue where they got the stock from...? We need it up here!

Sometimes when there is an event on, they send extra down to Marshlink for the weekend, so maybe that's what has happened?

As far as a I am aware (bear in mind there is no reason for me to actually know, however), in normal service it is still hourly, and still only using 2-car DMUs.

For a Saturday service, Uckfield only needs 3 x 171/8s (and some of these can potentially be subbed by 171/7s, although that typically means overcrowding in the afternoon/early evening), so all the rest ought to be free.

 

[TheJRB]

Ermm... I have no clue where they got the stock from...? We need it up here!

Sometimes when there is an event on, they send extra down to Marshlink for the weekend, so maybe that's what has happened?

As far as a I am aware (bear in mind there is no reason for me to actually know, however), in normal service it is still hourly, and still only using 2-car DMUs.

For a Saturday service, Uckfield only needs 3 x 171/8s (and some of these can potentially be subbed by 171/7s, although that typically means overcrowding in the afternoon/early evening), so all the rest ought to be free.

Perhaps it will remain Saturday only if they decide to keep the longer Ashford to Brighton services. Admittedly, I did wonder how they would do it with the limited amount of stock.

 

[Nym]

I've got a great way for Marshlink to get more trains, electrify it...

I'm sure that a nice southern 4car EMU would fit nicely on the route.

 

[ji459]

I happened to take the Marshlink today (to and from Eastbourne) and was just as surprised as TheJRB to see 4 coaches standing on the platform when I arrived! I asked the conductor and he said that it was a trial run (I think on Sunday as well) with a view to introducing 4-coach services at weekends only. As it happens, the tennis at Eastbourne started today, so it was either good luck or good planning to run the trial this weekend! OxtedL is right and the stock that was used is from the Uckfield to London Bridge service. I was so excited I forgot to ask the conductor what stock they'll use at weekends!

 

[TheJRB]

I've got a great way for Marshlink to get more trains, electrify it...

I'm sure that a nice southern 4car EMU would fit nicely on the route.

Good idea, but I think Network Rail needs a significant amount of convincing before that happens.

 

[OxtedL]

Indeed, all the 4-cars are based in Selhurst, along with (I understand) half of the 2-cars. Most of this sits around in the off peak, so if there is summer weekend overcrowding on the Marshlink, this would be a very good use of stock.

An operational difficulty, of course, as you have to get it to/from Selhurst and stable it while its down each weekend, but I'm sure it could work.

This is still news to me, can anyone with inside knowledge shed any light? I can't see anything on the Southern website...


On the subject of electrification (mistake no. 1 - getting me started on electrification ), Marshlink would be an ultimately sensible line to electrify, at the same time as the Uckfield, and would of course mean you could have a go at unlocking some potential. For instance, send the CHX - Ashford stoppers onto Rye, perhaps... But this is a whole different game entirely.

 

[TheJRB]

I asked the conductor and he said that it was a trial run (I think on Sunday as well) with a view to introducing 4-coach services at weekends only.!

Thanks for the information.

This is still news to me, can anyone with inside knowledge shed any light? I can't see anything on the Southern website...


On the subject of electrification (mistake no. 1 - getting me started on electrification ), Marshlink would be an ultimately sensible line to electrify, at the same time as the Uckfield, and would of course mean you could have a go at unlocking some potential. For instance, send the CHX - Ashford stoppers onto Rye, perhaps... But this is a whole different game entirely.

I too was surprised that there's no mention of this on their site.

Regarding electrification, I was quite pleased that the Marshlink wasn't today because the heat from the 171 was nice in the cold rain and hail.

 

[pendolino]

Indeed, all the 4-cars are based in Selhurst, along with (I understand) half of the 2-cars. Most of this sits around in the off peak, so if there is summer weekend overcrowding on the Marshlink, this would be a very good use of stock.

An operational difficulty, of course, as you have to get it to/from Selhurst and stable it while its down each weekend, but I'm sure it could work.

This is still news to me, can anyone with inside knowledge shed any light? I can't see anything on the Southern website...

There's a regular (nightly I think) 171 ECS working from the coast to Selhurst for servicing and back again (worked by an Eastbourne driver, but piloted into the depot by a Norwood driver, as Eastbourne don't sign Selhurst depot) so it wouldn't be too hard to get extra stock to the coast for the Marshlink services.

 

[Benno]

It looks like the four car strengthening was a one-off for yesterday as there was a "Reds over Rye" carnival on at Rye (with a red arrows fly past)

The Ashford - Rye shuttles started at 13.55 and continued until 17.30. They are not booked for next Saturday

 

[Fincra5]

Well when I was working past on a service to Ore the turbos (4car) looked very busy. Maybe it was just because of that "Reds over Rye". It is a very popular route in the summer and definitely could benefit from 4 cars.

 

[Hydro]

It's always a fairly popular route. I've had occasion to go down that way a few times, and the two car unit was always very full, especially once into Sussex.

In my eyes, along with Guildford - Redhill, this route is crying out for con rail.

 

[TheJRB]

The four car 171s are running again today on the Marshlink line, so I don't think the extended trains were a one-off, although as you point out, the Rye shuttle was.

 

[ushawk]

Was wondering why the 0758 EBN - AFK this morning was a 4 car, the line would be better as 4-car services (especially between EBN and BTN as services between there are often standing only, even though this section is electrified.)

And was unusual as i never saw any advertisement from Southern about the additional shuttles, unlike with something like the Rye Carnival, where theres an amended service.

 

[Fincra5]

Might have had something to do with the Tennis at Eastbourne?

 

[ushawk]

Maybe, would be a good way to trial it through that too, wonder if it will happen for next week too for the Tennis (if it does, is there enough carriages to cover the Uckfield services).

 

[OxtedL]

There is no way they could do it. Uckfield is full without stock missing. Weekends only.

They can probably cover off peak crowding with longer electric coastway services, I would hope.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
I have just recalled that during the off-peak there is a spare unit (used for the Rye shuttle) which could plausibly be used to lengthen a couple of services if absolutely necessary.

 

[455refurb]

Sometimes I get late evening Bexhill - London Victoria services which originate at Ore, and have been surprised that a 171 has turned up on more than one occasion (and can end up running late by Lewes). Maybe that's something to do with movements to Selhurst.

Marshlink will be well served by a lengthening of stock though. I'm sure the campaigners are very happy about this

 

[TheJRB]

As expected, back to single 171/7s again now for the weekdays. Saw 171721 and 171725 today.

I just hope Southern keep the four car weekend Marshlink services without the Uckfield service losing out.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Sadly, it's back to single 171/7s again this weekend, so I suppose it was a short 'trial'! As expected, some overcrowding again, even from Ashford.

 

[377Southern]

I regularly travel on this service and is always overcrowded, in particular the sections between Brighton - Lewes, Eastbourne - Hastings and Hastings to Ashford. The other parts are still busy but not as much. Even the last service from Brighton is fairly busy. I have always thought that 4 car are needed or even as i had when i lived in scotland 3 car 170's? The 2 car just is too short for the high usage on the line, mainly due to the fact it only operates hourly.

But interestingly, i went past Eastbourne station at around 6.30pm and there was a 171/8 on a service to Ashford today.

 

[N Levers]

Why did they stop using the hastings diesel a few years back? That could provide a slight capacity upgrade. Even just using it as the standby/Rye peak shuttle would free up one 2 car unit.

 

[yorksrob]

I believe they used to use it to fill in when one of the Hampshire or Sussex units weren't available. However, this stopped when the new units came in.

Very good to see the Marshlink thriving. It really is about time they got on with an infill electrification scheme.

 

[TheJRB]

But interestingly, i went past Eastbourne station at around 6.30pm and there was a 171/8 on a service to Ashford today.

Interesting. I saw 171724 working on its own at Ashford on Saturday.

 

[N Levers]

Is there any chance that the Hastings unit could be used again.

Using it as a full diagram could increase capacity on the Marshlink by just under 50%. Even just using it on the Rye peak shuttle could increase capacity by just over 25%.

 

[yorksrob]

There's no technical reason why they couldn't use it again. It's exempt from the Mark 1 bans and has central door locking precisely to allow it to be used on normal passenger services.

They would have to fit around HDL's own railtours and other commitments. Whether Southern would want to be seen to revert to somewhat more elderly thumpers so soon after replacing them would be another matter (even though HDL's is rather lovely to travel in )

I was on the Marshlink today and it was quite gratifying to see it choc a block both ways between Ashford and Rye mid-day on a work day, and this for a local line which was considered for closure !