Received intended prosecution letter

[Throwaway22946]

The other week I received a letter about a ticket an inspector had found me without. I regret it. It was stupid and I have already learnt my lesson.

On the letter they spoke about intended prosecution and to email mitigation.

However I have sent multiple emails and they have not replied and it won't be long before the date in which they said they will automatically pass it to court.

The letter didn't mention paying a fine but I emailed admitting my guilt and offering to pay a fine.

I really don't want this to end up at court and I'm really stressed. Any advice would be much appreciated.

 

[notmyrealname]

Hi.

Could you show us their letter and any othere paperwork you had from them, please? Cover up your name, address and their reference number to keep this anonymous for you.

 

[Fermiboson]

Agreed that seeing the text of the letter and potentially the replies you sent will be useful. I don't think TOCs often send something by mail then expect you to reply by email, so you may want to double check your mail to make sure you haven't missed any correspondence.

Is it Chiltern or Transport Investigations Ltd (TIL) who have contacted you? The latter is notorious for needing multiple prods before they will agree to an out of court settlement.*

*To be pedantic, you want to pay a settlement, not a fine; a fine is issued by a court on conviction while a settlement does not involve any court and is an agreement by the TOC not to prosecute in exchange for some monetary amount.

 

[Throwaway22946]

Hi.

Could you show us their letter and any othere paperwork you had from them, please? Cover up your name, address and their reference number to keep this anonymous for you.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 27 Oct 2024 ==

Agreed that seeing the text of the letter and potentially the replies you sent will be useful. I don't think TOCs often send something by mail then expect you to reply by email, so you may want to double check your mail to make sure you haven't missed any correspondence.

Is it Chiltern or Transport Investigations Ltd (TIL) who have contacted you? The latter is notorious for needing multiple prods before they will agree to an out of court settlement.*

*To be pedantic, you want to pay a settlement, not a fine; a fine is issued by a court on conviction while a settlement does not involve any court and is an agreement by the TOC not to prosecute in exchange for some monetary amount.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 27 Oct 2024 ==

Agreed that seeing the text of the letter and potentially the replies you sent will be useful. I don't think TOCs often send something by mail then expect you to reply by email, so you may want to double check your mail to make sure you haven't missed any correspondence.

Is it Chiltern or Transport Investigations Ltd (TIL) who have contacted you? The latter is notorious for needing multiple prods before they will agree to an out of court settlement.*

*To be pedantic, you want to pay a settlement, not a fine; a fine is issued by a court on conviction while a settlement does not involve any court and is an agreement by the TOC not to prosecute in exchange for some monetary amount.

I have just attached a photo of the letter. Bearing the photo in mind do you think it is worth sending them the same email I have a couple more times and what is the likely outcome at this stage?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 27 Oct 2024 ==

Hi.

Could you show us their letter and any othere paperwork you had from them, please? Cover up your name, address and their reference number to keep this anonymous for you.

I have just sent a photo of the letter I received I believe if I'm using the website correctly

 

[John R]

If you replied to the email address quoted then you just have to wait for their response. Sending multiple chasers is not in your interest and may just annoy them.

Just make sure that there is nothing lurking in your spam or other folders that you have missed.

 

[Throwaway22946]

If you replied to the email address quoted then you just have to wait for their response. Sending multiple chasers is not in your interest and may just annoy them.

Just make sure that there is nothing lurking in your spam or other folders that you have missed.

But if they don't reply soon what if this gets passed to court because it says no response in 14 days and that's what happens

 

[John R]

But if they don't reply soon what if this gets passed to court because it says no response in 14 days and that's what happens

But presumably you have responded, and within the 14 days? If so you just have to be patient. If you sent it by email then there should be no doubt that they have got it.

 

[Throwaway22946]

But presumably you have responded, and within the 14 days? If so you just have to be patient. If you sent it by email then there should be no doubt that they have got it

Well I sincerely hope you're right but I don't want them passing it to court. What do you think is the most likely outcome at this stage do you think they will still want to prosecute or agree to a settlement?

 

[John R]

If you post what you wrote we might be able to give an opinion as to how they respond. Letters that are drafted with the help of posters here have a very high success rate, but of course that may be true for all the responses they get - we’re not in a position to know that of course.

 

[Throwaway22946]

If you post what you wrote we might be able to give an opinion as to how they respond. Letters that are drafted with the help of posters here have a very high success rate, but of course that may be true for all the responses they get - we’re not in a position to know that of course.

I fully accepted responsibility, explained I made a mistake and agreed there is no real excuse. I genuinely believe those things by the way. I expressed remorse and offered to pay the fare and the fine.

 

[Hadders]

Chiltern normally offer an out of court settlement to people who do-operate with their investigation, and who haven’t come to their attention before.

They deal with hundreds of these cases as a time and it can take a time for them to reply to you. You’ll just have to wait for your reply to come to the top of the pile.

 

[Throwaway22946]

Chiltern normally offer an out of court settlement to people who do-operate with their investigation, and who haven’t come to their attention before.

They deal with hundreds of these cases as a time and it can take a time for them to reply to you. You’ll just have to wait for your reply to come to the top of the pile.

So is that what you think they'll do in this case having seen the letter I received and the fact I emailed back admitting guilt and wishing to pay the fine+ticket fare? I'm really anxious to get this resolved and know that they won't want to escalate it to prosecution. How does the process work if they are willing to let me pay a fine because I heard they usually email you back saying they still intend to prosecute the first time they get back to you? Apologies for asking so many questions I'm just quite nervous.

 

[30907]

So is that what you think they'll do in this case having seen the letter I received and the fact I emailed back admitting guilt and wishing to pay the fine+ticket fare? I'm really anxious to get this resolved and know that they won't want to escalate it to prosecution. How does the process work if they are willing to let me pay a fine because I heard they usually email you back saying they still intend to prosecute the first time they get back to you? Apologies for asking so many questions I'm just quite nervous.

Keep asking away

Chiltern will be taking this opportunity to review your ticket purchase history to see if there are more examples of you cheating the system. This may affect how they next reply, but these days they seem to respond positively at a fairly early stage.

(You have probably discovered that they - or TIL - had a reputation for "playing hard to get.")

 

[Throwaway22946]

Keep asking away

Chiltern will be taking this opportunity to review your ticket purchase history to see if there are more examples of you cheating the system. This may affect how they next reply, but these days they seem to respond positively at a fairly early stage.

(You have probably discovered that they - or TIL - had a reputation for "playing hard to get.")

Would they not have taken the time to do that already in the time between the offense and them sending the letter and how would they even find out that anyway if that's what they are doing?

 

[30907]

Would they not have taken the time to do that already in the time between the offense and them sending the letter and how would they even find out that anyway if that's what they are doing?

1. Possibly.
2. If you buy online, they can legally access your records. Obviously if you have simply been travelling with no ticket, that's different!

 

[Throwaway22946]

1. Possibly.
2. If you buy online, they can legally access your records. Obviously if you have simply been travelling with no ticket, that's different!

Ok thank you for your response. My other question to you would be does it automatically get passed to a magistrates court or do they have to manually do that after checking if I've contacted them? Because I've not yet heard from them other than an automated email confirming they received it. But them not sending an actual reply leads me to think they don't know I have made contact yet and if it reaches the 14 days after the letter has been sent and they haven't gotten back to me then what? And what would cheating the system look like re buying online?

 

[Hadders]

So is that what you think they'll do in this case having seen the letter I received and the fact I emailed back admitting guilt and wishing to pay the fine+ticket fare? I'm really anxious to get this resolved and know that they won't want to escalate it to prosecution. How does the process work if they are willing to let me pay a fine because I heard they usually email you back saying they still intend to prosecute the first time they get back to you? Apologies for asking so many questions I'm just quite nervous.

I haven't sseen any paperwork relating to your case so can't really comment but as I said above Chiltern will usually offer an out of court settlement to people who co-operate with them, and who have not come to their attention before.

Chiltern have six months from the date of the offence to lay papers before the court if they want to prosecute.

Would they not have taken the time to do that already in the time between the offense and them sending the letter and how would they even find out that anyway if that's what they are doing?

No, not always. Obtaining data from ticket selling websites like Trainline takes time. Prosecution Departments do not have lots of people working in them, it could be as simple as the person dealing with your case is on holiday for a couple of weeks.

Ok thank you for your response. My other question to you would be does it automatically get passed to a magistrates court or do they have to manually do that after checking if I've contacted them? Because I've not yet heard from them other than an automated email confirming they received it. But them not sending an actual reply leads me to think they don't know I have made contact yet and if it reaches the 14 days after the letter has been sent and they haven't gotten back to me then what? And what would cheating the system look like re buying online?

If Chiltern decide to prosecute you then they send you a court summons or a Single Justice Procedure Notice. If you had confirmation that they received your reply then just wait for them to reply to you. They will do so but it could take a few weeks. Stop worrying about the 14 days - that was the deadline for you to reply to them, not them to reply to you.

 

[Throwaway22946]

I haven't sseen any paperwork relating to your case so can't really comment but as I said above Chiltern will usually offer an out of court settlement to people who co-operate with them, and who have not come to their attention before.

Chiltern have six months from the date of the offence to lay papers before the court if they want to prosecute.


No, not always. Obtaining data from ticket selling websites like Trainline takes time. Prosecution Departments do not have lots of people working in them, it could be as simple as the person dealing with your case is on holiday for a couple of weeks.


If Chiltern decide to prosecute you then they send you a court summons or a Single Justice Procedure Notice. If you had confirmation that they received your reply then just wait for them to reply to you. They will do so but it could take a few weeks. Stop worrying about the 14 days - that was the deadline for you to reply to them, not them to reply to you.

Attached is the letter that they sent me. I've not come to their attention before because this is the first time I'm having this issue. What type of things would they check with a site like trainline for other than like the person buying tickets with a railcard they didn't have or something?

 

[Hadders]

Attached is the letter that they sent me. I've not come to their attention before because this is the first time I'm having this issue. What type of things would they check with a site like trainline for other than like the person buying tickets with a railcard they didn't have or something?

That's Chiltern's standard letter they send to people in your situation. Can you post up copies of everything you sent back to Chiltern?

When they research ticket purchasing history they will be looking for things like:

- tickets you're not entitled to use - eg child, railcard discounted if there's no evidence of you owning the railcard
- tickets that could indicate doughnutting
- excessive volume of refunds
- excessive/possible fraudulent delay repay claims
- Advance tickets used on the wrong train

There will probably be other things as well.

 

[MarlowDonkey]

Attached is the letter that they sent me. I've not come to their attention before because this is the first time I'm having this issue. What type of things would they check with a site like trainline for other than like the person buying tickets with a railcard they didn't have or something?

They could for example check for tickets from A to B and C to D when the regular journey was A to D. Or that purchasing was for a period return A to D and singles on mutiple days A to D. They could check for ticket refunds on days where the tickets weren't inspected.

 

[Throwaway22946]

That's Chiltern's standard letter they send to people in your situation. Can you post up copies of everything you sent back to Chiltern?

When they research ticket purchasing history they will be looking for things like:

- tickets you're not entitled to use - eg child, railcard discounted if there's no evidence of you owning the railcard
- tickets that could indicate doughnutting
- excessive volume of refunds
- excessive/possible fraudulent delay repay claims
- Advance tickets used on the wrong train

There will probably be other things as well.

I don't want to send exactly what I sent them but I admitted my guilt and offered to pay the settlement and train fare

 

[Hadders]

I don't want to send exactly what I sent them but I admitted my guilt and offered to pay the settlement and train fare

That's fine, but I can't really add anything else to what I've already said.

 

[Throwaway22946]

That's fine, but I can't really add anything else to what I've already said.

Would you say they are more likely to agree to settle out of court or would they be more likely to want to prosecute

 

[AlterEgo]

It's impossible for us to know, but our experience is that these days they now tend to settle rather than prosecute.