Wolverhampton <> Walsall via Tame Bridge Parkway

[dvboy]

I've mentioned it before here but why are there still no valid fares for a journey between Wolverhampton and Walsall or vice versa changing at Tame Bridge Parkway which can be significantly quicker than via Birmingham New Street.

 

[Dirty_Mac]

Well since changing at Tame Bridge Parkway is route with the shortest distance any ticket must by default be valid right?

 

[Bungle]

Not quite sure I follow… a quick search on BRFares shows “via Birmingham” and “not via Birmingham” fares, the latter of which is much cheaper. Presumably the latter is intended for journeys involving a change at Tame Bridge Parkway, which are offered by the National Rail site?

 

[Dirty_Mac]

Not quite sure I follow… a quick search on BRFares shows “via Birmingham” and “not via Birmingham” fares, the latter of which is much cheaper. Presumably the latter is intended for journeys involving a change at Tame Bridge Parkway, which are offered by the National Rail site?

But if you look on any journey planner they don't sell the "not via Birmingham" fare for going via Tame Bridge Parkway. In fact there is no fare for going that way

 

[kieron]

But if you look on any journey planner they don't sell the "not via Birmingham" fare for going via Tame Bridge Parkway. In fact there is no fare for going that way

You'd have to buy the ticket without an itinerary, I think. A ticket offices should have no trouble selling it to you.

The Conditions of Travel say "Your Ticket ... will be valid ... by any services ... over the shortest route which can be used by scheduled passenger services between the stations shown on your Ticket".

The probelm you're having is that retailers ignore the "which can be used by scheduled passenger services" bit, so don't accept that this is a valid itinerary.

I'm actually a bit wary of suggesting this because the routeing guide says to use some tables on nr.co.uk to calculate the shortest distance, but the route you're using isn't listed there at all. I'm struggling to imagine a prosecutor arguing that a route is not the shortest one purely because they've left it out of their list of routes, though.

For completeness, the route can't be validated as a "mapped" route for Wolverhampton-Walsall because the only map combination for the journey (BI) requires travel via Birmingham, and because it entails a double back through Bescot Stadium and you would need an easement to allow that.

 

[STINT47]

I think the not via Birmingham was designed for when there were direct trains between these two stations.

With the service between Wolverhampton and Tame Bridge Parkway being introduced this should now be the logical route and ticket for someone wanting to travel between these two stations but the systems don't appear to be set up to offer it.

I would sincerely hope that anyone making this journey would not facd any issues using a not via Birmingham ticket, it would certainly be poor form to issue a penalty fare ir start a prosecution. Then again the way some staff and TOCs carry off you never know.

 

[dvboy]

You'd have to buy the ticket without an itinerary, I think. A ticket offices should have no trouble selling it to you.

The Conditions of Travel say "Your Ticket ... will be valid ... by any services ... over the shortest route which can be used by scheduled passenger services between the stations shown on your Ticket".

The probelm you're having is that retailers ignore the "which can be used by scheduled passenger services" bit, so don't accept that this is a valid itinerary.

I'm actually a bit wary of suggesting this because the routeing guide says to use some tables on nr.co.uk to calculate the shortest distance, but the route you're using isn't listed there at all. I'm struggling to imagine a prosecutor arguing that a route is not the shortest one purely because they've left it out of their list of routes, though.

For completeness, the route can't be validated as a "mapped" route for Wolverhampton-Walsall because the only map combination for the journey (BI) requires travel via Birmingham, and because it entails a double back through Bescot Stadium and you would need an easement to allow that.

That's the issue, there used to be a parliamentary direct train (not via Birmingham) that would be the shortest distance. I'm not sure if this still runs, I can't find it in timetables.

There should be an easement.

 

[Watershed]

That's the issue, there used to be a parliamentary direct train (not via Birmingham) that would be the shortest distance. I'm not sure if this still runs, I can't find it in timetables.

There should be an easement.

It still runs very early on Saturday mornings, I believe.

In practical terms, if you manage to buy the ticket, you're very unlikely to have any issue using it via Tame Bridge Parkway, seeing as that is the only realistic way of avoiding Birmingham.

The chances of an onboard ticket check on a West Midlands Trains service are, in any event, very small. Most of their guards don't ever seem to conduct checks, especially on local stopping services.

 

[Kite159]

It still runs very early on Saturday mornings, I believe.

In practical terms, if you manage to buy the ticket, you're very unlikely to have any issue using it via Tame Bridge Parkway, seeing as that is the only realistic way of avoiding Birmingham.

The chances of an onboard ticket check on a West Midlands Trains service are, in any event, very small. Most of their guards don't ever seem to conduct checks, especially on local stopping services.

The train still runs on the direct route from Wolverhampton, however it's not in passenger service anymore. So the shortest route is Wolverhampton - Tame Bridge - Walsall with the 'double back' at Bescot Stadium which might be causing the issue.

Agreed with the guards on West Midland Train services sometimes just hiding away, even on those services which have a good length of time between stops

 

[dvboy]

In practical terms, if you manage to buy the ticket, you're very unlikely to have any issue using it via Tame Bridge Parkway, seeing as that is the only realistic way of avoiding Birmingham.

I understand, but the point is it should be available to buy online against a search for that journey, not just from a ticket office or machine. Looks like it needs an easement to fix it.

 

[kieron]

That's the issue, there used to be a parliamentary direct train (not via Birmingham) that would be the shortest distance. I'm not sure if this still runs, I can't find it in timetables.

I was imagining a future in which the shortest route calculation was based on where trains were actually scheduled to run. Removing the direct Walsall-Wolverhampton link would just be one small part of it.

An easement is certainly needed, though, as the shortest route rule only goes so far.