Mitcham Eastfields - Surbiton ticket

[Notchapple]

Does anyone know why I can't buy a straight ticket from Mitcham Eastfields to Surbiton via Clapham Junction online? TrainPal comes up with no options, TrainLine is making me buy two separate tickets - one from MTC to CLJ and one from CLJ to SUR, SWR is not showing the via CLJ route and the forums ticketing system is making me buy a ticket from MTC to BAL and BAL to SUR.

One option that is shown on all of the above is travelling via Streatham and Wimbledon but this is much longer than travelling via CLJ.

 

[Haywain]

Why not use contactless?

 

[Notchapple]

Temporarily using a railcard until I can apply for my university oyster once the website is back up.

I've answered my own question as it seems like that the via Streatham ticket is valid on any route. So I assume the journey planner just doesn't like the idea of going via Clapham Junction hence the tickets being sold only have itineraries of going via Streatham

 

[Haywain]

Temporarily using a railcard until I can apply for my university oyster once the website is back up.

Get the railcard applied to a standard Oyster card? But if you are using paper tickets with a 16-25 Railcard don't forget that there's a minimum £12 fare before 10 am.

The best thing to do really depends on the times at which you'll be travelling.

 

[Watershed]

Travel via CLJ isn't permitted because CLJ fails the fares check as a potential origin Routing Point for MTC. In turn this is because in the September 1996 fares, the CLJ-SUR Off-Peak Day Single (CDS) was £2.40 and thus less than the £2.50 CDS from MTC to SUR.

Barring travel via CLJ doesn't make a lot of sense since the fares from MTC and CLJ to SUR are the same nowadays, but strictly speaking it isn't allowed. I suspect in practice you wouldn't encounter any problems doing so, so long as you're not trying to break your journey in CLJ (we have heard several reports of barrier staff being very unfriendly there, in one instance even leading to a wrongful prosecution).

 

[yorkie]

Does anyone know why I can't buy a straight ticket from Mitcham Eastfields to Surbiton via Clapham Junction online? TrainPal comes up with no options, TrainLine is making me buy two separate tickets - one from MTC to CLJ and one from CLJ to SUR, SWR is not showing the via CLJ route and the forums ticketing system is making me buy a ticket from MTC to BAL and BAL to SUR.

One option that is shown on all of the above is travelling via Streatham and Wimbledon but this is much longer than travelling via CLJ.

It's not valid within the shortest route rule, being over 3 miles longer:

Mileage 13.34 (Shortest possible 9.85)

Furthermore, there is no mapped route because Clapham Jn fails the fares check rule (even if it would pass on current fares!)

That's why our ticketing site won't sell these fares.

 

[MikeWh]

This is quite interesting. Paper single and return tickets are priced according to the zones used, just like PAYG, and in both cases the fare charged is that for a zone 2-6 journey. I wonder if something has gone wrong. I reckon 90%+ people wanting to make that journey will go via Clapham Junction.

 

[yorkie]

This is quite interesting. Paper single and return tickets are priced according to the zones used, just like PAYG, and in both cases the fare charged is that for a zone 2-6 journey. I wonder if something has gone wrong. I reckon 90%+ people wanting to make that journey will go via Clapham Junction.

Hopefully RDG will create a routing point easement now it's been highlighted here.

 

[Watershed]

This is quite interesting. Paper single and return tickets are priced according to the zones used, just like PAYG, and in both cases the fare charged is that for a zone 2-6 journey. I wonder if something has gone wrong. I reckon 90%+ people wanting to make that journey will go via Clapham Junction.

It's not really gone wrong, more just that the current zonal pricing varies from the historic 1996 pricing (which is used to determine valid Routeing Points) for reasons that aren't entirely obvious to me.

 

[MikeWh]

It's not really gone wrong, more just that the current zonal pricing varies from the historic 1996 pricing (which is used to determine valid Routeing Points) for reasons that aren't entirely obvious to me.

I don't think the 1996 pricing was actually zonal. It was changed in mid 2000s for all the late adopting TOCs in preparation for the rollout of Oyster.

 

[Notchapple]

Travel via CLJ isn't permitted because CLJ fails the fares check as a potential origin Routing Point for MTC. In turn this is because in the September 1996 fares, the CLJ-SUR Off-Peak Day Single (CDS) was £2.40 and thus less than the £2.50 CDS from MTC to SUR.

Barring travel via CLJ doesn't make a lot of sense since the fares from MTC and CLJ to SUR are the same nowadays, but strictly speaking it isn't allowed. I suspect in practice you wouldn't encounter any problems doing so, so long as you're not trying to break your journey in CLJ (we have heard several reports of barrier staff being very unfriendly there, in one instance even leading to a wrongful prosecution).

It's not valid within the shortest route rule, being over 3 miles longer:

Mileage 13.34 (Shortest possible 9.85)

Furthermore, there is no mapped route because Clapham Jn fails the fares check rule (even if it would pass on current fares!)

That's why our ticketing site won't sell these fares.

Thanks both, that's interesting that it's not a route allowed on a technicality even though it's about 35% quicker than heading up via Streatham then down to Wimbledon then to Surbiton which is the default routing.

 

[Surreytraveller]

It's not really gone wrong, more just that the current zonal pricing varies from the historic 1996 pricing (which is used to determine valid Routeing Points) for reasons that aren't entirely obvious to me.

Presumably in 1996, you could get a direct train to Wimbledon from Mitcham Junction (Eastfields didn't exist then), whereas now its a tram

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 11 Oct 2024 ==

Thanks both, that's interesting that it's not a route allowed on a technicality even though it's about 35% quicker than heading up via Streatham then down to Wimbledon then to Surbiton which is the default routing.

Perhaps fares should, as well as the shortest route, also be valid via the quickest route

 

[Haywain]

whereas now its a tram

At greater frequency, and probably cheaper.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 11 Oct 2024 ==

Perhaps fares should, as well as the shortest route, also be valid via the quickest route

Contactless and Oyster fares are.

 

[Surreytraveller]

Contactless and Oyster fares are.

Contactless fares aren't based on routes. As long as you stay within the contactless area, and within the maximum journey time, you can go any route you like!

 

[Haywain]

Contactless fares aren't based on routes. As long as you stay within the contactless area, and within the maximum journey time, you can go any route you like!

Indeed, as I said.

 

[Watershed]

At greater frequency, and probably cheaper.

That's as may be for journeys to Wimbledon, but for journeys beyond Wimbledon the lack of integrated through ticketing with National Rail services is a big drawback. In many cases it means it's more expensive to mix tram & National Rail than to use a more circuitous NR-only route, even though the latter involves passing through more Zones.

 

[Haywain]

That's as may be for journeys to Wimbledon, but for journeys beyond Wimbledon the lack of integrated through ticketing with National Rail services is a big drawback. In many cases it means it's more expensive to mix tram & National Rail than to use a more circuitous NR-only route, even though the latter involves passing through more Zones.

It's a bit of a stretch to say that there's a lack of through ticketing with Oyster and contactless available tor the journey in question.

 

[Zeremony]

It's a bit of a stretch to say that there's a lack of through ticketing with Oyster and contactless available tor the journey in question.

Trams are treated like buses by the oyster system and are in their own zone separate to rail services.
This means that you would have to pay a flat fare of £1.75 to use the trams (although it is included in the bus hopper fare).

 

[soil]

Trams are treated like buses by the oyster system and are in their own zone separate to rail services.
This means that you would have to pay a flat fare of £1.75 to use the trams (although it is included in the bus hopper fare).

yes quite, doubly so with a rail card - if you mix NR with LU then the surcharge over NR only is about £1.20, whereas if you take the bus it's £1.70. this isn't particularly logical, as buses are generally the lowest form of public transport in London.

 

[Surreytraveller]

It's a bit of a stretch to say that there's a lack of through ticketing with Oyster and contactless available tor the journey in question.

There isn't a through ticket. Its confusing at Wimbledon where you have to tap - it's two separate fares and you have to pay attention to make sure you don't get overcharged

 

[kieron]

Just to say, a ticket to Surbiton from Mitcham Junction or Hackbridge would let you travel from Mitcham Eastfields to Surbiton via Clapham Junction.

The reason is that Clapham Junction fails the fare check for Mitcham Eastfields, whereas it isn't attempted for the other stations.