Waiting for outcome on prosecution letter

[burshundon]

Dear all,

Please I did a terrible thing by short faring on 4th April 2024, and I got my letter on 3rd May 2024, I responded by pleading for out of court settlement, sent my letter on 7th May 2024 with next day tracking delivery, which was delivered in less than 24hrs. Up till now I haven't gotten a response from Southeastern rail.

Please kindly advise it's over 5months now no letter nor response from them.

 

[WesternLancer]

Dear all,

Please I did a terrible thing by short faring on 4th April 2024, and I got my letter on 3rd May 2024, I responded by pleading for out of court settlement, sent my letter on 7th May 2024 with next day tracking delivery, which was delivered in less than 24hrs. Up till now I haven't gotten a response from Southeastern rail.

Please kindly advise it's over 5months now no letter nor response from them.

Hi - there were some recent cases on here a few weeks ago (at least 2) where it looked like Southeastern had basically lost the replies people had sent to them. It may be worth you sending a follow up letter or e-mail - include a copy of what you sent before - just to check they have received what you sent and acted on it.

Usually the advice on here is to be patient, but you have waited quite a while and given the other 2 cases (one of which then escalated to prosecution) that I recall I think my advice would be to follow it up with Southeastern to try and find out what is going on if at all possible.

 

[furlong]

Given how close it is to 6 months, which is (normally) the deadline for prosecuting, and the fact you have tracking information so can not only prove you sent it but also that they received it, just continue to do nothing and wait.

 

[burshundon]

Given how close it is to 6 months, which is (normally) the deadline for prosecuting, and the fact you have tracking information so can not only prove you sent it but also that they received it, just continue to do nothing and wait.

Okay, thank you

 

[WesternLancer]

Given how close it is to 6 months, which is (normally) the deadline for prosecuting, and the fact you have tracking information so can not only prove you sent it but also that they received it, just continue to do nothing and wait.

the problem with this is that at least one of the other south eastern cases had escalated to prosecution and it only became apparent to the passenger when they got court paper with about 2 weeks or less to get hold of south eastern and get them to accept they had not received her original response and offer to settle.

If that has happened again here the risk for @burshundon could be that it's already in or en route to the court.

I guess the OP can weight up which option to choose in terms of what to do now. There are certainly some advantages to your suggestion not to do anything it its not gone to court

 

[burshundon]

A response from southeastern has been sent, giving an option for out of court settlement of £2,750 quoting 95% of my journey ain't valid because am not eligible for discounted rail card of 16-25.

Please can someone explain who is eligible for 16-25 rail card as I am a student and I was issued the rail card at the station with my school stamp and school ID card.

So I'll know what to reply.

Please urgent guidance will be much appreciated.

 

[AlterEgo]

A response from southeastern has been sent, giving an option for out of court settlement of £2,750 quoting 95% of my journey ain't valid because am not eligible for discounted rail card of 16-25.

Please can someone explain who is eligible for 16-25 rail card as I am a student and I was issued the rail card at the station with my school stamp and school ID card.

So I'll know what to reply.

Please urgent guidance will be much appreciated.

Do you have your railcard? If so, you should send a copy to them.

 

[burshundon]

Do you have your railcard? If so, you should send a copy to them.

Yes I do, both the expired one

 

[alholmes]

Can you post a copy of the letter on here, redacting personal details (name, address, reference).

You’re talking about railcard eligibility here, but in your first post you mentioned short-faring (not holding a valid ticket for the full length of the journey). Can you clarify the exact reason why you were stopped?

 

[burshundon]

Can you post a copy of the letter on here, redacting personal details (name, address, reference).

You’re talking about railcard eligibility here, but in your first post you mentioned short-faring (not holding a valid ticket for the full length of the journey). Can you clarify the exact reason why you were stopped?

Attached is the response I got and my reply

 

[alholmes]

There’s a minimum £12 fare in the morning peak with the 16-25 railcard. Did you travel in the morning peak with a discounted ticket that was for less than £12?

 

[30907]

Please can someone explain who is eligible for 16-25 rail card as I am a student and I was issued the rail card at the station with my school stamp and school ID card.

A 16-17 Saver and a 16-25 Railcard are both for anyone of the right age.

16-25 has some special restrictions for the morning peak period, which post #11 asks about, BUT it can be issued to older full-time students - are you one? (If so, you were NOT entitled to 16-17 discount!)

 

[burshundon]

There’s a minimum £12 fare in the morning peak with the 16-25 railcard. Did you travel in the morning peak with a discounted ticket that was for less than £12?

No I didn't....it usually £12 in the morning whenever I have activities in morning time.

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A 16-17 Saver and a 16-25 Railcard are both for anyone of the right age.

16-25 has some special restrictions for the morning peak period, which post #11 asks about, BUT it can be issued to older full-time students - are you one? (If so, you were NOT entitled to 16-17 discount!)

I'm an older student, I was given a 16-25 railcard that's what I usually apply whenever I use the train.

 

[alholmes]

Ok, sounds as though you’ve been using the 16-25 railcard correctly, so send copies of those railcards (including expired ones). Probably worth stating that you are a mature student and that you provided the required proof at time of purchase.

This won’t get you off any tickets purchased with 16-17 railcard, or where there’s any element of short faring, but it may reduce the settlement.

 

[burshundon]

Ok, sounds as though you’ve been using the 16-25 railcard correctly, so send copies of those railcards (including expired ones). Probably worth stating that you are a mature student and that you provided the required proof at time of purchase.

This won’t get you off any tickets purchased with 16-17 railcard, or where there’s any element of short faring, but it may reduce the settlement.

Okay, thanks so much.

I will send them the copies and update the outcome.

 

[WesternLancer]

Okay, thanks so much.

I will send them the copies and update the outcome.

I think you should post the draft of your accompanying explanation here before you send it in (especially if English is not your first language)

 

[burshundon]

I think you should post the draft if your accompanying explanation here before you send it in (especially if English is not your first language)

Okay

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Okay

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Okay

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[notmyrealname]

I expect the forum gurus will comment later for you. In your second paragraph, that should be mature student, not matured.

 

[burshundon]

I expect the forum gurus will comment later for you. In your second paragraph, that should be mature student, not matured.

Okay

 

[John R]

I am not sure what you are trying to say with your final paragraph. You need to set out more clearly what you expect the investigator to take from the fact that you have moved and often travel from those stations.

 

[WesternLancer]

Okay

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Hi - is it possible for you to copy your draft reply wording here into a post so that it's possible for me to easily suggest a few simple edits for you to consider on your draft. It's not easy to do that with the screenshot attachment. Thanks

It's VERY important the wording of what you send to them makes your position clear if you want any chance of the sum being asked for to be reduced and at the moment the draft does not achieve that so I would like to suggest some improvements to help you

Also
a) Would you also mind stating your age if you are a mature student?

b) I assume your school / college / university stamp verified that you were a student entitled to use the 16-25 Railcard as detailed here (attend for 15 hours a or more per week for at least 20 weeks of the year) - ie this:

Mature Student FAQs - 16-25 Railcard

A 16-25 Railcard costs just �30 and it'll save you 1/3 on rail fares throughout Great Britain for a whole year.

www.16-25railcard.co.uk

and
c) you admit that on some occasions you applied the 16-17 Railcard discount (which gives 50% off not 34% off tickets) but that you are not entitled to this because you are not aged 16-17 years of age - for which those discounted tickets will be classed as not legitimate and thus need to be re-paid. Whether you applied that by mistake or intentionally

 

[some bloke]

To add to points from @John R and @WesternLancer above:

You can think how to make their task easier.

After their point about return journeys, are you clearer now about how many single journeys you short-fared on (single journeys because they can charge you for two singles)?

They mention "your account" - singular - though you mentioned both Southeastern and Trainpal apps.

Changing "Thanks" to "Thank you" may sound less casual.

 

[burshundon]

Hi - is it possible for you to copy your draft reply wording here into a post so that it's possible for me to easily suggest a few simple edits for you to consider on your draft. It's not easy to do that with the screenshot attachment. Thanks

It's VERY important the wording of what you send to them makes your position clear if you want any chance of the sum being asked for to be reduced and at the moment the draft does not achieve that so I would like to suggest some improvements to help you

Also
a) Would you also mind stating your age if you are a mature student?

b) I assume your school / college / university stamp verified that you were a student entitled to use the 16-25 Railcard as detailed here (attend for 15 hours a or more per week for at least 20 weeks of the year) - ie this:

Mature Student FAQs - 16-25 Railcard

A 16-25 Railcard costs just �30 and it'll save you 1/3 on rail fares throughout Great Britain for a whole year.

www.16-25railcard.co.uk

and
c) you admit that on some occasions you applied the 16-17 Railcard discount (which gives 50% off not 34% off tickets) but that you are not entitled to this because you are not aged 16-17 years of age - for which those discounted tickets will be classed as not legitimate and thus need to be re-paid. Whether you applied that by mistake or intentionally

Good morning,


Thanks for taking out time to look into my case and giving a detailed explanation on how it arrived at the said amount.

Please I'm a mature student as I provided the required proof at the time of purchase to get the 16-25 railcard from the train station. Please see attached railcards both expired and current railcard.

I moved to my current address since 1st of June 2024 which is close to Strood and Rochester train station, often times I start my journey from either Strood or Rochester.

Regards,

 

[30907]

Suggestions below in bold. They include a couple of small corrections to your good English, but you do need to make clear what you are asking.

Thank  you for taking out time to look into my case and giving a detailed explanation on how you arrived at the said amount.

Please note that I am a mature student (at...)and as I provided the required proof at the time of purchase to get the 16-25 railcard from the train station. Please see attached railcards both expired and current railcard. I was therefore entitled to claim 16-25 discount throughout, so I would be grateful if you would recalculate the sum I owe on that basis.

(I accept that I was wrong to claim 16-17 Saver discount)

I moved to my current address on since 1st of June 2024 which is close to Strood and Rochester train stations, often times I start my journey from either Strood or Rochester.

(I am not sure why this last paragraph is relevant)

 

[WesternLancer]

Good morning,


Thanks for taking out time to look into my case and giving a detailed explanation on how it arrived at the said amount.

Please I'm a mature student as I provided the required proof at the time of purchase to get the 16-25 railcard from the train station. Please see attached railcards both expired and current railcard.

I moved to my current address since 1st of June 2024 which is close to Strood and Rochester train station, often times I start my journey from either Strood or Rochester.

Regards,

Thanks - I see @30907 has made helpfulk amends of the sort I had in mind.
I would add your case reference number to what you send and it might be worth adding something to show them you are keen to settle the matter eg

'Please be assured I am keen to co-operate with your investigation in the hope it remains possible to settle the matter without prosecution' - you could put that at the end for example.

 

[some bloke]

They might feel better towards you if you acknowledge short-faring and/or explain clearly about occasions when you didn't do that.

 

[burshundon]

---

U

Thanks - I see @30907 has made helpfulk amends of the sort I had in mind.
I would add your case reference number to what you send and it might be worth adding something to show them you are keen to settle the matter eg

'Please be assured I am keen to co-operate with your investigation in the hope it remains possible to settle the matter without prosecution' - you could put that at the end for example.

Thank you, I'm most grateful

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 25 Sep 2024 ==

Suggestions below in bold. They include a couple of small corrections to your good English, but you do need to make clear what you are asking.

(I am not sure why this last paragraph is relevant)

Thanks for the inputs, I really appreciate

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 25 Sep 2024 ==

They might feel better towards you if you acknowledge short-faring and/or explain clearly about occasions when you didn't do that.

Okay

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The response i got after sending the draft.

 

[WesternLancer]

---

U

Thank you, I'm most grateful

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Thanks for the inputs, I really appreciate

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Okay

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The response i got after sending the draft.

You should send them your full current postal address (and in fact on reflection that should have been included in your previous message to them). It is not at all in your interest if they have an out of date postal address for you as if they need to send you something official it will likely come by post not e-mail - it is vital you receive and respond to anything they send you - whether that be post or e-mail - or otherwise it will just get escalated to prosecution without you knowing about and you will likely be prosecuted and found guilty in your absence. It is important to avoid that.

And if your current address is not near Strood or Rochester you should add an explanation as to why you use those stations.

You need to be co-operating with them if you want them to settle things out of court.

 

[burshundon]

You should send them your full current postal address (and in fact on reflection that should have been included in your previous message to them). It is not at all in your interest if they have an out of date postal address for you as if they need to send you something official it will likely come by post not e-mail - it is vital you receive and respond to anything they send you - whether that be post or e-mail - or otherwise it will just get escalated to prosecution without you knowing about and you will likely be prosecuted and found guilty in your absence. It is important to avoid that.

And if your current address is not near Strood or Rochester you should add an explanation as to why you use those stations.

You need to be co-operating with them if you want them to settle things out of court.

Thank you, I'll send them my full postal address.
My current address is closer to Strood and Rochester.

Thanks for the guidance, will send the update once they get back to me.

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Please what kind of proof of address can I send to them?

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Please does my Tenancy Agreement qualify as proof?
Because it's the only document that shows the actual date i moved in.

 

[John R]

A tenancy agreement is certainly reasonable proof, although do you not have an up to date driving licence you can send, or any bill such as council tax that you can send? You probably need to explain very clearly why their searches (presumably credit searches) show you moving TO an address on the day you moved to a different one.

I think they are being exceptionally patient with you, and you do run the risk of them, rightly or not, thinking that you are not being completely truthful, so it is in your interest to explain as clearly as possible what has gone on with your address, and why you think it affects the amount you should reasonably pay to resolve the situation you are in.