Caught using another railcard

[anon471]

Hi, so I booked tickets to go to Stansted Airport late last night but I forgot I was on my dad's account as I book tickets for him as he's not great at using apps. He has a railcard and I didn't realise I was on his account as it the night before at like 1am when I booked the tickets and I had to pack etc.

I got stopped at Stansted Airport and the ticket inspector asked to show me the railcard. Obviously I didn't have one and I'll be honest I panicked quickly edited my dad's one by putting my pic on. But they knew that wasn't me and so I had to give my details and address for a letter to be sent.

The gate for my flight was closing and I just wanted to get on the flight, didn't realise it was that big of a deal, as it was just a small discount.

The inspector was like this fraud, you altered details and started reading me my rights but I offered to pay full price on the spot, I apologised and admitted what I did was wrong because it was a mistake and unintentional.

But now I'm on holiday and I'm worried that I'm going to get prosecuted for fraud. I am constantly thinking about it and it was honestly the first time I used his account. Like I have my own account and you can see my booking history.

I'm really worried about getting criminal record and having this on my DBS checks. Does anyone know what's going to happen? I believe it's Greater Anglia trains for Stansted express. All I can think about is on my holiday and I can't relax. It was honest mistake and I panicked in the heat of the moment as I have never done anything like this before.

Please let me know what to expect and what I can do to make amends. I don't mind paying a fine if that comes through the post but I don't want to go to court and have a criminal record.

 

[ikcdab]

Firstly and most importantly, this was NOT "a mistake and unintentional.". You deliberately altered a Railcard. You claim you were busy packing, but you had time to alter the Railcard but no time to book the correct ticket.
Altering a Railcard is fraud and more serious than simple faredodging.
The railway company take this sort of fraud seriously. They will investigate your ticket purchasing history.
If they find this is the only occurrence then I suspect you might get away with an out of court settlement.
However, if there is any reason for them to believe you have done this before, then expect to be prosecuted. You will be found guilty and you will be fined and gain a criminal conviction.
You have no choice over whether it goes to court or not. That's totally in the gift of the railway company.
For now, you can only wait for them to write to you. It's important that you get the letter so I hope you have given them the correct address. When you get the letter, come back here for further advice

 

[WesternLancer]

Hi, so I booked tickets to go to Stansted Airport late last night but I forgot I was on my dad's account as I book tickets for him as he's not great at using apps. He has a railcard and I didn't realise I was on his account as it the night before at like 1am when I booked the tickets and I had to pack etc.

I got stopped at Stansted Airport and the ticket inspector asked to show me the railcard. Obviously I didn't have one and I'll be honest I panicked quickly edited my dad's one by putting my pic on. But they knew that wasn't me and so I had to give my details and address for a letter to be sent.

The gate for my flight was closing and I just wanted to get on the flight, didn't realise it was that big of a deal, as it was just a small discount.

The inspector was like this fraud, you altered details and started reading me my rights but I offered to pay full price on the spot, I apologised and admitted what I did was wrong because it was a mistake and unintentional.

But now I'm on holiday and I'm worried that I'm going to get prosecuted for fraud. I am constantly thinking about it and it was honestly the first time I used his account. Like I have my own account and you can see my booking history.

I'm really worried about getting criminal record and having this on my DBS checks. Does anyone know what's going to happen? I believe it's Greater Anglia trains for Stansted express. All I can think about is on my holiday and I can't relax. It was honest mistake and I panicked in the heat of the moment as I have never done anything like this before.

Please let me know what to expect and what I can do to make amends. I don't mind paying a fine if that comes through the post but I don't want to go to court and have a criminal record.

Prosecutions for fraud by railway companies are very rare. Never seen one on this forum iirc. But they could prosecute under railway by laws which is a less serious offence than fraud.

Whilst you wait to hear from them prop ably in a few weeks have a look at other threads here involving stansted incorrect tickets to get an idea what to expect.

You will need to engage with them when they contact you to try and secure an out of court settlement. They won’t send you a fine through the post. Assuming you will not be abroad too long my advice would be to enjoy your holiday and head back here for advice when you need it when you get home.

It’s vital you get hard copy post and check it, check e mail and spam (inc your dads if you used his account to book a ticket and that’s linked to his e mail). It’s vital you respond to them or it WILL escalate to court prosecution which you need to avoid.

Obv what you did was pretty daft decision, no sure if it will make it significantly more difficult to reach a settlement with them or not but Greater Anglia seem relatively reasonable to deal with from cases on here.

 

[anon471]

Firstly and most importantly, this was NOT "a mistake and unintentional.". You deliberately altered a Railcard. You claim you were busy packing, but you had time to alter the Railcard but no time to book the correct ticket.
Altering a Railcard is fraud and more serious than simple faredodging.
The railway company take this sort of fraud seriously. They will investigate your ticket purchasing history.
If they find this is the only occurrence then I suspect you might get away with an out of court settlement.
However, if there is any reason for them to believe you have done this before, then expect to be prosecuted. You will be found guilty and you will be fined and gain a criminal conviction.
You have no choice over whether it goes to court or not. That's totally in the gift of the railway company.
For now, you can only wait for them to write to you. It's important that you get the letter so I hope you have given them the correct address. When you get the letter, come back here for further advice

I genuinely booked my ticket in like 2 mins, late at night, literally just selected a time and booked it without thinking.

I agree I deliberately edited the railcard but it was because I have never been in this position before and is was a spur of a moment type of thing. They asked me to show a railcard and like I said I panicked and didn't know what to do or say in the moment. It was a stupid thing to do but I just assumed they would look at it and let me go. The ticket was paid for and like I said I have my own account and can prove I use it properly. My last train tickets that I used from my account was a few weeks go.

All I was thinking about was making my flight. Of course I provided my real address, is was a genuine mistake. In the moment I did not think it would that serious for like 20-30% discount which is like few quid in this case. I promise this was the only occasion I did this.

If I get prosecuted, does mean prison?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 13 Sep 2024 ==

Prosecutions for fraud by railway companies are very rare. Never seen one on this forum iirc. But they could prosecute under railway by laws which is a less serious offence than fraud.

Whilst you wait to hear from them prop ably in a few weeks have a look at other threads here involving stansted incorrect tickets to get an idea what to expect.

You will need to engage with them when they contact you to try and secure an out of court settlement. They won’t send you a fine through the post. Assuming you will not be abroad too long my advice would be to enjoy your holiday and head back here for advice when you need it when you get home.

It’s vital you get hard copy post and check it, check e mail and spam (inc your dads if you used his account to book a ticket and that’s linked to his e mail). It’s vital you respond to them or it WILL escalate to court prosecution which you need to avoid.

Obv what you did was pretty daft decision, no sure if it will make it significantly more difficult to reach a settlement with them or not but Greater Anglia seem relatively reasonable to deal with from cases on here.

Sure, I'll have a look at posts that are similar to mine, appreciate the tip.

If I have an out of court settlement, does that mean it won't I have a criminal conviction?

Thanks, I really hope Greater Anglia take a lenient approach but from what it sounds like this is a much bigger issue than I thought and that's what I'm afraid of. I genuinely can't enjoy my holiday because I'm just thinking of the worst. Just like that I came for a break, first time this year and I'm more stressed than ever.

 

[WesternLancer]

I genuinely booked my ticket in like 2 mins, late at night, literally just selected a time and booked it without thinking.

I agree I deliberately edited the railcard but it was because I have never been in this position before and is was a spur of a moment type of thing. They asked me to show a railcard and like I said I panicked and didn't know what to do or say in the moment. It was a stupid thing to do but I just assumed they would look at it and let me go. The ticket was paid for and like I said I have my own account and can prove I use it properly. My last train tickets that I used from my account was a few weeks go.

All I was thinking about was making my flight. Of course I provided my real address, is was a genuine mistake. In the moment I did not think it would that serious for like 20-30% discount which is like few quid in this case. I promise this was the only occasion I did this.

If I get prosecuted, does mean prison?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 13 Sep 2024 ==


Sure, I'll have a look at posts that are similar to mine, appreciate the tip.

If I have an out of court settlement, does that mean it won't I have a criminal conviction?

Thanks, I really hope Greater Anglia take a lenient approach but from what it sounds like this is a much bigger issue than I thought and that's what I'm afraid of. I genuinely can't enjoy my holiday because I'm just thinking of the worst. Just like that I came for a break, first time this year and I'm more stressed than ever.

You will not go to prison if it went to court. A court fine would be the punishment.

An out of court settlement means they accept a sum in exchange for not prosecuting you. So yes, no conviction or criminal record. Could cost around £200 as you will see from other threads.

Just enjoy your holiday and sort it out with help from here when you get back to uk. Try not to worry as nowt you can do about it now until they contact you.

 

[anon471]

You will not go to prison if it went to court. A court fine would be the punishment.

An out of court settlement means they accept a sum in exchange for not prosecuting you. So yes, no conviction or criminal record. Could cost around £200 as you will see from other threads.

Just enjoy your holiday and sort it out with help from here when you get back to uk. Try not to worry as nowt you can do about it now until they contact you.

Thanks for the clarification and providing explanations. If it's £200 I could live with that if it doesn't mean a criminal conviction. Yeah I'll do my best to not think about it in the mean time. Appreciate the answers.

 

[ikcdab]

How can you edit a Railcard to add someone else's picture while the inspector is standing there waiting for the Railcard to be produced?

 

[jon0844]

How can you edit a Railcard to add someone else's picture while the inspector is standing there waiting for the Railcard to be produced?

Yes that confused me too. Simply not possible to do IMO, meaning I assume the railcard was edited beforehand - and so it was somewhat premeditated.

 

[AlterEgo]

Hi, so I booked tickets to go to Stansted Airport late last night but I forgot I was on my dad's account as I book tickets for him as he's not great at using apps. He has a railcard and I didn't realise I was on his account as it the night before at like 1am when I booked the tickets and I had to pack etc.

I got stopped at Stansted Airport and the ticket inspector asked to show me the railcard. Obviously I didn't have one and I'll be honest I panicked quickly edited my dad's one by putting my pic on. But they knew that wasn't me and so I had to give my details and address for a letter to be sent.

The gate for my flight was closing and I just wanted to get on the flight, didn't realise it was that big of a deal, as it was just a small discount.

The inspector was like this fraud, you altered details and started reading me my rights but I offered to pay full price on the spot, I apologised and admitted what I did was wrong because it was a mistake and unintentional.

But now I'm on holiday and I'm worried that I'm going to get prosecuted for fraud. I am constantly thinking about it and it was honestly the first time I used his account. Like I have my own account and you can see my booking history.

I'm really worried about getting criminal record and having this on my DBS checks. Does anyone know what's going to happen? I believe it's Greater Anglia trains for Stansted express. All I can think about is on my holiday and I can't relax. It was honest mistake and I panicked in the heat of the moment as I have never done anything like this before.

Please let me know what to expect and what I can do to make amends. I don't mind paying a fine if that comes through the post but I don't want to go to court and have a criminal record.

What railcard does your dad have? How many purchases on this same online account are made with this railcard discount that you do not have yourself? How have you apparently managed to edit a bogus railcard in front of an inspector? You might be in for bigger consequences here than you realise if they trawl your ticket purchasing accounts.

 

[anon471]

How can you edit a Railcard to add someone else's picture while the inspector is standing there waiting for the Railcard to be produced?

Took a screenshot, opened up on Instagram, added a pic of me. Took like a minute. I am someone who posts a lot on my Instagram.

 

[WesternLancer]

Thanks for the clarification and providing explanations. If it's £200 I could live with that if it doesn't mean a criminal conviction. Yeah I'll do my best to not think about it in the mean time. Appreciate the answers.

Well it’s not guaranteed. They have the right to prosecute. You’ll have to plead with them in the hope they won’t, but you have a good chance. It would have been better to have been caught just with wrong railcard really.

 

[anon471]

What railcard does your dad have? How many purchases on this same online account are made with this railcard discount that you do not have yourself? How have you apparently managed to edit a bogus railcard in front of an inspector? You might be in for bigger consequences here than you realise if they trawl your ticket

Network railcard, I don't understand your second question but I have my own account which I use and can prove that I purchase my own tickets, in the last year I have booked like 10 tickets. It was edited on Instagram, took like a minute.

 

[WesternLancer]

How can you edit a Railcard to add someone else's picture while the inspector is standing there waiting for the Railcard to be produced?

Basically by being a lot younger than many of us regulars on this forum I suspect.

But presumably it wasn’t very convincing when the staff member looked at it.

 

[anon471]

Well it’s not guaranteed. They have the right to prosecute. You’ll have to plead with them in the hope they won’t, but you have a good chance. It would have been better to have been caught just with wrong railcard really.

Yeah I will. I know, it was a stupid mistake, done in the moment. Guess time will tell how serious it is.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 14 Sep 2024 ==

Basically by being a lot younger than many of us regulars on this forum I suspect.

But presumably it wasn’t very convincing when the staff member looked at it.

Yep it wasn't, which is why they realised straight away.

 

[WesternLancer]

Yeah I will. I know, it was a stupid mistake, done in the moment. Guess time will tell how serious it is.

Do you have your own railcard on a different account? Might help if you do.

Remember when you get back to the uk you’ll need a new totally correct train ticket to get home I assume.

 

[anon471]

Do you have your own railcard on a different account? Might help if you do.

Remember when you get back to the uk you’ll need a new totally correct train ticket to get home I assume.

I just bought one a few hours later, the main reason being is so I can show that I'm willing to pay for my own railcard and show that I'm not going to make this mistake again. I genuinely only realised I used his account when they asked to see the railcard. That's when I panicked and thought if I can quickly edit it on the spot, they would just look at it and let me go. The tickets were paid for and everything. I was trying to think quickly on the spot.

 

[AlterEgo]

Network railcard

Why do you have a picture of his railcard? You don't ever need that.

I don't understand your second question

They will audit the account used to purchase the tickets and may conclude that you have done this many times. Whether that is correct or not is not for me to say, but they will in any case check the account and they may be unconvinced that this wasn't a one-off.

 

[anon471]

Why do you have a picture of his railcard? You don't ever need that.


They will audit the account used to purchase the tickets and may conclude that you have done this many times. Whether that is correct or not is not for me to say, but they will in any case check the account and they may be unconvinced that this wasn't a one-off.

I took a screenshot there and then. How can they check if this was not a one off? I can prove that if me and my dad went somewhere on the same date, I bought my ticket on my own account, like I said when I booked the tickets I didn't realise it was account at the time, it was like 1am or something, the night before my flight, I saw the time of the train I needed tonget and continued to payment, paid and went back to finish off packing. Please read the comments I have made in this forum and you will see what I did and why I did what I did.

 

[Hadders]

Welcome to the forum!

Greater Anglia will decide whether or not to prosecute you. If you do get prosecuted you won't go to prison but you will have to pay a fine, probably the best part of £500 by the time you've added the fine, surcharge, compensation for fare avoided and Greater Anglia's court costs together. If you're found guilty, or plead guilty then you also have a criminal record.

A court appearance (and therefore a court fine and criminal record) can often be avoided in cases like this if you co-operate with Greater Anglia and if you haven't come to their attention before. WHat they often will offer is an out of court settlement where you pay them some money (typically around £150 plus the fare avoided) and in return they won't take the case to court.

GA will write to you in the next few weeks. When the letter comes, upload a copy of it to this thread (with personal details redacted), along with your draft reply and forum members will be happy to proof read it for you.

 

[WesternLancer]

I just bought one a few hours later, the main reason being is so I can show that I'm willing to pay for my own railcard and show that I'm not going to make this mistake again. I genuinely only realised I used his account when they asked to see the railcard. That's when I panicked and thought if I can quickly edit it on the spot, they would just look at it and let me go. The tickets were paid for and everything. I was trying to think quickly on the spot.

That was a good thing to do to buy a railcard. When you need to reply to the railway it’s something you can say you did to ‘rectify your error of judgment’

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 14 Sep 2024 ==

I took a screenshot there and then. How can they check if this was not a one off? I can prove that if me and my dad went somewhere on the same date, I bought my ticket on my own account, like I said when I booked the tickets I didn't realise it was account at the time, it was like 1am or something, the night before my flight, I saw the time of the train I needed tonget and continued to payment, paid and went back to finish off packing. Please read the comments I have made in this forum and you will see what I did and why I did what I did.

Probably best to cross this bridge if you come to it. But the risk might be that they may assume that legit tickets you bought for your dad with a discount he was entitled to were actually for you to use with a discount you were not entitled to. But you can deal with that if they ask you about it.

 

[anon471]

Thanks for the clarification. To confirm this is my first offence and I shouldn't be flagged for any previous offences.

If it is more than just a fine, I'll share details.

Thanks

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 14 Sep 2024 ==

That was a good thing to do to buy a railcard. When you need to reply to the railway it’s something you can say you did to ‘rectify your error of judgment’

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 14 Sep 2024 ==


Probably best to cross this bridge if you come to it. But the risk might be that they may assume that legit tickets you bought for your dad with a discount he was entitled to were actually for you to use with a discount you were not entitled to. But you can deal with that if they ask you about it.

Yeah I just wanted to show, it was a one off. I can provide my booking history to confirm that I use my own account. My most recent booking was only a few weeks ago. Hopefully that can show them it was one off. Thanks for your help with this Western Lancer.

 

[WesternLancer]

Thanks for the clarification. To confirm this is my first offence and I shouldn't be flagged for any previous offences.

If it is more than just a fine, I'll share details.

Thanks

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 14 Sep 2024 ==


Yeah I just wanted to show, it was a one off. I can provide my booking history to confirm that I use my own account. My most recent booking was only a few weeks ago. Hopefully that can show them it was one off. Thanks for your help with this Western Lancer.

Yes. I think you’ll only need to get into that level of detail if it does not look like they accept your initial explanation and apology.

 

[anon471]

Hi all, just updating, I received an out of court settlement plus costs incurred for the fare, confirming not liable to conviction if payment is received. I have paid it.

 

[30907]

Hi all, just updating, I received an out of court settlement plus costs incurred for the fare, confirming not liable to conviction if payment is received. I have paid it.

Update appreciated!