Why No Access To Coast Path at Deganwy, N Wales?

[Envoy]

Deganwy is a station on the Llandudno branch. Alongside it runs a coastal path but this is sealed off from the station. It would surely be most useful to a number of people if direct access to this station from the coast path was created and this could be done at little cost.

As things stand, anybody alighting at this station from a Llandudno bound train, has to cross an old fashioned footbridge to the east side and then over a car park and then cross a busy road to reach a narrow pavement. To proceed south to the Quay Hotel and the surrounding modern houses, one must proceed south on the narrow pavement and then cross the main road again and then over the level crossing. All that hassle because Network Rail don’t make a ramp to the coast path - which would cost peanuts.

 

[Tazi Hupefi]

Does the path belong to Network Rail, or do they just have a right of access to it for engineering etc?

It's also not just a "this would cost peanuts" exercise - you'd need to make it fully accessible for all manner of wheelchair user, mobility scooters and other types of people with disabilities, you'd then have to maintain it, including treating it in adverse weather, snow etc. The fact it is next to a coast or shore line probably means you also need to get specific scientific studies and risk assessments undertaken etc. Could easily be £1m before you've started.

 

[Ediswan]

Looking at maps, it might be simpler to head west from the station, turn left over the level crossing, left again on to the coast path. No need to cross the main road.

 

[Russel]

All that hassle because Network Rail don’t make a ramp to the coast path - which would cost peanuts.

Nothing railway related costs peanuts, whatever figure you're thinking, add a couple of zeros.

Even the smallest of jobs seem to cost eye watering amounts.

 

[EyeKay]

Looking at maps, it might be simpler to head west from the station, turn left over the level crossing, left again on to the coast path. No need to cross the main road.

Yes, this would be the obvious thing to do

 

[Sheridan]

Is it not possible to walk towards the signal box and exit there, negating the need to cross any roads or bridges? Or is the path blocked that way? I’ve only seen it from passing trains but I’m sure I’ve seen people walking away alongside the train.

Edited to add a screenshot of Google streetview from Marine Crescent, looking back towards Deganwy signal box and station and apparently showing pedestrian access from the signal box end of the platform.

 

[The Planner]

Is it not possible to walk towards the signal box and exit there, negating the need to cross any roads or bridges? Or is the path blocked that way? I’ve only seen it from passing trains but I’m sure I’ve seen people walking away alongside the train.

Edited to add a screenshot of Google streetview from Marine Crescent, looking back towards Deganwy signal box and station and apparently showing pedestrian access from the signal box end of the platform.

Looks like you can, and TfW says that is also the step free access, so nothing is required. Thread ends.

Deganwy | Transport for Wales

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tfw.wales

Step Free Access
Category B1.
Separate step-free access to each platform:
Platform 1 (to Llandudno Junction) from the car park.
Step free access is available to Platform 2 (to Llandudno) via a path in front of the signal box adjacent the level crossing off Marine Crescent and the end of platform ramp.
A footbridge accessed with steps connects the two platforms.

 

[Envoy]

I did not realise that a footpath went from the platform at the north end by the signal box - see image 1. However, for people wanting to go to The Quay Hotel and neighbouring houses, they have to go in the wrong direction to exit this way. All that is needed is to cut a hole in the fence and enable people to come off/on the coast path via the ramp at the southern end of the platform. That would not cost a fortune - see image 2.

 

[The Planner]

I did not realise that a footpath went from the platform at the north end by the signal box - see image 1. However, for people wanting to go to The Quay Hotel and neighbouring houses, they have to go in the wrong direction to exit this way. All that is needed is to cut a hole in the fence and enable people to come off/on the coast path via the ramp at the southern end of the platform. That would not cost a fortune - see image 2.

How much should it cost, and why does it need to be done for a handful of houses and the hotel? Are the hotel and house owners going to contribute?

 

[Envoy]

How much should it cost, and why does it need to be done for a handful of houses and the hotel? Are the hotel and house owners going to contribute?

How much does it cost to send someone with some wire cutters and lay a few paving slabs?

Why should the hotel owners and residents contribute? The rail authority should do it to make access easier and the payback is getting more people to use the trains.

 

[Spartacus]

Deganwy is a station on the Llandudno branch. Alongside it runs a coastal path but this is sealed off from the station. It would surely be most useful to a number of people if direct access to this station from the coast path was created and this could be done at little cost.

As things stand, anybody alighting at this station from a Llandudno bound train, has to cross an old fashioned footbridge to the east side and then over a car park and then cross a busy road to reach a narrow pavement. To proceed south to the Quay Hotel and the surrounding modern houses, one must proceed south on the narrow pavement and then cross the main road again and then over the level crossing. All that hassle because Network Rail don’t make a ramp to the coast path - which would cost peanuts.

I understand the wall there forms part of the coastal defences, railway wall to the NW, coastal wall to the SW, with a section of the coastal path that's blocked when need arises, the 'join' is right by the station. The easiest place from that point of view would be to build within the coastal wall defence, but there isn't room for a ramp with the footbridge one one side and the estuary on the other. Build it on the other wise and it's adding another potential failure point, and it's narrow enough as it is there anyway. There's also the difficulty in providing a ramp that's fully accessible but which doesn't also encourage cyclists to ride straight up off the coastal path onto the platform.

Given it's not exactly far to the level crossing at either end, and the coastal path there goes nowhere other than the level crossing at either end, I don't see the pressing need?

For the agile bodied there's a not too difficult short cut anyway...

 

[Meerkat]

Why would a cut through need to be accessible if there is an accessible exit at the other end of the platform?

 

[Envoy]

Why would a cut through need to be accessible if there is an accessible exit at the other end of the platform?

To provide a short cut. I bet the public have created loads of unofficial short cuts to stations all over the country because the authorities have failed to do so in order to make life easier.

 

[The Planner]

How much does it cost to send someone with some wire cutters and lay a few paving slabs?

Why should the hotel owners and residents contribute? The rail authority should do it to make access easier and the payback is getting more people to use the trains.

Its not "just" doing that is it. What about any consents, consultation, planning etc. That needs people, time and money, not matter how small the job is. Why should the railway pay for something that you have already said is a handful of people, is it value for money, why can't the council pay?

 

[30907]

How much does it cost to send someone with some wire cutters and lay a few paving slabs?

Why should the hotel owners and residents contribute? The rail authority should do it to make access easier and the payback is getting more people to use the trains.

I imagine the main beneficiaries would actually be people who presently have to wait at the Quay level crossing rather than rail users - being law-abiding persons they won't be tempted to trespass and take a short cut across the track now will they?

BTW you mention crossing the busy road but not that there are pedestrian lights at both locations.

 

[Meerkat]

To provide a short cut. I bet the public have created loads of unofficial short cuts to stations all over the country because the authorities have failed to do so in order to make life easier.

Someone said that any official cut through would have to be made accessible - I was querying whether that is true is there is an alternative accessible exit.
Dorking station car park got fenced when it got safe parking accreditation, blocking an unofficial path through the hedge. Fence got repeatedly broken down, and repaired. Eventually they made an official gap - presumably this was allowed under secure parking standards but a broken fence wasn’t!

 

[Tazi Hupefi]

Someone said that any official cut through would have to be made accessible - I was querying whether that is true is there is an alternative accessible exit.
Dorking station car park got fenced when it got safe parking accreditation, blocking an unofficial path through the hedge. Fence got repeatedly broken down, and repaired. Eventually they made an official gap - presumably this was allowed under secure parking standards but a broken fence wasn’t!

Yes it does have to be fully accessible. It would almost certainly be unlawful discrimination to insist that a person in need of accessible facilities used an alternative entrance just to avoid having to pay to do the work.

Network Rail as a public body not only has a duty to comply with accessibility guidelines, they have a legal duty to promote accessibility wherever possible.

The only real exception is that there is some engineering challenge that makes it so difficult that it would be unreasonable to make those adjustments, but for an organisation like Network Rail, very little will be unreasonable.

 

[Meerkat]

Yes it does have to be fully accessible. It would almost certainly be unlawful discrimination to insist that a person in need of accessible facilities used an alternative entrance just to avoid having to pay to do the work.

Network Rail as a public body not only has a duty to comply with accessibility guidelines, they have a legal duty to promote accessibility wherever possible.

The only real exception is that there is some engineering challenge that makes it so difficult that it would be unreasonable to make those adjustments, but for an organisation like Network Rail, very little will be unreasonable.

That just seems spiteful, especially if this exit was actually useful for a lot of people.

 

[Envoy]

It looks an easy enough job to create a link between the coastal path and Deganwy platform - south side ramp (Llandudno bound trains) for ALL people.

 

[Llandudno]

Looking at maps, it might be simpler to head west from the station, turn left over the level crossing, left again on to the coast path. No need to cross the main road.

That’s what I do when walking the dog!

The path runs directly between the railway line and Conwy Estuary with fabulous views of Conwy Castle!

There is really no need to reopen the old crossing, it would lead to loads more litter on the beautiful coastal path as the old crossing is directly opposite a popular fish and chip shop and closeish to a Co-op convenience store…

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 10 Sep 2024 ==

I did not realise that a footpath went from the platform at the north end by the signal box - see image 1. However, for people wanting to go to The Quay Hotel and neighbouring houses, they have to go in the wrong direction to exit this way. All that is needed is to cut a hole in the fence and enable people to come off/on the coast path via the ramp at the southern end of the platform. That would not cost a fortune - see image 2.

You literally have to walk 5 yards* ‘in the wrong direction’ from the end of the Llandudno bound platform behind the signal box to gain level access to the coastal path towards The Quay Hotel and Conwy.

In most cases it’s slightly longer than that as virtually all trains stop in the middle of the platform!

 

[Carntyne]

Deganwy is a station on the Llandudno branch. Alongside it runs a coastal path but this is sealed off from the station. It would surely be most useful to a number of people if direct access to this station from the coast path was created and this could be done at little cost.

As things stand, anybody alighting at this station from a Llandudno bound train, has to cross an old fashioned footbridge to the east side and then over a car park and then cross a busy road to reach a narrow pavement. To proceed south to the Quay Hotel and the surrounding modern houses, one must proceed south on the narrow pavement and then cross the main road again and then over the level crossing. All that hassle because Network Rail don’t make a ramp to the coast path - which would cost peanuts.

What did they say when you asked them to do it?

 

[Gathursty]

I'm in favour of NR doing something if more money is spent on designing it than building it.