East Anglia planned pylons

[swt_passenger]

Won't the buzzing just be 50hz hum, the "crackling" will be discharge, the 33kV lines on wooden pylons that go through work can be quite loud when it's damp.

Never sure of the exact mechanisms in play, but I’m pretty sure it’s not the main structure of the pylon.

 

[Ediswan]

Never sure of the exact mechanisms in play, but I’m pretty sure it’s not the main structure of the pylon.

As far as I am aware, there are two sources. The wires themselves, and the insulators attaching the wires to the pylons. The condition of those insulators is a factor.

 

[dgl]

As far as I am aware, there are two sources. The wires themselves, and the insulators attaching the wires to the pylons. The condition of those insulators is a factor.

and naturally a wet insulator (well assuming it's not distilled water!) will conduct some electricity to the structure, causing corona discharge

 

[joebassman]

Is it true that there is an increased risk of cancer when living near pylons?

 

[bleeder4]

Personally i prefer the traditional style metal pylons/towers to the new T type which look like ski lifts.

I'm the opposite. I prefer the new T type pylons, I think they look much smarter and less intrusive than the traditional ones. Driving down the M5 from the Midlands, I always know when I've passed into Somerset when I start seeing those T shaped pylons. Incidentally, my understanding is that the traditional ones are shaped the way they are because they were designed during the unlocking of Tutankhamun's tomb during a time period when the general public was going crazy for Egyptian style architecture.

 

[ABB125]

The BBC is now covering today‘s National Grid announcement (link below). Government straight on the defensive, but they can’t have a future based on offshore wind and solar etc without some sort of change to the distribution system. (Although there’s probably MPs who think it can all be done with batteries…)

Electricity upgrade plan includes miles of pylons

New undersea cables and on shore power lines including pylons could add up to £30 a year to energy bills, a new plan suggests.

www.bbc.co.uk

Is it just me who is surprised by the fact that the ESO will be apparently transferring to the government later this year?

 

[Welly]

Is it true that there is an increased risk of cancer when living near pylons?

No

 

[telstarbox]

Even if there was it would be very hard to determine as everyone lives near electricity cables in their home or workplace.

 

[dangie]

Is it true that there is an increased risk of cancer when living near pylons?

Probably more risk of ‘C’ with holding a mobile phone next to your earhole.

 

[joebassman]

Probably more risk of ‘C’ with holding a mobile phone next to your earhole.

And all the chemicals, additives, and processed sugars in the majority of food

 

[Snow1964]

According to the plans, a significant stretch of the route will be buried where it goes around the picturesque "constable country" area south of Ipswich.

Very similar to the new t-pylon route in Somerset to Hinkley point.
That has underground section through Mendip Hills. They are also removing about 30 existing pylons and moving that underground at same time

New route is 48.5km are overhead, and 8.5km underground. A few conventional pylons exist near the ends. Wiring has just finished

Wiring finishes on 57km of T-pylons to connect Hinkley Point C to the grid

National Grid has completed the installation of 116 T-pylons in Somerset as it builds out the infrastructure needed to connect Hinkley Point C to the grid.

eandt.theiet.org

 

[Acfb]

The pylons seem to be a big local issue for the Greens to campaign against particularly the newly elected MP for Waveney Valley Adrian Ramsey. Again I am a Labour member but I have not followed what the East Anglian Labour MPs stance on the pylons is. I assume for as Labour is in government. I assume the Tories are against for NIMBY reasons in some of their remaining constituencies?

 

[mikeg]

Why are the greens campaigning against something which will more effectively move green energy around the country? By reducing grid constraints we can decrease fossil fuel usage without having to build as much new generation. It seems to me they're really not a serious political party.

 

[brad465]

Why are the greens campaigning against something which will more effectively move green energy around the country? By reducing grid constraints we can decrease fossil fuel usage without having to build as much new generation. It seems to me they're really not a serious political party.

They have to pander to the NIMBY lobby at local level more than any green issues. This parliament will likely expose their hypocrisy as they now hold two rural seats, while at the same time the government is one with ambitions to build plenty, both in housing and infrastructure.

 

[THC]

They have to pander to the NIMBY lobby at local level more than any green issues. This parliament will likely expose their hypocrisy as they now hold two rural seats, while at the same time the government is one with ambitions to build plenty, both in housing and infrastructure.

I don't know that hypocrisy is fair, more that the Greens now represent two quite different philosophies - radical and conservative, the latter being prevalent in Suffolk where they gained control of East Suffolk council this year - and are struggling to reconcile both to a coherent policy position.

THC

 

[Horizon22]

The pylons seem to be a big local issue for the Greens to campaign against particularly the newly elected MP for Waveney Valley Adrian Ramsey. Again I am a Labour member but I have not followed what the East Anglian Labour MPs stance on the pylons is. I assume for as Labour is in government. I assume the Tories are against for NIMBY reasons in some of their remaining constituencies?

I think local MPs from every party (Labour, Greens, Tories and Lib Dems all have MPs on or very close to the planned route) are against it.

The Greens are actually a very NIMBY party which might surprise some but they defend it with their "anti-growth and development" rhetoric which similar to their HS2 stance is another reason I feel they can't be taken seriously. They've taken local seats of the Tories, a good chunk of it for this reason as some people see the Greens locally as 'protecting our lovely green countryside" without understanding their left-wing underpinning philosophies.

 

[Magdalia]

This issue featured in the first Prime Ministers Questions after the General Election.

PM calls on Green MP to support pylons plan for East Anglia

Sir Keir Starmer challenges Adrian Ramsay during PMQs, urging him to "show some leadership".

www.bbc.co.uk

The prime minister has called on a Green MP to support plans for a massive pylon route across East Anglia.
Earlier this month Waveney Valley MP Adrian Ramsay asked for a “pause” in the “controversial” 114-mile (184-km) scheme that could run from Norwich to Tilbury in Essex.
Mr Ramsay said the infrastructure was needed, but other options should be considered, as the pylon proposal had stirred “huge local concern”.
At Prime Minister’s Questions on Wednesday, Sir Keir Starmer said it was “extraordinary” that Mr Ramsay was “opposing vital clean energy infrastructure”.

Exposing policies to scrutiny is a two way street.

 

[DerekC]

I can't imagine the fuss there would be if somehow we were needing to build the whole grid now - fortunately it was done in times when NIMBY culture hadn't grown.

 

[Ediswan]

National Grid do not always help their own case:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cvg4p80kx9vo

A farmer has spoken of his frustration after National Grid dug up a field two days before a barley crop was due to be harvested.

Richard Langton, of Langton Farms in Little Wenham, Suffolk, said he made an agreement with National Grid so they could work on his land with 48 hours' notice - and after the harvest.

It was clearer on the local TV news that the areas 'dug up' were the footprints of proposed pylons, not a whole field.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Is the farmer in question perhaps just trying to wangle some extra compensation?

Further extract as per the above news story (and attributed to National Grid)...

We have apologised to the landowner and will compensate for any loss of crop."

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

They have to pander to the NIMBY lobby at local level more than any green issues. This parliament will likely expose their hypocrisy as they now hold two rural seats, while at the same time the government is one with ambitions to build plenty, both in housing and infrastructure.

No they don't anyone who voted Green new what the deal was. They won the constituency so just need to get on and support policies in alignment with their mandate. You'll never please everybody in this world and if our predecessors had tried to do so we wouldn't be as far advanced as we are now.

 

[BrianW]

No they don't anyone who voted Green new what the deal was. They won the constituency so just need to get on and support policies in alignment with their mandate. You'll never please everybody in this world and if our predecessors had tried to do so we wouldn't be as far advanced as we are now.

It is so refreshing to know that those who complain about pylons refuse to use electricity.

 

[Magdalia]

The local councils have backed away from seeking judicial review of this.

Councils withdraw legal action against Sunnica Energy Farm

Four councils say their planned action against the approved 2,500-acre farm will no longer go ahead.

www.bbc.co.uk

A legal challenge against an approved solar farm project will end after two councils withdrew from the action.

The 2,500-acre Sunnica Energy Farm on the Suffolk/Cambridgeshire border was approved last month by the Secretary of State for Energy Security and Net Zero, Ed Miliband.

Suffolk County Council, West Suffolk Council, Cambridgeshire County Council and East Cambridgeshire District Council had planned to undertake a judicial review proceeding against the plans.

However West Suffolk Council and Cambridgeshire County Council chose to withdraw from the process, which resulted in the remaining councils deciding to not continue with the action.

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

The local councils have backed away from seeking judicial review of this.

Councils withdraw legal action against Sunnica Energy Farm

Four councils say their planned action against the approved 2,500-acre farm will no longer go ahead.

www.bbc.co.uk

Solar panels on prime farmland shouldn't be allowed but should be mandated on large industrial buildings and other dead space areas like public car parks before there allowed on virgin land. There is also not much point to them in the likes of Scotland where irradiation levels are too low and they only get built because of subsidies. Use that subsidy to help people insulate their homes.

Anyhow maybe they will think twice about opposing a few pylons that will have the ability to shift power for millions of people.

 

[Magdalia]

It was early in the morning and I was muddling the pylons and the solar panels!

The relevance to the pylons is limited to the capacity of Local Authorities to go for Judicial Review. I suspect that they will face the same issues if they want to challenge the pylon line.

As it happens, the Sunnica solar farm is not on prime farmland, which only produces high yield with lots of fertiliser and lots of irrigation, neither of which are environmentally friendly. The land will still be agriculturally productive, and in a more environmentally friendly way, as it will be returned to grass and used to graze sheep.

Maybe solar panels need their own dedicated discussion?

 

[BrianW]

Pylons and panels are both about 'visual intrusions into the landscape' in favour of energy provision. Folk want the latter without the 'pain' of the former- 'cakeism'.
Local authorities are spending other people's money, which grows on a magic money tree of course.
Some 'real world- ism' being recognised? More pylons and more panels please, including in my back yard- YIMBYism.

 

[Cowley]

Thread reopened for @Magdalia to update

 

[Magdalia]

Thread reopened for @Magdalia to update

Thanks.

National Grid have opened what they have called targeted consultations on the Norwich-Tilbury pylon line, see here:

Norwich to Tilbury | National Grid

The Norwich to Tilbury project will support the UK’s net zero target through the connection of new low carbon energy generation and by reinforcing the region's transmission network.

www.nationalgrid.com

Targeted consultations​

Targeted consultation on changes in Norfolk and Suffolk – 12 noon Thursday 30 January until 11:59 pm Monday 3 March 2025

We’re holding a series of targeted consultations on some potential changes to the proposals we published at our statutory consultation.

Most of these changes have been identified from feedback we’ve received. Before we make any decisions, we are going back to consult with those people living near these proposed changes.

We are phasing the consultations starting with locations in Norfolk and Suffolk from Thursday 30 January until Monday 3 March 2025 and will follow up next month with locations in Essex and Thurrock.

You would think that this might be regarded as a good thing, but here is some local reaction:

'Tweaks' proposed to Tilbury-Norwich pylon plans

Thirty locations are identified where "minor adjustments" can be made, National Grid says.

www.bbc.co.uk

Changes could be made to 30 sites along a route where pylons have been proposed following feedback from the public and local organisations, National Grid said.

It wants to install 114 miles (180km) of pylons between Tilbury in Essex and Norwich, to carry electricity produced by offshore wind farms.

The 30 locations in Essex, Suffolk and Norfolk could be subject to "minor adjustments and tweaks" - and those affected would be asked for their feedback, senior project manager Simon Pepper said.

Campaigners who have opposed the pylons said National Grid was showing "very selective hearing" and should consider alternatives, such as laying all of the cabling underground.

 

[dcbwhaley]

I think pylons add to the scenery of the countryside, although I understand if I'm in the minority there.

I think it'd be impractical and expensive to put all high voltage power lines underground, and that would likely increase power costs for everyone.

Undergrounding high voltage cables does not make them totally invisible. The cables need to be cooled which means that there has to be cvooling stations at frequent intervals. And you need to run a track along the route to allow access for servicing.

 

[mikeg]

Undergrounding high voltage cables does not make them totally invisible. The cables need to be cooled which means that there has to be cvooling stations at frequent intervals. And you need to run a track along the route to allow access for servicing.

Agreed. It's not the panacea people claim it is. Also how much extra do you wish to pay for electricity for this to happen, NIMBYs? Also I'd like to say to the campaigners how much do you think it is acceptable to undermine our energy security and climate goals so you can have a nice view (which is subjective anyway)?
Finally, electricity prices, energy security and climate change are objective things. Views are subjective. Surely from a philosophical point of view the objective should trump the subjective, no?