Halfex to Llandudno 1962

[Andy873]

I've recently been having a discussion with another member on here about trains from East Lancashire to North Wales.

I came across a snippet in one of Stuart Taylor's books of a traffic notice showing several Halfex (Half day Excursions) trains, one of which was going to Llandudno, the 1T84.

This train left Colne at 9.41 am (10/6/1962) and was steam hauled.

It takes 50 minutes to arrive at Blackburn where it stands for ten minutes before departing at 10.41 am. Now the times for Blackburn have a K in them:

10K31
10K41

Questions:
What could the K denote in this instance?
Why a 10 minute stop?
From Blackburn, can we trace its route? it could have gone down the Cherry Tree - Chorley line but also could have gone down from Blackburn to Bolton.

Thanks,
Andy.

 

[Belperpete]

Can't help with your specific query, but I do remember the excursion trains to Llandudno. On a summer Saturday, there would be a procession of excursion trains going there. Llandudno was a regular destination for the "mystery destination" excursions that were popular back in the day. Trains would be queued at every signal between Llandudno and the Junction waiting to get in, and likewise the empties would be queued at every signal in the other direction. There was a large fan of carriage sidings at Llandudno, but they soon filled up, and even so the locos had to go back to the Junction.

 

[Taunton]

I believe K was a common code for loco takes water, along with W for train stops only for loco to take water.

Onwards from Blackburn it could either have gone through Chorley and Wigan, or towards Preston and then the link behind Lostock Hall loco shed to the main line at Farington South Junction, the latter useful if it was wanted to change crews there. Running these ways were major routings for heavy freight services of the era from Crewe to Carlisle, via Blackburn, Hellifield and the Settle & Carlisle, keeping them off the main WCML over Shap.

Llandudno is not actually that far away from Blackburn, up on the Great Orme, on a clear day with binoculars, you can readily see the TV mast at Winter Hill, and at night the red lights on it.

 

[Andy873]

Can't help with your specific query, but I do remember the excursion trains to Llandudno. On a summer Saturday, there would be a procession of excursion trains going there. Llandudno was a regular destination for the "mystery destination" excursions that were popular back in the day. Trains would be queued at every signal between Llandudno and the Junction waiting to get in, and likewise the empties would be queued at every signal in the other direction. There was a large fan of carriage sidings at Llandudno, but they soon filled up, and even so the locos had to go back to the Junction.

A very popular destination and was high up on the list of days out from East Lancs. Didn't realise things could get so congested there.

Onwards from Blackburn it could either have gone through Chorley and Wigan, or towards Preston and then the link behind Lostock Hall loco shed to the main line at Farington South Junction, the latter useful if it was wanted to change crews there. Running these ways were major routings for heavy freight services of the era from Crewe to Carlisle, via Blackburn, Hellifield and the Settle & Carlisle, keeping them off the main WCML over Shap.

Yes I agree, the Cherry Tree - Chorley route would be the most obvious one until early 1966 when the line closed to traffic.

Llandudno is not actually that far away from Blackburn, up on the Great Orme, on a clear day with binoculars, you can readily see the TV mast at Winter Hill, and at night the red lights on it.

Winter hill is well named! As for the TV mast, if you've ever been up Winter hill and seen it you realise just how tall it is, I think it's around 1,000 feet!

I believe K was a common code for loco takes water, along with W for train stops only for loco to take water.

Thanks for that, I knew about the W but not the K, Blackburn was a typical place to take on water.

How long would you typically get in Llandudno on a half day excursion?

This particular train takes a full hour just to get from Colne to Blackburn.

 

[rototunablack5]

According to an LMR Special Traffic Notice from the “Colne Holidays” on 11 July 1957, the letter K denotes a refreshment stop. Blackburn would be ideal for that. Possibly because a lot of trains used old, non corridor stock. And yes, Cherry Tree - Chorley was the obvious route.

 

[Andy873]

According to an LMR Special Traffic Notice from the “Colne Holidays” on 11 July 1957, the letter K denotes a refreshment stop. Blackburn would be ideal for that. Possibly because a lot of trains used old, non corridor stock

Thanks for that.

By refreshment stop I guess most would be diving for the toilets?

Yes, these trains did on the whole use old non-corridor stock.

As this train ran in 1962 and I have a summer WTT from the same year I decided to compare the Halfex with regular passenger services:

Regular services.
These by 1962 were a mixture of steam hauled and DMU sets. Both types of train stopped at Burnley Central for 2 minutes, Accrington - 2 minutes for the DMU's and 4 for the steam ones.

The DMU's gave the best timing at 48 minutes (Colne - Blackburn) and 50 for the steam hauled ones. Although the steam hauled / DMU's regulars took roughly same amount of time as the Halfex, they (unlike the Halfex) stopped at three more intermediate stations (including Accrington). The Halfex didn't stop there.

On the flip side, the regular trains were 3 set DMU's or steam engine with three carriages. The Halfex on the other hand, would be steam hauling usually 10 carriages and full with passengers.

Stuart Taylor describes in his book for example leaving Burnley Barracks station. It is up hill from there to Gannow Junction and any long, heavy excursion train that stopped here had a tough, slow crawl up to Gannow. The shorter regulars would have no such problem.

I wonder if any of the Halfex passengers rushed for those famous BR sandwiches? Most people would make their own to bring along.

Would there be an announcement at Blackburn station that the Halfex is about to leave?