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Well as you ask, the point is and speaking from someone 's point of view who is both a business traveller and a freelancer. So answerable and accountable to multiple people and organisations at any one time including my own accountant, the point is that by the time I've paid service fees and delivery charges to just eat and eaten. What in all honesty is usually a pretty decidedly average burger or whatever? I've spent more than the hotels in-house offering even if it's more expensive. And not entirely sure how they've done it. But after years of poor quality, prick and ping, which would make even the lousy quality Tesco offerings shudder with embarrassment. Travelodge have really upped their game on their food and beverage offering in recent times. Not perfect but this time a decade ago I would have probably died with shock had I discovered a bean to cup coffee machine in a Travelodge, now commonplace in all locations with a bar cafe. Yes, most of the meals are still frozen whatever, but they have definitely upped the quality and listened to customer feedback, including my own. Now to get them to use a decent hash brown and move away from the awful packet. Scrambled eggs at breakfast
Agreed that TL have considerably upped their game, but it is still preheated, prepackaged food, not a restaurant meal. And some TLs do a very good scrambled egg, certainly better than my last PI scrambled egg which was rubbery, despite only just having come out the kitchen.
The fact that you have tried delivered food where the in house restaurant offers the same shows the pointlessness of the in house restaurant offering - they will always be sharing the market, but with only a limited clientele to start with. Most people will choose the known quality delivered McD burger to the unknown quality and generally more expensive in-house burger. As evidenced by the number of delivery drivers delivering to hotels. I doubt that TL are making any profit on their evening meals.
Once upon a time, hotels used to make a significant part of their profit based on the extras they could sell Nowadays I doubt anyone uses the in room phones (where they even still exist), pays extra for the porn channels, or buys internet access, as it can all be done for zero cost through your mobile. Likewise people who order takeaways at home are doing likewise when staying in hotels, so there is no profit to be made from in-house restaurants. Which is one of the reasons why hotel room rates are so much more expensive.
The fact that you have tried delivered food where the in house restaurant offers the same shows the pointlessness of the in house restaurant offering - they will always be sharing the market, but with only a limited clientele to start with. Most people will choose the known quality delivered McD burger to the unknown quality and generally more expensive in-house burger. As evidenced by the number of delivery drivers delivering to hotels. I doubt that TL are making any profit on their evening meals.
I can't imagine an in-house burger bad enough for me to resort to the known quality of McDs instead. Mind you, I'm down from a couple of takeaways a month to almost none, because I just can't be bothered with the ever-increasing chance of it turning up cold and inedible. Mostly when I'm away I'll grab something more substantial during the day when I'm near a reasonable restaurant/cafe, and then just grab a sandwich for the evening.
Not that the hotel restaurant benefits either way, but then I don't think they ever did from me. Just like I've never used the minibars, phones, premium TV channels or pay internet. I'm not sure any of those were ever huge revenue generators for most hotels though, and they haven't ever been in the lifetime of PI and TL.
The important point to note from that article is that they are going to be breakfast only. A restaurant open in the evenings only for hotel guests would be half empty, if that, and would surely make a loss. Most hotel guests only want a breakfast, and that can be turned out relatively easily by few, less qualified staff than a proper restaurant. It doesn't need a Michelin star chef to heat up baked beans (although providing decent scrambled eggs that don't resemble Michelin rubber seems to be beyond many hotels unfortunately).
I thought some were doing evening food as well, and if they don't then some of the places far away from any other food options will definitely risk losing business.
We've lost our nearest local pub, as part of the Airfield was for people drinking or wanting to play pool, watch TV. I am not sure how many locals went there in recent years, but I guess it can't have been significant. It was a popular place in the evenings though for people eating, having parties etc, but again they've probably determined they can make more money from either repurposing the building for more rooms or selling it off for housing.
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Actually, with the ridiculous cost of ordering food for delivery, unless you're going to pick up then a lot of people aren't going to continue using Just-Eat forever, however slick the advertising is.
Once restaurants were allowed to switch to another menu when you selected delivery, adding 20-30% per item, and then add a bag fee (you can't not have it in a bag), service charge AND delivery fee, it's quite possible to pay double for an order - and for small orders, like say a small burger at McDonald's the total cost might be four times as much.
I certainly am not going to stay in a hotel where I'm encouraged to order in. Besides the cost, the chances are that a delivery to a hotel is also going to result in cold food from finding the hotel, parking up, getting into reception and getting access to the room (or more likely you need to collect from reception).
If we can get food prices to start coming down, and more restaurants seek to lower prices (as many have seen a drop in trade since prices went up), then it will be a bit late for Whitbread to change its mind having knocked down the restaurants that - for me - were one of the key reasons I'd stay in a Premier Inn; knowing the restaurant would provide a certain standard of food, drink and ambience.
Of course they have the facts and figures and different locations would mean some restaurants being more able to stand on their own feet than others, but I'll certainly be mindful of this going forward and more open to looking at other chains.
I thought some were doing evening food as well, and if they don't then some of the places far away from any other food options will definitely risk losing business.
We've lost our nearest local pub, as part of the Airfield was for people drinking or wanting to play pool, watch TV. I am not sure how many locals went there in recent years, but I guess it can't have been significant. It was a popular place in the evenings though for people eating, having parties etc, but again they've probably determined they can make more money from either repurposing the building for more rooms or selling it off for housing.
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Actually, with the ridiculous cost of ordering food for delivery, unless you're going to pick up then a lot of people aren't going to continue using Just-Eat forever, however slick the advertising is.
Once restaurants were allowed to switch to another menu when you selected delivery, adding 20-30% per item, and then add a bag fee (you can't not have it in a bag), service charge AND delivery fee, it's quite possible to pay double for an order - and for small orders, like say a small burger at McDonald's the total cost might be four times as much.
I certainly am not going to stay in a hotel where I'm encouraged to order in. Besides the cost, the chances are that a delivery to a hotel is also going to result in cold food from finding the hotel, parking up, getting into reception and getting access to the room (or more likely you need to collect from reception).
If we can get food prices to start coming down, and more restaurants seek to lower prices (as many have seen a drop in trade since prices went up), then it will be a bit late for Whitbread to change its mind having knocked down the restaurants that - for me - were one of the key reasons I'd stay in a Premier Inn; knowing the restaurant would provide a certain standard of food, drink and ambience.
Of course they have the facts and figures and different locations would mean some restaurants being more able to stand on their own feet than others, but I'll certainly be mindful of this going forward and more open to looking at other chains.
I would say never underestimate the laziness of many people. Even people with very little money buy meals when they could make their own for less. So delivery panders very well to those who never venture outside for incidental exercise - preferring to join a gym (and maybe actually never go) !.
I would say never underestimate the laziness of many people. Even people with very little money buy meals when they could make their own for less. So delivery panders very well to those who never venture outside for incidental exercise - preferring to join a gym (and maybe actually never go) !.
I have lazy days where I order in and accept the convenience charge. If I've had a drink or am very tired, I don't fancy driving or cycling to pick up, so I pay the premium.
But a lot of people aren't swimming in disposable income right now so I think it's fair to say (certainly from my non-scientific chat amongst friends) that ordering in is not something done as much as in the past. Just-Eat can afford big ad campaigns thanks to taking a hefty cut from organisations using it, and I'm sure we've all made jokes or 'said the line' as a hint that maybe tonight we just order in, but I still can't imagine myself ordering in to a hotel.
If I'm staying in a city centre, I'll always eat locally. If I'm in a hotel away from amenities, I'm far more likely to want to eat there. I know they're not closing every restaurant, but some of the places closing do seem a little odd - but I can also see that some of the locations are setup such that it would be quite feasible to knock down the restaurant for flats and that might well be the key incentive.
Plus if there are no local restaurants or takeaways, all they need to do is offer simple food like a pizza or burger and maybe that will suffice. If it doesn't, they'll lose customers.
Myself and John are clearly on the same wavelength with this. I've already switched a fairly hefty chunk of my business away from premiering in in recent times due to rocketing prices and lowering standards and more business will now also move, and wants a good few of us have done this. Then Premier in will notice the difference and hopefully indulge in a bit of head scratching as to why
I am of the same mind, but attitudes change. At one time I would be embarrassed to bring a takeaway back to my room (and I can recall hotels that forbad it), but now I have no qualms. Likewise while I wouldn't dream of ordering a delivery, I have noticed that it is increasingly common to see delivery drivers waiting outside hotels. One large hotel that I regularly stay at has an in-house restaurant, and has a large number of local restaurants and takeaways within 10 minutes walk, but even so, there are increasingly delivery drivers hanging around in the lobby. It has all got to be eating into the in-house restaurant viability.
At the end of the day, the restaurant is there to turn a profit. Once you get to the stage where the hotel is subsidising the restaurant, and the restaurant is a liability, then something has to change, and that is what is happening at PI.
Hotels are now almost entirely reliant on the room charge for their profit, which is one reason at least why rates at places like PI have rocketed. I don't see any reason for thinking that is changing any time soon.
Travelodge have been steadily increasing the quality of their offering, and no doubt that PI will feel the pinch as they downgrade their restaurant offering. But anyone hoping that PI is somehow going to ignore hard commercial realities is living in a pipe dream - far more likely that they will simply close those hotels that can't turn a profit on rooms alone.
I am of the same mind, but attitudes change. At one time I would be embarrassed to bring a takeaway back to my room (and I can recall hotels that forbad it), but now I have no qualms. Likewise while I wouldn't dream of ordering a delivery, I have noticed that it is increasingly common to see delivery drivers waiting outside hotels. One large hotel that I regularly stay at has an in-house restaurant, and has a large number of local restaurants and takeaways within 10 minutes walk, but even so, there are increasingly delivery drivers hanging around in the lobby. It has all got to be eating into the in-house restaurant viability.
At the end of the day, the restaurant is there to turn a profit. Once you get to the stage where the hotel is subsidising the restaurant, and the restaurant is a liability, then something has to change, and that is what is happening at PI.
Hotels are now almost entirely reliant on the room charge for their profit, which is one reason at least why rates at places like PI have rocketed. I don't see any reason for thinking that is changing any time soon.
Travelodge have been steadily increasing the quality of their offering, and no doubt that PI will feel the pinch as they downgrade their restaurant offering. But anyone hoping that PI is somehow going to ignore hard commercial realities is living in a pipe dream - far more likely that they will simply close those hotels that can't turn a profit on rooms alone.
Personally, even for 4* hotels, I would prefer the option of a simple snack rather than the full-on "meal" and hotels simply don't cater (ahem..) for that? If they do those snacks are often horrendously expensive. Sometimes just a plate of chips or a simple pie will do, and I'm sure if they did that they would profit rather than have the likes of myself disappearing off to the local Greggs!!
Personally, even for 4* hotels, I would prefer the option of a simple snack rather than the full-on "meal" and hotels simply don't cater (ahem..) for that? If they do those snacks are often horrendously expensive. Sometimes just a plate of chips or a simple pie will do, and I'm sure if they did that they would profit rather than have the likes of myself disappearing off to the local Greggs!!
The reason that they are horrendously expensive is because of the overheads involved. You are only going to gets Greggs price and quality with Greggs volume of custom, and very few hotel restaurants can hope to achieve anything near that. Something inevitably has to give.
The reason that they are horrendously expensive is because of the overheads involved. You are only going to gets Greggs price and quality with Greggs volume of custom, and very few hotel restaurants can hope to achieve anything near that. Something inevitably has to give.
Will a Greggs or a low cost chain work inside hotels as there are some in airports, hospitals and rail stations, service stations? Some Sainsburys & Tesco stores are converting their cafes into Greggs.
Will a Greggs or a low cost chain work inside hotels as there are some in airports, hospitals and rail stations, service stations? Some Sainsburys & Tesco stores are converting their cafes into Greggs.
Probably would with city-centre hotels, as long as the public have total access and know about it. There's a Greggs atattched to my local petrol station (as there is many a Spar, Coffee shop etc) but of course it doesn't have to be Greggs, up here Greenhalgh's or Carrs would do!!
There's a hotel I go to in Spain has shops within the foyer, but selling tourist rubbish and expensive (overpriced??) jewelry inside the foyer, so it can be done!
Will a Greggs or a low cost chain work inside hotels as there are some in airports, hospitals and rail stations, service stations? Some Sainsburys & Tesco stores are converting their cafes into Greggs.
It wouldn't work for me, given not least because a lot of the ones at airports and service stations are no cheaper than going somewhere that sells real food.
I suspect the reality in hotels is that you aren't changing the fundamental cost dynamics of having to have a member of staff working and hardly any customers, and you aren't changing the pricing much. You are just adding on the franchising cost.
Will a Greggs or a low cost chain work inside hotels as there are some in airports, hospitals and rail stations, service stations? Some Sainsburys & Tesco stores are converting their cafes into Greggs.
Excuse me whilst I've shudder at the idea of a Greggs or similar franchised operation inside my chosen budget hotel. I'm afraid I'm this sort of stick in the mud type that really wants a basic food and beverage service in a hotel and whilst Premier Inn might have lost the plot on this one there are other chains out there that still do seem to recognize this and are adapting accordingly
Going back to 10+ years ago Premier Inn was almost always my first choice when taking short breaks in this country. If I couldn’t find a Premier Inn I would put up with a Travelodge as my second choice. Although fairly basic compared to more upmarket hotels they were relatively comfortable, you got a good breakfast and above all they were affordable. I suppose that’s why they were known as budget hotels.
Although still fairly basic, can they still be considered to be budget hotels when they are charging in excess of £200 a night in some popular locations. When going to London I used to regularly use the Hampstead Premier Inn near Belsize Park tube station. It was always a bit expensive but was less than staying in Central London. I recently looked at it and they were asking £870 for 4 nights and that’s not including breakfast. I know that hotel prices have risen considerably recently, but I will not pay anything much over £100 a night for a so called budget hotel when you can get rooms in much better quality hotels at comparable, or sometimes cheaper prices.
A couple of weeks ago I did stay in a Premier Inn for the first time for a few years. One thing I did notice was how few staff there were comparison to how they were when I used them in the past. Both the reception and restaurant at breakfast seemed to be operating with the absolute minimum of staff.
A couple of weeks ago I did stay in a Premier Inn for the first time for a few years. One thing I did notice was how few staff there were comparison to how they were when I used them in the past. Both the reception and restaurant at breakfast seemed to be operating with the absolute minimum of staff.
Premier Inn seems to rely on self service check-in kiosks more than the others, more of it since the pandemic, just like in banks you'll see just one staff member serving a long queue!
I haven't been in a Travelodge for years, have they started putting in electronic kiosks yet? They're usually very good having staff more present than Premier Inn that the bell has to be rung for someone to turn up if you don't use a kiosk.
In my experience with Premier Inn, I have been mostly lucky to have someone at the desk without faffing with the kiosk as I tend to check in on later evenings which someone would be required to be present through the night.
I do remember being shocked when staying in a German hotel with no after hours reception service, would not be good for fire safety or public disorder as no one would be around to sort things out.
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Ha ha! I wouldn't mind having something like a Costa or Tim Hortons inside the hotel. Greggs would be OK but I would draw a line with McDs or rip-off station stalwarts like Upper Crust or Pumpkin
Ha ha! I wouldn't mind having something like a Costa or Tim Hortons inside the hotel. Greggs would be OK but I would draw a line with McDs or rip-off station stalwarts like Upper Crust or Pumpkin
I think catering for evening meals in budget hotels is going to move to vending machines, rather than a staffed restaurant. A couple of years ago, I had a decent fresh pizza from an automatic machine in a supermarket car park in France.
Wanted to travel to London next week midweek, staying in a Premier Inn or Travelodge in Milton Keynes to keep it cheap. One room, cheapest price in the Travelodge, a snitch under £200 for two nights.
Er, no. Think I'll look elsewhere!!
Wanted to travel to London next week midweek, staying in a Premier Inn or Travelodge in Milton Keynes to keep it cheap. One room, cheapest price in the Travelodge, a snitch under £200 for two nights.
Er, no. Think I'll look elsewhere!!
Now there's a whole other discussion all together, don't get me started on the ethics of Airbnb unless I've opened a separate thread for it. If lower end hotel catering moves to a vending machine and chef Mike then so be it, just don't inflict Greggs or McDonald's on me. And please continue to provide an option that doesn't involve some idiotic twit on a just eat bike delivering and overpriced substandard pizza for a night eye watering price!
Some Airbnbs are better than others, especially when you get all the various fees added on top they can work out to be more expensive than an actual hotel.
But for some people those style of accommodation is all they need, I use a place in Crewe which is a shared house which isn't perfect but is good value for money and has a decent sized kitchen area (a fridge is useful if I've got an early start planned so I can grab a sandwich the night before and put in the fridge).
As for catering, I can see more hotels moving down the 'breakfast only' route for a kitchen area, like the Premier Inn I used in April in Reading, which had a Toby restaurant next door (complete with advertising that breakfast was £6 to encourage hotel stayers to use them rather than the £11 in the hotel plus plenty of other options in the town centre.
I've heard so many horror stories about Airbnb that I have no desire to use one again. I've had mixed experiences over the years (nothing too terrible though) but was fairly open to checking sites when travelling. Now I stick to hotels or would book an apartment/cottage the 'old fashioned ways'.
With all the extra fees and risk of hidden charges/penalties, as well as places seeming more expensive than when I used to check the same areas in previous years, there certainly doesn't seem to be any cost benefits.
And even if you can stomach all of that which I can't personally there is the impact it has on communities. Having moved 16 months ago from a very high tourist area the concept of literally thousands of homes that were not all that long before lived in by local people certainly appearing on the platform and driving up house prices and driving people out just sticks in my gullet and they are a whole host of issues that come part of that package
And even if you can stomach all of that which I can't personally there is the impact it has on communities. Having moved 16 months ago from a very high tourist area the concept of literally thousands of homes that were not all that long before lived in by local people certainly appearing on the platform and driving up house prices and driving people out just sticks in my gullet and they are a whole host of issues that come part of that package
Airbnb has actually made some town centres like ghost towns abroad, as so many places are now short term lets.
Spain in particular seems to have been massively impacted, to the point where I think they're going to be banned entirely (they've tried limits before but seemed to fail miserably).
If this happens, people will return to using hotels (or they may not travel, but I doubt that for many popular locations).
The booking.com site has expanded from just hotels to also include rooms and apartments in a similar manner to Airbnb. Doesn't seem to carry the same problems as Airbnb. I have used it a couple of times when staying in small towns where hotel rooms are in short supply, with no issues.
Wales seems to be taking action against the likes of Airbnb, so that in future owners will require planning permission to let their properties. I assume that this will also impact the booking.com lettings too.
The booking.com site has expanded from just hotels to also include rooms and apartments in a similar manner to Airbnb. Doesn't seem to carry the same problems as Airbnb. I have used it a couple of times when staying in small towns where hotel rooms are in short supply, with no issues.
Wales seems to be taking action against the likes of Airbnb, so that in future owners will require planning permission to let their properties. I assume that this will also impact the booking.com lettings too.
Given the rate booking.com have expanded their apartments, I'd be surprised if they aren't starting to see all the same issues. Mind you, they are starting to struggle on the hotels side, where they are now rarely as cheap as booking direct.
As somebody living in a city with a shortage of both hotels and flats for people to live in, I'd strongly like to see the entire short term rental market be regulated out of existence. I will quite happily watch short term letters struggle for hours with lock boxes or dodgy keys rather than help. Just bear in mind that the long-suffering neighbours aren't going to provide the friendly reception services you were too cheap to pay for.
Home owners offering B&B used to be a staple of the tourist industry. It was a good way of local homeowners supplementing their income by letting out spare rooms, and a cheap way of taking a holiday for those who couldn't afford a hotel. There used to be plenty of B&Bs in the seaside town where I now live, run by local people. Some often owning a second adjacent or nearby property to offer additional rooms. I see no reason why they should be regulated out of existence, just because they now advertise on Airbnb rather than postcards in shop windows.
The important thing is that they bring business to the town. Who wants to live in a dying town? The real issue is second home owners who only occupy their properties for a few weeks a year, and the rest of the time are empty. Not those properties and rooms that are let on a short term basis to visitors bringing money in.
Home owners offering B&B used to be a staple of the tourist industry. It was a good way of local homeowners supplementing their income by letting out spare rooms, and a cheap way of taking a holiday for those who couldn't afford a hotel. There used to be plenty of B&Bs in the seaside town where I now live, run by local people. Some often owning a second adjacent or nearby property to offer additional rooms. I see no reason why they should be regulated out of existence, just because they now advertise on Airbnb rather than postcards in shop windows.
If it is a proper B&B experiance where you are renting a room or a nearby premises and the owner is providing a reception service thats fine and it is what AirBnB originally was for, letting rooms in your own home.
But letting entire properties on short term lets and purchasing the properties just to let them out and not getting proper planning permission to use them as short-term rentals for more than 90 days needs more action to properly stop people breaking the rules.
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