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I got an email from the digital fraud team, the 1st and 2nd email I didn’t see only noticed the 3rd one and I replied to it explaining that I didn’t see the first and 2nd email. Was asked to provide a job centre railcard I have been using, the thing is I never had the railcard I’m new to the country and a colleague of mine put it on, which I explained to them and I told them I was ready to pay the £317 fine they are asking for and need an account number to pay it to since I’ve looked online and can’t find anything. It’s been 2 days and I haven’t gotten a response yet and it says on the last email that I have till Monday till I’m reported to the British transport police. I have sent 2 emails since then asking for an account number but no reply. Does that mean it was a scam or something
@Tomsnose. Welcome to the forum. Just to clarify, you've been inappropriately claiming Jobcentre railcard discount for some time, giving you 50% off fares. You don't, however, have such a railcard. Why do you reckon that the e-mails that you've recently received enquiring about this might be scams?
I am aware of one TOC whom has been vigorously investigating the purchase of JobCentrePlus discounted tickets but no JobCentre discount card held.
Out of 49 investigations, only x 1 was entitled to and actually held a JobCentrePlus discount card.
One of the investigation team has a DWP (Deoartment for Work & Pensions) background and after obtaining data from online booking agents was able to cross check with relevant JobCentres as to whether the individuals concerned had been issued these discount cards, hence finding out that only 1 actually had a discount card.
One female has entered into a repayment plan to repay @ £2,000 of fares she should have paid.
Another individual started out applying JobCentre discounts that they were not entitled and then progressed to doughnuttimg, and is now being pursued for @ £9,000 of fares due, his online history did show him making an online purchase during a Cross Country journey for what he should have paid for that journey, presumably he was either confronted by on board staff or thought he was about to be rumbled so bought a ticket to avoid being found out.
I am not naming the investigating TOC for reasons of confidentiality and due to outstanding cases being pursued.
If you can show us the email (maybe take a screenshot or cut and paste it: make sure you hide your name and anything that would identify you) we may be able to help you understand it.
If you can show us the email (maybe take a screenshot or cut and paste it: make sure you hide your name and anything that would identify you) we may be able to help you understand it.
We've been investigating industry data and have been led to believe you are potentially claiming excessive refunds on West Midlands servicesand these refunds have been highlighted as potentially fraudulent.
We have details of your refund requests made which appear to be fraudulent together with the amount repayable to West Midlands Trains. Please respond to us within 7 days by email todigitalfraudteam@wmtrains.co.uk quoting the reference number DFTL131969315 in the subject field.
Based on your response the decision will be to either (a) offer you the opportunity to repay any claims that have proved to have been made fraudulently; or (b) pass your file to West Midlands Trains Prosecutors or the British Transport Police for further action to be taken.
If option (a) is chosen you will be given our bank details upon our receipt of your response.
We look forward to hearing from you.
Kind regards,
The 2nd one
Dear Customer,
West Midlands Trains
You have failed to respond to our previous attempt to contact you. We emailed you on11/13/2023. Please contact us promptly to avoid this being passed over to our prosecutions department and the British Transport Police.
We've been investigating industry data and have been led to believe you are potentially claiming excessive refunds on West Midlands servicesand these refunds have been highlighted as potentially fraudulent.
We have details of your refund requests made which appear to be fraudulent together with the amount repayable to West Midlands Trains. Please respond to us within 7 days by email todigitalfraudteam@wmtrains.co.uk quoting the reference number DFTL 131969315 in the subject field.
Based on your response the decision will be to either (a) offer you the opportunity to repay any claims that have proved to have been made fraudulently; or (b) pass your file to West Midlands Trains Prosecutors or the British Transport Police for further action to be taken.
If option (a) is chosen you will be given our bank details upon our receipt of your response.
The 3rd one
Dear Customer,
Re: Trainline Refunds
This is our final attempt to contact you. You have 7 days upon receipt of this communication to respond. We will then be passing your file to West Midlands Trains Prosecutors and the British Transport Police for further action to be taken.
You have £317.30 outstanding to be paid by 4th December 2023. Our first email to you was sent 13th November 2023.
We've been investigating industry data and have been led to believe you are potentially claiming excessive refunds on West Midlands services and these refunds have been highlighted as potentially fraudulent.
We have details of your refund requests made which appear to be fraudulent together with the amount repayable to West Midlands Trains. Please respond to us within 7 days by email to
== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==
@Tomsnose. Welcome to the forum. Just to clarify, you've been inappropriately claiming Jobcentre railcard discount for some time, giving you 50% off fares. You don't, however, have such a railcard. Why do you reckon that the e-mails that you've recently received enquiring about this might be scams?
I’ve been to the West Midlands office and they said they would get the fraud team to give me a call cause they weren’t sure it was from them but nothing yet. If there is any way to contact them so I can pay the fine before Monday I would appreciate it
Before going forward please can you provide your Jobcentre Plus Railcard from November 2022 to present day.
When we ask for evidence of ownership of a railcard this is because it could affect your case and is done before we send you any amounts, we deem you may owe.
Improper use of this facility is also classed as fraudulent activity.
== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==
The first email
Dear Customer,
Re: Trainline Refunds
We've been investigating industry data and have been led to believe you are potentially claiming excessive refunds on West Midlands servicesand these refunds have been highlighted as potentially fraudulent.
We have details of your refund requests made which appear to be fraudulent together with the amount repayable to West Midlands Trains. Please respond to us within 7 days by email todigitalfraudteam@wmtrains.co.uk quoting the reference number DFTL131969315 in the subject field.
Based on your response the decision will be to either (a) offer you the opportunity to repay any claims that have proved to have been made fraudulently; or (b) pass your file to West Midlands Trains Prosecutors or the British Transport Police for further action to be taken.
If option (a) is chosen you will be given our bank details upon our receipt of your response.
We look forward to hearing from you.
Kind regards,
The 2nd one
Dear Customer,
West Midlands Trains
You have failed to respond to our previous attempt to contact you. We emailed you on11/13/2023. Please contact us promptly to avoid this being passed over to our prosecutions department and the British Transport Police.
We've been investigating industry data and have been led to believe you are potentially claiming excessive refunds on West Midlands servicesand these refunds have been highlighted as potentially fraudulent.
We have details of your refund requests made which appear to be fraudulent together with the amount repayable to West Midlands Trains. Please respond to us within 7 days by email todigitalfraudteam@wmtrains.co.uk quoting the reference number DFTL 131969315 in the subject field.
Based on your response the decision will be to either (a) offer you the opportunity to repay any claims that have proved to have been made fraudulently; or (b) pass your file to West Midlands Trains Prosecutors or the British Transport Police for further action to be taken.
If option (a) is chosen you will be given our bank details upon our receipt of your response.
The 3rd one
Dear Customer,
Re: Trainline Refunds
This is our final attempt to contact you. You have 7 days upon receipt of this communication to respond. We will then be passing your file to West Midlands Trains Prosecutors and the British Transport Police for further action to be taken.
You have £317.30 outstanding to be paid by 4th December 2023. Our first email to you was sent 13th November 2023.
We've been investigating industry data and have been led to believe you are potentially claiming excessive refunds on West Midlands services and these refunds have been highlighted as potentially fraudulent.
We have details of your refund requests made which appear to be fraudulent together with the amount repayable to West Midlands Trains. Please respond to us within 7 days by email to
== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==
I’ve been to the West Midlands office and they said they would get the fraud team to give me a call cause they weren’t sure it was from them but nothing yet. If there is any way to contact them so I can pay the fine before Monday I would appreciate it
The first thing to do is to check that the email address they want you to reply to is valid. You're doing that right now, and hopefully someone who knows how West Midlands Trains works will be along soon to give you the answer (EDIT - and someone hasn't done so while I wrote this)
If it's a real email (EDIT - we now know it is real) the next thing to do is to get in touch with West Midlands Trains on or before Monday. Make it clear that you are willing to pay, and ask them for payment details.
If West Midlands Trains are like most organisations, then as long as you are in touch, they will be happy to give a few more days for you to pay. So the really important thing is to make contact with them!
Ok thanks. Although the timeline is a bit confusing now, as the final letter in which they say they haven’t had a response from you includes an amount to pay, which contradicts the above.
Notwithstanding that, if you have asked them twice for an account to pay it to, that should be sufficient at this stage to avoid the matter being taken further.
The first thing to do is to check that the email address they want you to reply to is valid. You're doing that right now, and hopefully someone who knows how West Midlands Trains works will be along soon to give you the answer (EDIT - and someone hasn't done so while I wrote this)
If it's a real email (EDIT - we now know it is real) the next thing to do is to get in touch with West Midlands Trains on or before Monday. Make it clear that you are willing to pay, and ask them for payment details.
If West Midlands Trains are like most organisations, then as long as you are in touch, they will be happy to give a few more days for you to pay. So the really important thing is to make contact with them!
Ok thanks. Although the timeline is a bit confusing now, as the final letter in which they say they haven’t had a response from you includes an amount to pay, which contradicts the above.
Notwithstanding that, if you have asked them twice for an account to pay it to, that should be sufficient at this stage to avoid the matter being taken further.
Multiple fraudulent refunds against fares already discounted by a non-existent Railcard? Compared to other Posters who struggle to get an out of court settlement over a single, accidental, irregularity, this OP has struck lucky!
So it seems to me, if I understand it correctly, they are investigating different things they believe you have done, which are:
a) claiming refunds for tickets that they believe you are not entitled get a refund for
and
b) buying tickets with Job Centre Railcard discount when you do not have such a Railcard
I assume you accept that you have done both of these things (best not to state here if you have or have not)
I think you perhaps should also check if the payment they are requesting is in relation to both of these matters or just one of them - eg see if they have different reference numbers on the e-mails etc if that may be a clue - so that you know if the payment of the sum demanded will bring both of these issues to a close and prevent any future prosecution.
The OP could, of course, try that defence in court, but unless they could identify said person I imagine the prosecution would ask the magistrates to draw the reasonable inference that no other person was involved.
At which point they could ask for that other person to be identified and proof of their railcard given. If no railcard is provided then the OP would just have admitted that they transferred a ticket with intent that it be used to enable someone to travel without paying the correct fare. If no person is identified, the court would have little difficulty drawing the inference 30907 describes.
I got an email from the digital fraud team, the 1st and 2nd email I didn’t see only noticed the 3rd one and I replied to it explaining that I didn’t see the first and 2nd email. Was asked to provide a job centre railcard I have been using, the thing is I never had the railcard I’m new to the country and a colleague of mine put it on, which I explained to them and I told them I was ready to pay the £317 fine they are asking for and need an account number to pay it to since I’ve looked online and can’t find anything. It’s been 2 days and I haven’t gotten a response yet and it says on the last email that I have till Monday till I’m reported to the British transport police. I have sent 2 emails since then asking for an account number but no reply. Does that mean it was a scam or something
Please start your own thread. No two problems are exactly the same and good advice for one can be bad for another. It also can be a problem if they become intertwined.
