Wirksworth Town Bus Service

[m79900]

Clearly, the number of people on here who will give a damn about this is very limited, but given the massive cutbacks on the little Sixes over the past decade or so, and the large new housing estates expected to be built in the not too distant future, could this happen in the future?

Take this for a route:

New supermarket on the estate to be built in the quarry (Bolehill until they’re built)
Coop
Runs down through town
Anthony Gell School
Doctors/leisure centre
Bournebrook Estate
Millers Green
Yokecliffe Estate
Doctors/leisure centre
Anthony Gell
Up through town
Coop
New supermarket on quarry housing estate. (Bolehill until they’re built)

I think this could maybe run a 30 minute interval service (at a push) so it could interwork with another service to a nearby village without a service, making each one hourly.

I know that it wouldn’t be a moneymaker , and that it’s just my imagination getting away with me, but the town has an ageing population, and the amount of non profitable routes locally supported by the council, why shouldn’t this be one of them?

Stagecoach, Trent, take note!

 

[RustySpoons]

I actually had to google where Wirksworth was!

Is this the type of service that could be provided with funding provided by the building developers?

See section 5 here

Developers can contribute to funding transport infrastructure and services: Local authorities can use planning obligations to require housing developers to make financial contributions for transport infrastructure, such as safe pedestrian crossings, bus stops and road junctions and transport services, such as extensions to existing bus routes and new bus services

This type of funding does have a name, but I can't for the life of me remember what it is! When I Googled it to confirm it came back with details of mental health funding, it definitely isn't that!

If there's no existing services that a new service would duplicate I can't see why such a service wouldn't be viable, at least for the short term whilst funding is available.

 

[Llandudno]

Wibble alert!
Clearly, the number of people on here who will give a damn about this is very limited, but given the massive cutbacks on the little Sixes over the past decade or so, and the large new housing estates expected to be built in the not too distant future, could this happen in the future?

Take this for a route:

New supermarket on the estate to be built in the quarry
Runs down through town
Doctors/leisure centre on water lane
Bournebrook Avenue
Millers Green
Yokecliffe Estate
Doctors/leisure centre
Up through town
New supermarket on quarry housing estate.

Bolehill could be the turnaround before the new estate is built.

I know that it wouldn’t be a moneymaker , and that it’s just my imagination getting away with me, but the town has an ageing population, and the amount of non profitable routes locally supported by the council, why shouldn’t this be one of them?

I suppose Matlock is similar, but with a higher population. 12000 compared to 5000.

There are town services in Matlock (0800-1800) providing links to hillside housing, the town centre, doctors/dentists and the big Sainsbury’s supermarket near the rail station, but this limited Stagecoach network is subsidised by the County Council and would imagine costs far outweigh revenue.

The X17 also carries significant local passengers up the hill in Matlock.

Could some of the existing buses in Wirksworth be routed to provide better penetration for the new housing/supermarket? May need funding though?

Otherwise I suppose residents of Wirksworth can use the existing bus network to go shopping in Ashbourne, Belper, Derby, Matlock, Chesterfield, Sheffield, Meadowhall and even Barnsley without changing buses all for just £2!

Last bus back from Derby 2315 - not bad for a small town in a rural location!

 

[m79900]

To be clear, most roads and areas mentioned are ones that used to have regular services but don’t anymore.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 19 Feb 2024 ==

I suppose Matlock is similar, but with a higher population. 12000 compared to 5000.

There are town services in Matlock (0800-1800) providing links to hillside housing, the town centre, doctors/dentists and the big Sainsbury’s supermarket near the rail station, but this limited Stagecoach network is subsidised by the County Council and would imagine costs far outweigh revenue.

The X17 also carries significant local passengers up the hill in Matlock.

Could some of the existing buses in Wirksworth be routed to provide better penetration for the new housing/supermarket? May need funding though?

Otherwise I suppose residents of Wirksworth can use the existing bus network to go shopping in Ashbourne, Belper, Derby, Matlock, Chesterfield, Sheffield, Meadowhall and even Barnsley without changing buses all for just £2!

Last bus back from Derby 2315 - not bad for a small town in a rural location!

I agree that we have excellent links to neighbouring towns and villages, but all these services just serve the few main roads through town and don’t run round the houses.

 

[Trainman40083]

I suppose Matlock is similar, but with a higher population. 12000 compared to 5000.

There are town services in Matlock (0800-1800) providing links to hillside housing, the town centre, doctors/dentists and the big Sainsbury’s supermarket near the rail station, but this limited Stagecoach network is subsidised by the County Council and would imagine costs far outweigh revenue.

The X17 also carries significant local passengers up the hill in Matlock.

Could some of the existing buses in Wirksworth be routed to provide better penetration for the new housing/supermarket? May need funding though?

Otherwise I suppose residents of Wirksworth can use the existing bus network to go shopping in Ashbourne, Belper, Derby, Matlock, Chesterfield, Sheffield, Meadowhall and even Barnsley without changing buses all for just £2!

Last bus back from Derby 2315 - not bad for a small town in a rural location!

Maybe Hulleys is a better option, if it could be worked in with the 110/111

 

[ChrisC]

I agree that we have excellent links to neighbouring towns and villages, but all these services just serve the few main roads through town and don’t run round the houses.

Would anyone actually use the buses if they did run round the houses? I’m mainly thinking about the large new housing estates which are expected to be built, that you mentioned in your original post. It will very much depend upon the type of houses to be built and the people who come to live there.

My experience from neighbouring Nottinghamshire is that when large housing estates are built well away from large city centres, on the edge of smaller towns, very few people use any buses which run close by. When estates of large 3 and 4 bedroom houses are built in desirable locations, as I believe Wirksworth is, the people moving into them are often couples or families with more than one car. Living near a bus route and using the buses can be a complete irrelevance to them. There are a number of estates like this which have been built along my local bus route, but the buses only very rarely stop at the bus stops near these estates.

 

[Trainman40083]

Would anyone actually use the buses if they did run round the houses? I’m mainly thinking about the large new housing estates which are expected to be built, that you mentioned in your original post. It will very much depend upon the type of houses to be built and the people who come to live there.

My experience from neighbouring Nottinghamshire is that when large housing estates are built well away from large city centres, on the edge of smaller towns, very few people use any buses which run close by. When estates of large 3 and 4 bedroom houses are built in desirable locations, as I believe Wirksworth is, the people moving into them are often couples or families with more than one car. Living near a bus route and using the buses can be a complete irrelevance to them. There are a number of estates like this which have been built along my local bus route, but the buses only very rarely stop at the bus stops near these estates.

Add in, in order to cram houses in, there is often inadequate parking off road, narrow estate roads, meaning a bus cannot access. The way we seem to be going is expect bus passengers to walk 1/2 mile to catch a bus.. But that all said, it does make you wonder if people still "normally" go to the location the bus goes

 

[ChrisC]

Add in, in order to cram houses in, there is often inadequate parking off road, narrow estate roads, meaning a bus cannot access. The way we seem to be going is expect bus passengers to walk 1/2 mile to catch a bus.. But that all said, it does make you wonder if people still "normally" go to the location the bus goes

There was a time, before car ownership became so widespread, when people thought nothing of walking half a mile to a bus stop. Outside of large cities, if there was a bus stop within half a mile of your house it was considered to be very convenient. Now people expect buses to leave the main roads and run through every housing estate, industrial estate and retail park. Few people are prepared to walk to a bus stop on the main road these days, and end to end bus journeys are becoming less attractive and very tedious because of the time taken to run round all these diversions from the original route.

 

[greenline712]

I will freely admit that I've only been to Wirksworth once, when I was connecting bus>train and the train was cancelled, so I had an hour to kill.
Wirksworth is a pleasant little town, but with few reasons to travel there . . . no big shop / supermarket; just several local shops.

When contemplating the start of a new bus route, you MUST ask why passengers might want to travel . . . shopping / commuting / schools . . . ideally ALL should be present. If only some are present, then the route will need subsidy. If none are available, then the route will not succeed. Wirksworth just doesn't seem to have any "passenger objectives".

I see that there is already 2 BPH on Route 6.1; 1 BPH on Route X17 and occasional buses on Routes 110/111 . . . that seems quite generous to me. It might be possible to run a service via Yokecliffe Drive, but there is a careful break in the road layout that prevents through traffic!

I'm happy to be contradicted, but I'm sorry . . . a town bus in Wirksworth is very unlikely to succeed, and any subsidy available from S.106 should be carefully directed to other objectives.

 

[m79900]

I will freely admit that I've only been to Wirksworth once, when I was connecting bus>train and the train was cancelled, so I had an hour to kill.
Wirksworth is a pleasant little town, but with few reasons to travel there . . . no big shop / supermarket; just several local shops.

When contemplating the start of a new bus route, you MUST ask why passengers might want to travel . . . shopping / commuting / schools . . . ideally ALL should be present. If only some are present, then the route will need subsidy. If none are available, then the route will not succeed. Wirksworth just doesn't seem to have any "passenger objectives".

I see that there is already 2 BPH on Route 6.1; 1 BPH on Route X17 and occasional buses on Routes 110/111 . . . that seems quite generous to me. It might be possible to run a service via Yokecliffe Drive, but there is a careful break in the road layout that prevents through traffic!

I'm happy to be contradicted, but I'm sorry . . . a town bus in Wirksworth is very unlikely to succeed, and any subsidy available from S.106 should be carefully directed to other objectives.

I assume you are talking about that hedge between the ends of Summer Drive and Yokecliffe Drive. I’ve very often wondered why it isn’t just removed and made into a through road.

It wouldn’t be so annoying if we’d never had buses round the houses, but we did. Until fairly recently, the doctors, leisure centre, gorseybank, Bournebrook Estate, and Millers Green were all served, but have been removed in phases.

On the reasons to travel, there are lots of (but still not enough) jobs in Wirksworth.
One secondary and two primary schools, with another expected to open when the houses are built.
On shopping, there is a large Coop store, not on the level of a supermarket, but it has an in house bakery and conveyor belts and provides everything you could need, as well as the local shops. And again, a supermarket is expected to open with the new houses.

I’m well aware that it woudn’t be profitable, but not many routes in the area are, and I’m sure It’d be better used than say, the 111 or 158.