Single justice procedure notice HELP!!!

[Mojo]

ITAL appears to be a transport software solutions company. But as the address given doesn't appear to relate to the very similar TIL, the OP is advised to take the address at face value and write to Mr Leather there.

Ital have been in this line of work for well over a decade now, either directly, or through one of their trading names such as Ircas or AS Appeals Service. Reading threads on this forum where posters have provided applicable paperwork it seems that Ital have been handling cases for CrossCountry for at least 18 months now.

 

[c00pz]

OK - thanks for sharing more info.

TIL are Transport Investigations Ltd (they act on revenue protection for some train companies including Cross Country (XC)
But sometimes Cross Country deal with it directly - so I think you need to contact both of them in the same manner unless you know it is TIL who have sent this to court on behalf of XC

You have some time before it gets to court

People will advise you here and correct me but what I think you need to do now, ASAP, and you need to do this in writing is write the same letter or e-mail to TIL and XC with your name and address and any ref numbers from the court papers and

You need to say along these lines:

- You have received court papers (enclose copies if you can)
- This was the first you had heard about the case, but you believe it may possibly relate to an HM Forces Railcard that you were asked for on a journey on X date between Leeds and Elgin
- You understand that you would usually be written to and asked for you (as the passenger's) version of events but you never received any such letter
- That you are anxious to co-operate with them and also anxious to avoid the matter being dealt with at court if this is at all possible
- Ask them if you can have a copy of anything they previously sent to you so as to have the opportunity to respond to that as quickly as possible


If you want people to help check your letter or e-mail then draft it up here without the ref numbers / your name etc

Is it possible that as a serving forces person you have moved address since the incident and the post they sent you before may not have got to you - make sure they have a reliable address for you now that they can write to you at (did the court papers have the correct address?)

EDIT - just seen @Fawkes Cat post above which I think is clearer suggestion on way forward / content then mine above so go with that - tho I think we are basically suggesting same next course of action.

I have just phones TIL and they have informed me that they do not deal with cross country anymore . It is IRCAS that look after cross country but they do not have a telephone number it is online or written means.

So i think will take your advice as well as fawkes cat and write to the gentleman heading the investigation

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 24 Nov 2023 ==

I rang the TIL and they dont deal with cross country trains anymore it is the IRCAS. However there is no phone number but there is an online enquiry form. I am currently drafting up a letter which i will send to mr leather who works for the IRCAS and will send 1st class recorded but will also send an enquiry via the website too.

Just wanted to say a massive thanks to everyone commenting on this feed youve been a massive help in this matter

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 24 Nov 2023 ==

Looking at the paperwork you've been sent, the 'Frequently asked questions' sheet says


And the Charge Sheet tells you that the Charge was authorised by


(N.B. above quotes manually typed by me, so any errors down to me!)

It seems to me that you may have 'exceptional mitigating circumstances' in that for whatever reason you never got the letter asking for your side of the story. I'll come on to the errors in the charge and witness statement in a moment or two.

I suggest that you write to Mr Leather,
- explaining that you believe that you have exceptional mitigating circumstances
- this is because you never received a letter asking for your side of the story
- had you had that letter, you would have explained that you had lost one part of your railcard (n.b. that's what I understand you to say - obviously only say what's true)
- you are very sorry for your mistake
- to make sure it doesn't happen again, you have now got a new, fully intact railcard
- you would like if possible to settle this matter out of court by payment of the train fare and the costs that the railway has incurred (n.b. the train fare will be the full train fare, and the costs will be a couple of hundred pounds or so: this is not cheap but it's cheaper than what you may be fined in court)
- you would also draw the railway's attention to a number of errors in the charge sheet and witness statement, most particularly that they appear to refer to a different day from the incident involving you. If the matter proceeds to court, you will have to mention these errors to the magistrates as you will need to do what you can to defend yourself.

Time is short, so make sure you send this letter first class, and also arrange for it to be signed for so that you can be certain that it has got to CrossCountry. I'd also suggest (since you seem to be in the forces) that you mention this matter to your commander/manager/whatever. I suspect that the forces have on occasion dealt with much more serious offences - but it's probably better that they find out from you rather than from getting a letter from the court!

Currently drafting a letter and i have also brought to the attention of my chain on command too

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 24 Nov 2023 ==

OK - thanks for sharing more info.

TIL are Transport Investigations Ltd (they act on revenue protection for some train companies including Cross Country (XC)
But sometimes Cross Country deal with it directly - so I think you need to contact both of them in the same manner unless you know it is TIL who have sent this to court on behalf of XC

You have some time before it gets to court

People will advise you here and correct me but what I think you need to do now, ASAP, and you need to do this in writing is write the same letter or e-mail to TIL and XC with your name and address and any ref numbers from the court papers and

You need to say along these lines:

- You have received court papers (enclose copies if you can)
- This was the first you had heard about the case, but you believe it may possibly relate to an HM Forces Railcard that you were asked for on a journey on X date between Leeds and Elgin
- You understand that you would usually be written to and asked for you (as the passenger's) version of events but you never received any such letter
- That you are anxious to co-operate with them and also anxious to avoid the matter being dealt with at court if this is at all possible
- Ask them if you can have a copy of anything they previously sent to you so as to have the opportunity to respond to that as quickly as possible


If you want people to help check your letter or e-mail then draft it up here without the ref numbers / your name etc

Is it possible that as a serving forces person you have moved address since the incident and the post they sent you before may not have got to you - make sure they have a reliable address for you now that they can write to you at (did the court papers have the correct address?)

EDIT - just seen @Fawkes Cat post above which I think is clearer suggestion on way forward / content then mine above so go with that - tho I think we are basically suggesting same next course of action.

On 23 November 2023 I received a Single Justice Procedure Notice reference number as above.
The charge is that I boarded a train without having a valid ticket entitling me to travel.
This is the first notification I have received despite the charge sheet stating that "a letter was issued giving opportunity to dispute the incident or settle the matter prior to legal proceedings" nor does it detail the date the letter was issued. I can categorically state I did not receive the letter as, had I received it I would have put my case forward detailing the inaccuracies of the charge as follows;

The Statement of Fact detailed in the Single Justice Procedure Notice is wholly incorrect in that it states the date of travel as Tuesday 1st August 2023. I actually travelled on the Leeds/Elgin train on Monday 31st July 2023. On Tuesday 1st August I was actually at work with my unit which can be confirmed by my Unit Leader.

The Statement of Fact details that I was travelling without a valid ticket. The date I was travelling on Monday 31st July on Leeds/Elgin train, I had purchased a ticket online on Monday 31st July and obtained relevant discount using my HM Forces Railcard. Proof of ticket purchased is as per photo download attached and to note the date of travel is confirmed as Monday 31st July.

The Witness Statement is also incorrect in that it refers to the date of travel as Tuesday 1st August when I actually travelled on the Leeds/Elgin train on Monday 31st July and was actually at work as previously stated on 1st August.

The Ticket Inspector on the Leeds/Elgin train on Monday 31st July did ask to see my ticket which I presented to her via my phone - it having been purchased online - which she scanned. I was then asked if I had a Railcard and I duly presented my HM Forces Railcard which she took a photo of. I was then asked if I had any ID and I presented my MOD 90 identity card from which she wrote my address. She handed back my ID card and continued to check other passenger tickets. At no point was there a conversation questioning the validity of my ticket or rail card and I wholly dispute the Statement "we discussed that it was your intention to avoid paying the correct fare for your rail journey today " because we did not have that conversation as I had a valid ticket.

I would also point out that the Date of Birth on the Single Justice Procedure Notice is incorrect at 24/4/1997, it is actually (correct date of birth).

In summary and based on all the above, it is clear that the Statement of Fact and Witness Statement are wholly inaccurate and any charges based on those inaccuracies are wholly incorrect and would not withstand any scrutiny in court.
I therefore ask that you withdraw all charges and cease progression of this case to save needless time and costs to both parties.
I look forward to your prompt response.

 

[John R]

It looks a very well written letter, except maybe it labours the point about the date discrepancy with too many mentions of it.

However, it reads as though you had all the correct documentation, but earlier you said "However i had lost one of the parts to the railcard", so I wonder could you clarify that point to ensure it is consistent with their rationale for pursuing you.

 

[spag23]

Perhaps the OP could "politely suggest" that the inspector seems to have muddled up two entirely different encounters, from different days. Suggesting their staff need re-training might however be a step too far (till later!).

 

[Mcr Warrior]

I'm reading it as no photocard. One other thing. If this was a HM Forces Railcard being used, is travelling from home to place of duty, or work, actually permitted? OP reports travelling on 31st July and then being at work (in the Elgin area?) on 1st August.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

In summary and based on all the above, it is clear that the Statement of Fact and Witness Statement are wholly inaccurate and any charges based on those inaccuracies are wholly incorrect and would not withstand any scrutiny in court.
I therefore ask that you withdraw all charges and cease progression of this case to save needless time and costs to both parties.

It is of course your choice how you negotiate this, but you're asking them to abandon all action. My feeling is that you may have a better chance of reaching agreement if you are prepared to make an out of court settlement. That would be far more expensive for you than getting them to withdraw completely - but you might feel that the extra cost is worth it to avoid prosecution.

 

[WesternLancer]

In summary and based on all the above, it is clear that the Statement of Fact and Witness Statement are wholly inaccurate and any charges based on those inaccuracies are wholly incorrect and would not withstand any scrutiny in court.
I therefore ask that you withdraw all charges and cease progression of this case to save needless time and costs to both parties.
I look forward to your prompt response.

Thanks for posting your draft - I'd be tempted to 'soften' the end bit unless you are 100% sure of this and know that they could not (at least in theory) successfully bring a case against you for something related to the ticket or railcard - eg perhaps you could change it to:

In summary and based on all the above, I do not believe the it is clear that the Statement of Fact and Witness Statement are wholly in accurate and any charges based on those inaccuracies are wholly incorrect and would not withstand any scrutiny in court.
I therefore ask that you withdraw all charges and cease progression of this case whilst the points above can be considered in the hope that this saves time and costs to both parties to save needless time and costs to both parties.
I look forward to your prompt response.

Edit - again I see I've cross posted with @Fawkes Cat but think my post is along similar lines

 

[skyhigh]

Was your Railcard in date?

 

[Cantab26]

I have just phones TIL and they have informed me that they do not deal with cross country anymore . It is IRCAS that look after cross country but they do not have a telephone number it is online or written means.

So i think will take your advice as well as fawkes cat and write to the gentleman heading the investigation

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 24 Nov 2023 ==

I rang the TIL and they dont deal with cross country trains anymore it is the IRCAS. However there is no phone number but there is an online enquiry form. I am currently drafting up a letter which i will send to mr leather who works for the IRCAS and will send 1st class recorded but will also send an enquiry via the website too.

Just wanted to say a massive thanks to everyone commenting on this feed youve been a massive help in this matter

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 24 Nov 2023 ==


Currently drafting a letter and i have also brought to the attention of my chain on command too

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 24 Nov 2023 ==


On 23 November 2023 I received a Single Justice Procedure Notice reference number as above.
The charge is that I boarded a train without having a valid ticket entitling me to travel.
This is the first notification I have received despite the charge sheet stating that "a letter was issued giving opportunity to dispute the incident or settle the matter prior to legal proceedings" nor does it detail the date the letter was issued. I can categorically state I did not receive the letter as, had I received it I would have put my case forward detailing the inaccuracies of the charge as follows;

The Statement of Fact detailed in the Single Justice Procedure Notice is wholly incorrect in that it states the date of travel as Tuesday 1st August 2023. I actually travelled on the Leeds/Elgin train on Monday 31st July 2023. On Tuesday 1st August I was actually at work with my unit which can be confirmed by my Unit Leader.

The Statement of Fact details that I was travelling without a valid ticket. The date I was travelling on Monday 31st July on Leeds/Elgin train, I had purchased a ticket online on Monday 31st July and obtained relevant discount using my HM Forces Railcard. Proof of ticket purchased is as per photo download attached and to note the date of travel is confirmed as Monday 31st July.

The Witness Statement is also incorrect in that it refers to the date of travel as Tuesday 1st August when I actually travelled on the Leeds/Elgin train on Monday 31st July and was actually at work as previously stated on 1st August.

The Ticket Inspector on the Leeds/Elgin train on Monday 31st July did ask to see my ticket which I presented to her via my phone - it having been purchased online - which she scanned. I was then asked if I had a Railcard and I duly presented my HM Forces Railcard which she took a photo of. I was then asked if I had any ID and I presented my MOD 90 identity card from which she wrote my address. She handed back my ID card and continued to check other passenger tickets. At no point was there a conversation questioning the validity of my ticket or rail card and I wholly dispute the Statement "we discussed that it was your intention to avoid paying the correct fare for your rail journey today " because we did not have that conversation as I had a valid ticket.

I would also point out that the Date of Birth on the Single Justice Procedure Notice is incorrect at 24/4/1997, it is actually (correct date of birth).

In summary and based on all the above, it is clear that the Statement of Fact and Witness Statement are wholly inaccurate and any charges based on those inaccuracies are wholly incorrect and would not withstand any scrutiny in court.
I therefore ask that you withdraw all charges and cease progression of this case to save needless time and costs to both parties.
I look forward to your prompt response.

I am not able to assist you directly, but you appear to have available to you a special defence of alibi.

If you wish to avail of it you should consult with a qualified solicitor immediately before you send your proposed incriminating letter to the prosecutor.

 

[c00pz]

Thanks for posting your draft - I'd be tempted to 'soften' the end bit unless you are 100% sure of this and know that they could not (at least in theory) successfully bring a case against you for something related to the ticket or railcard - eg perhaps you could change it to:



Edit - again I see I've cross posted with @Fawkes Cat but think my post is along similar lines

Yeah ive changed the ending to what you suggested much appreciated

 

[swt_passenger]

I'm reading it as no photocard. One other thing. If this was a HM Forces Railcard being used, is travelling from home to place of duty, or work, actually permitted? OP reports travelling on 31st July and then being at work (in the Elgin area?) on 1st August.

I think there’s a difference between daily commuting, (eg from a married quarter to base (home to duty) for which other travel expenses are paid), and travel to a distant family home for weekend or longer leave periods. The latter isn’t considered commuting, despite people trying to hijack the word ‘commuter’ for any travel. I think this came up in a thread a few years ago, but I haven’t searched for it.

 

[30907]

If this is a case of "no railcard/missing photocard," then surely the provision to produce the railcard at a later date could apply , and the OP could point this out?
(provided of course that they were travelling on a valid train for their ticket.)

 

[c00pz]

I am not able to assist you directly, but you appear to have available to you a special defence of alibi.

If you wish to avail of it you should consult with a qualified solicitor immediately before you send your proposed incriminating letter to the prosecutor.

Is there specialist solicitors for matter like this ?

 

[skyhigh]

If this is a case of "no railcard/missing photocard," then surely the provision to produce the railcard at a later date could apply , and the OP could point this out?
(provided of course that they were travelling on a valid train for their ticket.)

It might have been missed by the OP but it's been asked several times if the Railcard was actually in date during the journey, and all that's been said is that it has been renewed.

They also said they had lost part of the Railcard. I'm guessing they could only show the photocard half rather than the dated portion which is why I'm wondering if the Railcard had expired.

 

[furlong]

The allegation relates to an interview that took place on a train at 12.45pm on 1st August. I think whatever happened on 31st July is simply of no consequence at this stage of proceedings. If the OP has one of more witnesses able and willing to provide truthful statements that prove he was elsewhere at that time, surely that's all that's required for now? Speculation about other things that might have happened on different days might be interesting, but that isn't the matter being presented to the court for which a formal response is required. Seek legal advice.

 

[Cantab26]

Is there specialist solicitors for matter like this ?

Any high street solicitor who does criminal defence work should be able to deal with this.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 24 Nov 2023 ==

The allegation relates to an interview that took place on a train at 12.45pm on 1st August. I think whatever happened on 31st July is simply of no consequence at this stage of proceedings. If the OP has one of more witnesses able and willing to provide truthful statements that prove he was elsewhere at that time, surely that's all that's required for now? Speculation about other things that might have happened on different days might be interesting, but that isn't the matter being presented to the court for which a formal response is required. Seek legal advice.

Exactly right.