Delay Repay Claim going in circles

[SockedBishop]

Hi,

On the 5th June I travelled from Swansea to Whitehaven, I ended up getting delayed and reached my final destination 2 hours late (can't remember the exact amount).

My routing:

[GWR] Swansea 12:23 -- Newport
[TfW] Newport 13:37 -- Chester
[Northern] Chester 16:29 -- Warrington BQ
[Avanti] Warrington BQ 17:15 -- Carlisle
[Northern] Carlisle 19:09 -- Whitehaven

My tickets (all advance singles) Swansea -- Chester; Chester -- Warrington BQ; Warrington BQ -- Whitehaven

I submitted my initial delay repay claim to Avanti on 6th June, who said, on 9th June, that the delay was caused by TfW. TfW replied on 6th July saying the initial delay was caused by GWR. GWR then replied on 28th July saying the delay was caused by TfW.

Could anyone possibly advise what I could do as my claim is taking ages and seems to be going round in circles?

Trying to remember more details but it was a fair while ago, so my memory is a little faded.

Thank you!

 

[Fawkes Cat]

Welcome to the forum!

Can you remember which trains were delayed and by how much? Because one of the issues is which train company should be responsible for paying Delay Repay

 

[SockedBishop]

Welcome to the forum!

Can you remember which trains were delayed and by how much? Because one of the issues is which train company should be responsible for paying Delay Repay

Thanks for the welcome!

The GWR left Swansea late (issue with the doors), it managed to overtake the TfW train at Cardiff and as the TfW train was also running late I was able to catch it at Newport.

As the TfW was running late I missed the 16:29 [Northern] service at Chester. Sorry I can't remember the time of the trains I took after Chester.

The Avanti I ended up catching at Warrington BQ was also running late and I think that when getting into Preston it had to wait there for 40 minutes for a driver to rest so I ended up running across the platform to catch another delayed Avanti service which was then held up for quite some time near Penrith due to a broken down freight train ahead.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

The GWR left Swansea late (issue with the doors), it managed to overtake the TfW train at Cardiff and as the TfW train was also running late I was able to catch it at Newport.

As the TfW was running late I missed the 16:29 [Northern] service at Chester. Sorry I can't remember the time of the trains I took after Chester.

As I understand it, Delay Repay is the responsibility of the first train company to materially delay you. Most of the time it's obvious who that is (it will be the operator of the first leg of the journey that suffers a delay) but this is a bit more complicated.

GWR were delayed, so most of the time they would be the people to claim from. But TfW were also running late and it was (it seems to me) their delay which caused you to be late at your final destination.

So I think your claim should be dealt with by TfW. But there may be others here who know better.

 

[SockedBishop]

I appealed to TfW saying that even though the GWR service was delayed the TfW service was also delayed therefore I was able to catch it, therefore it was a TfW service that caused me to arrive late to my destination.

Today TfW have rejected my appeal saying:
"We have been unable to approve your claim as the train that delayed your journey was not one of ours. The train was operated by Great Western Railway."

They have passed my claim onto GWR again. Just seems to be bouncing between GWR and TfW. Any ideas how I would resolve this please?

 

[Watershed]

I appealed to TfW saying that even though the GWR service was delayed the TfW service was also delayed therefore I was able to catch it, therefore it was a TfW service that caused me to arrive late to my destination.

Today TfW have rejected my appeal saying:
"We have been unable to approve your claim as the train that delayed your journey was not one of ours. The train was operated by Great Western Railway."

They have passed my claim onto GWR again. Just seems to be bouncing between GWR and TfW. Any ideas how I would resolve this please?

Once it’s been more than 8 weeks from when you brought a complaint to either operator, you can take the matter to the Rail Ombudsman. They are usually useless but if you tell them you have an issue where you’re being sent from pillar to post between TOCs, they might be able to help.

 

[Southern Beau]

I appealed to TfW saying that even though the GWR service was delayed the TfW service was also delayed therefore I was able to catch it, therefore it was a TfW service that caused me to arrive late to my destination.

Today TfW have rejected my appeal saying:
"We have been unable to approve your claim as the train that delayed your journey was not one of ours. The train was operated by Great Western Railway."

They have passed my claim onto GWR again. Just seems to be bouncing between GWR and TfW. Any ideas how I would resolve this please?

i had a similar issue with greater Anglia and Avanti.
After 3 complete circles of being passed between the two TOC’s taking 6 weeks or so, I sent both the same email with each others email address cc’ed.
Told them to discuss amongst themselves and come back to me within 7 days with the correct compensation.
Failure to do so would result in me invoicing them £80 each time I had to contact them.
Surprisingly I received an email from one company within 2 days apologising and paying, and then 4 days later another email apologising for the inconvenience (and sending a cheque - not deposited for those who will accuse me of gaining from the railways!)
Payment was made but neither company seemed to be able to communicate with each other!

 

[Papyrus]

i had a similar issue with greater Anglia and Avanti.
After 3 complete circles of being passed between the two TOC’s taking 6 weeks or so, I sent both the same email with each others email address cc’ed.
Told them to discuss amongst themselves and come back to me within 7 days with the correct compensation.
Failure to do so would result in me invoicing them £80 each time I had to contact them.
Surprisingly I received an email from one company within 2 days apologising and paying, and then 4 days later another email apologising for the inconvenience (and sending a cheque - not deposited for those who will accuse me of gaining from the railways!)
Payment was made but neither company seemed to be able to communicate with each other!

Great shout. Call it an ‘administration fee’. Taste of their own medicine!

 

[SockedBishop]

Thought I'd post an update as it has all been resolved now

Phoned TfW and told them my situation. They arranged a call back from someone from head office.

The guy from head office said how delay repay has always worked is the TOC that causes the first delay should be responsible for paying compensation so in this case GWR, however First Group have been rejecting and passing the claims onto other TOCs.

Anyway TfW were very helpful and paid me the compensation.

Thanks for all your replies!

 

[SuspectUsual]

The guy from head office said how delay repay has always worked is the TOC that causes the first delay should be responsible for paying compensation

The problem is that at face value that just isn't true. Its the first TOC that causes a material delay (eg arriving 5 minutes late for a 20 minute connection is late, but not a material delay as your onward journey could continue on time)

But your experience is another example of why a single, centralised delay repay process would be better for customers

 

[ainsworth74]

The guy from head office said how delay repay has always worked is the TOC that causes the first delay should be responsible for paying compensation so in this case GWR, however First Group have been rejecting and passing the claims onto other TOCs.

Not sure I actually agree that its the first TOC that causes a delay as it should be the first TOC that materially delays you! If you had two trains say Swansea to Cardiff and then Cardiff to Bristol. Say the Swansea to Cardiff train was ten minutes late but you made the connection because you had twenty minutes between trains but then the Cardiff to Bristol train is delayed by an hour you would claim delay repay from the operator of the Cardiff to Bristol train as it was they that actually made you materially late. Until then your journey had been proceeding according to the itinerary! However...

Anyway TfW were very helpful and paid me the compensation.

...seeing as they've paid up anyway never mind!