Great Northern peak fares inconsistency.

[notverydeep]

Earlier today, I took 2C17 0826 Cambridge to King's Cross from Welwyn Garden City (at 09:21). I witnessed an argument between a passenger and the staff member at the gate line. The person had an £14.30 Off Peak Day Return to Finsbury Park and was arguing with the staff member about the validity of this ticket, which had been rejected by the ticket gates. In the years that I have been commuting from WGC, this train has always been a peak train and that was the view of the staff member. The passenger indicated that the ticket had been stamped by the booking office and argued that the online ticket sales showed that the ticket was valid.

Onboard, I checked the GN website and it supported the passengers rather than the member of staff, with off peak tickets available (for tomorrow) on both that train and the earlier 9Y19 0902 Welwyn Garden City to Sevenoaks. At first I presumed this was an easement due to the overtime ban that is in place this week, but the same fares are available next week also. In the past I have observed Finsbury Park fares restrictions were consistent with those at King's Cross or St. Pancras, but checking the GN website shows only £21.10 Anytime Day Returns prior to the 09:51 from Welwyn Garden City (2C19 0856 Cambridge to King's Cross).

Can anyone shed any light as to why the off peak morning restrictions differ at Finsbury Park and King's Cross on GN and when this changed or is it an error (hence the staff member not knowing and the gate rejecting the ticket)? It appears possible that passengers could save significantly with a combination of the £14.30 fare and the off peak contactless fares cap for onward travel in London, compared to a peak travelcard from Welwyn Garden City (£32.20) using either the 09:02 or 09:21 departures. Even the contactless London Underground fare to / from King's Cross saves £1.20 on the £21.10 peak fare...

 

[MrJeeves]

The ticket from Welwyn Garden City to Finsbury Park is valid from 0900, so the passenger is perfectly entitled to use it on those services in question.

If I was them, a strongly worded email to GTR would be at the forefront of my mind.

Outward Travel & Return Travel​
RESTRICTIONS
Restriction Code: B3 Restricted Days: Monday to Friday Mondays-Fridays ​
Not valid on trains timed to depart after 04:29 and before 09:00.

 

[CyrusWuff]

Looking on BRFares, restriction code B3 applies to Off-Peak Day Return tickets between Welwyn Garden City and stations as far into London as Zone 2 (so Finsbury Park on the main line, and Essex Road on the Northern City Line), but it's code C4 for London Terminals. As such, the passenger was correct.

B3 is as posted by MrJeeves and C4 is the classic "Not valid on trains timed to arrive at, or depart from, any London Terminal, Farringdon or Kensington Olympia between 0430 and 0959."

 

[Gaelan]

In the years that I have been commuting from WGC, this train has always been a peak train

There's no such thing as a peak train, per se: time restrictions are per-ticket, so a train can be peak for some tickets and off-peak for others.

 

[swt_passenger]

There's no such thing as a peak train, per se: time restrictions are per-ticket, so a train can be peak for some tickets and off-peak for others.

Time and time again it seems some railway staff just cannot, or will not, understand that simple point.

 

[notverydeep]

There's no such thing as a peak train, per se: time restrictions are per-ticket, so a train can be peak for some tickets and off-peak for others.

Yes, sorry I appreciate that (for example, varying levels of Off Peak period tickets from Welwyn Garden City to (say) Bristol Temple Meads are available throughout the conventional morning peak times), but I am interested to know in the rationale for Finsbury Park being treated differently from the two adjacent London termini for otherwise the same ticket type - where in the past they have been consistent - plus whether this was a recent change, after all the GN 'revenue' staff member present shared my previous understanding and the gates apparently programmed to reject such a ticket at that time...

 

[CyrusWuff]

Having done some digging, the restriction change came into effect in September 2018 following the disaster that was the May 2018 timetable launch.

There doesn't appear to have been any great fanfare about the change though.

 

[notverydeep]

Having done some digging, the restriction change came into effect in September 2018 following the disaster that was the May 2018 timetable launch.

There doesn't appear to have been any great fanfare about the change though.

Thanks for your clarification, my understanding (like the member of staff) is a bit out of date! I wonder why it changed...

Thanks also to @MrJeeves for the restriction details. The passenger can feel rightly aggrieved!

 

[Hadders]

I suspect the member of staff was getting confused with the contactless off peak restriction which is 09:30.

That said, staff at Welwyn Garden City do have a habit of making up their own rules. I was once refused sale of a Gold Card discounted ticket at 09:30 because they told me a Gold Card discount cannot be used until 10:00.

 

[mangyiscute]

If I was them, a strongly worded email to GTR would be at the forefront of my mind.

I'd be worried all the email will do is get a "we are sorry" generic response back, followed by magically in a weeks time, the restriction codes have been updated to all restrict travel until the later trains.