Train services with a lot of slack in the timetable

[387star]

The 06:00 weekday Portsmouth Harbour to Cardiff Central has ten minutes at Westbury and Bristol Temple Meads. The train used to attach and divide at these locations but this is no longer the case
Any other passenger services with a ridiculously long dwell time?

(Of note is the 06:00 1F06 bizarrely omits Avoncliff whilst stopping everywhere else between Warminster and Bristol)

 

[sp503]

The Didcot to Paddington service has a rather long dwell time at Reading, particularly London-bound. For instance, the one arriving Reading at 1058 does not leave until 1112.

 

[The exile]

The 06:00 weekday Portsmouth Harbour to Cardiff Central has ten minutes at Westbury and Bristol Temple Meads. The train used to attach and divide at these locations but this is no longer the case
Any other passenger services with a ridiculously long dwell time?

(Of note is the 06:00 1F06 bizarrely omits Avoncliff whilst stopping everywhere else between Warminster and Bristol)

Assuming the train a) is booked turbo and b) was strengthened between Westbury and Bristol- that’s probably why the “local door only” Avoncliff is omitted. I doubt local door and non-inter-unit gangways are considered compatible.

 

[RailWonderer]

All the 15-20 minute waits at Northampton on Brum semi fasts and pretty much anything on the GEML. The Glasgow and Edinburgh /Inverness and Aberdeens have a lot of padding as well, which even by adding a few more stops in they would trim down 2-3 mins. All over the network there is padding. Some planners think it increases reliability and resilience which it does, but it also lengthens journey times unnecessaily at times. Removing a couple of minutes here and there but not overdoing it would do wonders over the course of a longer route (90 mins or more) and could be marketed well also.

 

[Taunton]

Every station stop on the London Overground (with SWR coming a close second).

In truth, "targets" for the DfT on punctuality have much to do with the progressive slackness that has developed in UK railways. There are plenty of services which have new trains with twice the power of their predecessors, various infrastructure improvements, etc, and yet timings notably slacker than they were a generation ago, with the crew just standing whistling to themselves on the platform as they 'wait time'. Management attention is focused fully on reporting on time percentage statistics to the Department, along with climbing up Roger Ford's league tables of punctuality in Modern Railways and getting their grinning faces in the photos at the Golden Whistles. Actually getting the punters along the line in the most time-efficient and rapid manner be blowed ...

 

[1D54]

And probably an announcement from the train manager giving it large just prior to final destination about arriving x amount of minutes early on any of the above when anything else would be nigh on impossible.

 

[eastwestdivide]

According to Realtimetrains, today's 0606 Edinburgh-Plymouth has station stops of 4 mins or more at:
York (6)
Derby (4)
Birmingham NS (4)
Bristol TM (12)
Exeter St D (5)

plus engineering/pathing allowances en route of 25.5 mins

And it's still 19 late passing Dawlish as I write this.

 

[DelW]

Lots of Redhill (stopping) services on the North Downs sit for around ten pointless minutes at Guildford. The pause was put in to allow passengers to transfer to/from an overtaking Gatwick (faster) train which unfortunately never appeared in the timetable. Allegedly the timetable will eventually be modified to remove it, along with the slower timings introduced to suit the 769s which also never appeared.

 

[The Planner]

According to Realtimetrains, today's 0606 Edinburgh-Plymouth has station stops of 4 mins or more at:
York (6)
Derby (4)
Birmingham NS (4)
Bristol TM (12)
Exeter St D (5)

plus engineering/pathing allowances en route of 25.5 mins

And it's still 19 late passing Dawlish as I write this.

Regulated behind 2L55 at Cheltenham and followed the very late 1C10 to Worle Jn. Unless you want to start questioning regulation then it falls under "it happens"

 

[387star]

Assuming the train a) is booked turbo and b) was strengthened between Westbury and Bristol- that’s probably why the “local door only” Avoncliff is omitted. I doubt local door and non-inter-unit gangways are considered compatible.

The train stops at Dilton just fine...

Some trains have 15 minute dwells at Bristol

 

[London Trains]

Everything Southern operate via Hackbridge seems to have a lot of slack. The recently removed fast services to Dorking/Horsham were the worst for this, it was very common to sit at Carshalton or Sutton (before a Carshalton stop was added to the fast services) for 10 minutes because the service was so early, and they even had 3 extra stops at Mitcham Eastfields, Mitcham Jct and Hackbridge at peak times and still ran to the same times as off peak.

 

[splitfare]

The 2007 Transport for Wales service from Birmingham International to Aberystwyth arrives Shrewsbury at 2120 and departs at 2151 - one reason being waiting for connecting passengers on the 2142 arrival from Cardiff Central.

 

[12LDA28C]

There was a very recent thread on this same topic, found here:

TRIVIA: Longest dwell time in the middle of a continuous service

My train to Skegness from Nottingham this morning (2S91) has an 18 minute dwell time at Boston, between 0701 and 0719. What other examples exist where a train simply waits at a platform for an extended period of time before continuing? Mid journey reversals are related, but I would say are...

www.railforums.co.uk

 

[Mcr Warrior]

The 1429 (SuX) Manchester Airport to Windermere service (Northern) is booked to depart Lancaster at 1551, but doesn't get into Oxenholme until 1631.

A journey that could easily be done in under 20 minutes.

Reason, I believe, for it taking 40 minutes, is that it first has to wait just outside Oxenholme station for another service working in the opposite direction to come off the (single track) Windermere branch line.

 

[Starmill]

Assuming the train a) is booked turbo and b) was strengthened between Westbury and Bristol- that’s probably why the “local door only” Avoncliff is omitted. I doubt local door and non-inter-unit gangways are considered compatible.

It's absolutely undesirable - and in my view probably shouldn't be allowed. However, there are places where it does happen e.g. Bescar Lane.

 

[StephenHunter]

The Caledonian Sleeper ones I believe. Normal speed 85mph, but can run 100mph to make up time.

 

[PGAT]

The Bexleyheath line has alot of padding on the majority of their services

 

[hexagon789]

The Caledonian Sleeper ones I believe. Normal speed 85mph, but can run 100mph to make up time.

It can't anymore, 92s are 87 max. Normal running is 80mph.

 

[Parallel]

The 06:00 weekday Portsmouth Harbour to Cardiff Central has ten minutes at Westbury and Bristol Temple Meads. The train used to attach and divide at these locations but this is no longer the case
Any other passenger services with a ridiculously long dwell time?

(Of note is the 06:00 1F06 bizarrely omits Avoncliff whilst stopping everywhere else between Warminster and Bristol)

I used to catch the 0600 Portsmouth-Cardiff (0800 from Trowbridge) a few years ago and it had a terrible punctuality record - it hasn’t always had that dwell time at Westbury, even when they used to attach a 153 to the rear of a 3 car 158 which can’t have helped. Probably could run a bit earlier again now there is no attaching but it would clash with a London - Bristol IET at Bath these days. It probably doesn’t need to stop at Avoncliff because Avoncliff gets two trains an hour stopping in the morning peak towards Bath and Bristol, and is quieter than Freshford.

There are some Westbury - Gloucester services that have very long waits at Temple Meads. The 15:50 Westbury to Gloucester has a 22 minute wait at Temple Meads which will be rather off-putting for anyone who wants to go from Bath to Gloucester! Likewise some local trains at Dawlish Warren have long waits there.

Assuming the train a) is booked turbo and b) was strengthened between Westbury and Bristol- that’s probably why the “local door only” Avoncliff is omitted. I doubt local door and non-inter-unit gangways are considered compatible.

GWR have often stopped at short platforms with no gangways - It happens at Avoncliff, Thornford, Chetnole and Dilton Marsh but would’ve happened historically with St James’ Park, the Barnstaple line, Patchway (when 10 car IETs stop there during engineering works) and probably more.

For Avoncliff, the guard makes an announcement at the previous station advising passengers in the rear train to alight, walk down the platform and join the front unit.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It's absolutely undesirable - and in my view probably shouldn't be allowed. However, there are places where it does happen e.g. Bescar Lane.

I see the random unit generator is still in operation on that line, then - it's not like Northern don't have enough 150/2s, 156s and 158s to ensure that route only uses gangwayed units.

 

[DelW]

With the industrial action this week, the only off-peak Portsmouth trains via the Direct are hourly all-stations stoppers.

Yet they still sit and wait at Haslemere for about ten minutes, for a non-existent fast train to overtake them.

 

[The exile]

The train stops at Dilton just fine...

Some trains have 15 minute dwells at Bristol

Dillon Marsh being before Westbury., where the train is strengthened.

 

[43055]

With the industrial action this week, the only off-peak Portsmouth trains via the Direct are hourly all-stations stoppers.

Yet they still sit and wait at Haslemere for about ten minutes, for a non-existent fast train to overtake them.

Assuming that is becuase it is two trains basically stitched together so they run at the same times as normal either side of Haslemere.

 

[Lucy1501]

On Saturdays the 12:06 from Barrow to Carlisle stops at St Bees for 14 minutes (the usual being 2-5 minutes).

Whilst there are a few single lines in the area, including at St Bees, surely some more careful timetable planning could've reduced the wait without causing issues elsewhere!

 

[Mcr Warrior]

On Saturdays the 12:06 from Barrow to Carlisle stops at St Bees for 14 minutes (the usual being 2-5 minutes).

Whilst there are a few single lines in the area, including at St Bees, surely some more careful timetable planning could've reduced the wait without causing issues elsewhere!

Not ideal, but it obviously can't proceed (on the lengthy section of single track to Corkickle / Whitehaven) until the 1210 from Carlisle to Barrow-in-Furness has passed.

 

[BJames]

It is common for Sunday morning EMR intercity services to have around 10 minutes sitting at both Luton Airport Parkway and Bedford because of significant pathing allowances, even though they are only scheduled for a minute at each station. E.g.: Sheffield last Sun: https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:G69883/2023-07-16/detailed (12 minutes at Luton Airport Parkway, 16 at Bedford) or the prior week's 0900 Nottingham https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:G69784/2023-07-09#allox_id=0 (10 at LTN and 12 at BDM)

 

[Calum1]

1204 Glasgow Liverpool had about 15 minute wait at Preston. 3h42 end to end.
Be good if it could get a better path going south.
Everytime i travel south the journey always seems to be a bit of a drag between Glasgow and Carlisle but fine after that, northbound feels like no time at all
I'll be getting the 0812 back to Glasgow on Monday which is 3h19, used it a good few times and journey goes in quite nicely

 

[Watershed]

1204 Glasgow Liverpool had about 15 minute wait at Preston. 3h42 end to end.
Be good if it could get a better path going south.

Unfortunately it looks like it's a choice between that and simply crawling behind the preceding Northern stopper to Liverpool. I've heard some interesting stories about the rubbish paths on most of the the Glasgow-Liverpool services.

 

[Kite159]

It is common for Sunday morning EMR intercity services to have around 10 minutes sitting at both Luton Airport Parkway and Bedford because of significant pathing allowances, even though they are only scheduled for a minute at each station. E.g.: Sheffield last Sun: https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:G69883/2023-07-16/detailed (12 minutes at Luton Airport Parkway, 16 at Bedford) or the prior week's 0900 Nottingham https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:G69784/2023-07-09#allox_id=0 (10 at LTN and 12 at BDM)

I presume it's due to being timetabled for 2 track operation where the intercity services would follow a Thameslink service? Similar to Sunday mornings on Waterloo bound trains where the likes of 0727 Salisbury to London Waterloo can arrive at Clapham a few minutes early due to the timetable having the assumption of 2 tracks in operation (https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:L21709/2023-07-16/detailed#allox_id=0) [Some guards will dispatch when ready, others will wait until the actual departure time]

 

[Calum1]

Local networks at both Glasgow and Liverpool to work around which isn't helpful.
I remember when they first started there was 3 each way between the two and the lunchtime train heading south went via lea Green instead or st Helens