Greater Anglia Bombardier Aventras (Class 720): Technical discussion and introduction

[3973EXL]

47749 720132/133

Realtime Trains | 5Q72 1050 Derby Litchurch Lane to Wembley Inter City Depot | 16/06/2023

Real-time train running information for 5Q72 1050 departure from Derby Litchurch Lane to Wembley Inter City Depot on 16/06/2023. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 23 Jun 2023 ==

47727 720136

Realtime Trains | 5Q74 0850 Derby Litchurch Lane to Willesden T.M.D | 23/06/2023

Real-time train running information for 5Q74 0850 departure from Derby Litchurch Lane to Willesden T.M.D on 23/06/2023. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

 

[RunRepeat]

47749 720132/133

Realtime Trains | 5Q72 1050 Derby Litchurch Lane to Wembley Inter City Depot | 16/06/2023

Real-time train running information for 5Q72 1050 departure from Derby Litchurch Lane to Wembley Inter City Depot on 16/06/2023. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 23 Jun 2023 ==

47727

Realtime Trains | 5Q74 0850 Derby Litchurch Lane to Willesden T.M.D | 23/06/2023

Real-time train running information for 5Q74 0850 departure from Derby Litchurch Lane to Willesden T.M.D on 23/06/2023. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

This pair were heading towards Wembley on Weds late afternoon under their own power with 'Driver Training' signs on the doors.

 

[90sWereBetter]

Forgive me if this has already been asked, for allocation purposes are the 720s divided into WAML and GEML pools, where certain units will only do West Anglia routes, ditto Great Eastern routes, or is the fleet considered one homogenous whole where any unit could turn up anywhere?

 

[JonathanH]

The 720s are a common user fleet between the West Anglia and Great Eastern lines.

 

[Wivenswold]

Is there a number of 720s at Wembley waiting for transfer to Ilford? Haven't seen reports of new units in service lately.

 

[Alfie1014]

Almost certainly not booked but my home down Clacton train sometime last year was formed of an up Hertford service with the down return Hertford service formed off an up Southend Vic! Presumably a set swap for maintenance?

Obviously wouldn’t have happened with the previous stock as the fleet types were pretty much discrete except the odd 317 working on the GE side!

 

[47584Suffolk]

Is there a number of 720s at Wembley waiting for transfer to Ilford? Haven't seen reports of new units in service lately.

So far as I'm aware, only 720136 is at Wembley/Willesden for WCML shakedown runs.
720128 (which was at Willesden) moved to Ilford on 28/6 but only for unspecified repairs, not delivery as such. I believe it is still at IL but confirmation would be appreciated. This was its second visit for repairs.
720132 + 720133, which were moved from Derby to Wembley on 16/6, have both since been returned to Derby.

 

[Razor1967]

720136 parked at back of Willesden depot on Thursday evening.

 

[gdj]

720/130+131 Ilford to Wembley 16/07 on 5Q20 11:49 departure.

 

[LAX54]

720 127 and 720 129 were both reported in service today 5th June - separately - in posts on se-gen.

saw 129 on the Harwich shuttle a few weeks ago, looked really clean ! some of the 720's it seems do not like Harwich,with pan issues at International

 

[markglos]

Are 720137 to 720144 being built? have seen no reports of any part of them being seen at Derby

 

[TheHSRailFan]

Are 720137 to 720144 being built? have seen no reports of any part of them being seen at Derby

They have still yet to be built, but I won't be surprised if those are the last Aventuras they are building and doing other events right now.

 

[NSEWonderer]

Seems it's getting more common to see 720s doing Stansted express runs. Unless ofc that has always been the case.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Seems it's getting more common to see 720s doing Stansted express runs. Unless ofc that has always been the case.

There aren’t enough 745s to run 2tph Norwich and 4tph Stansted all day plus maintenance. As a result, 755s are likely to materialise on the former and 720s on the latter.

 

[NSEWonderer]

There aren’t enough 745s to run 2tph Norwich and 4tph Stansted all day plus maintenance. As a result, 755s are likely to materialise on the former and 720s on the latter.

I see nice

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

I see nice

Well, I can guess a lot of people would say such a substitution isn’t nice, but I admire your optimism.

 

[Adrian1980uk]

There aren’t enough 745s to run 2tph Norwich and 4tph Stansted all day plus maintenance. As a result, 755s are likely to materialise on the former and 720s on the latter.

There's been a number of discussions on solutions to this issue, 720 conversions for Stansted Express seem most likely

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

There's been a number of discussions on solutions to this issue, 720 conversions for Stansted Express seem most likely

It would make sense.

 

[RealTrains07]

There aren’t enough 745s to run 2tph Norwich and 4tph Stansted all day plus maintenance. As a result, 755s are likely to materialise on the former and 720s on the latter.

Iam surprised GA didnt forsee this being an issue when they put the orders in for the 745s

 

[JonathanH]

Iam surprised GA didnt forsee this being an issue when they put the orders in for the 745s

They expected to be able to reduce the journey times and therefore use fewer units. https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...-and-introduction.158396/page-81#post-6140150

I think it has been suggested that the 720 order itself was seen as tight, but that isn't the case now, with around 20 spare units. https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...n-and-introduction.158396/page-2#post-3682571

 

[travelworld2]

The problem with the Stansted Express 745s on the Norwich run is that there are no tables grouped around four seats, simply the fold down tables on airline seats. It's annoying if you want to work en route as that configuration isn't great for a laptop. To that end, multiple 755s are much better because they are equipped with more working space. To be fair, it would make more sense to put 720s on to Stansted services if that meant limiting the number of Stansted Express 745s on Norwich runs. It's a bit galling to sit on a 745/1 on the Norwich run when a 745/0 is running to Stansted- which does sometimes happen.

 

[NSEWonderer]

Does this mean Ilford drivers sign Stansted now or is this West Anglia drivers. If I remember correctly one of the 3 doesn't operate 720s

 

[JonathanH]

Does this mean Ilford drivers sign Stansted now or is this West Anglia drivers. If I remember correctly one of the 3 doesn't operate 720s

According to https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...route-and-traction-cards.205085/#post-4607265 any West Anglia drivers who sign Stansted Airport sign 720s. Not sure what Ilford would have to do with it.

 

[RailWonderer]

There's been a number of discussions on solutions to this issue, 720 conversions for Stansted Express seem most likely

No money from the DfT.

Iam surprised GA didnt forsee this being an issue when they put the orders in for the 745s

As cited endlessly on the GA Stadler thread, they envisaged a reduction of journey times with a timetable recast (that is not happening anytime soon due to the ECML recast delay) to tighten up turnarounds requiring only 8 circuits on the Norwich IC and 6 or 7 on the Stansted. The bid team ordered the minimum needed to allow Stadler to build a depot at Crown Point that was necessary because the 38 strong order of 755s was not enough so they tacked on an extra 20 745s and were not going to order any more than that.

 

[NSEWonderer]

According to https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...route-and-traction-cards.205085/#post-4607265 any West Anglia drivers who sign Stansted Airport sign 720s. Not sure what Ilford would have to do with it.

Ilford mainly sign 720s so was a toss up between the two but yeh I thought so with west anglia. Makes sense then.

 

[Gulf1159]

Ilford mainly sign 720s so was a toss up between the two but yeh I thought so with west anglia. Makes sense then.

Ilford drivers only sign 720’s now as the other types they did sign 317,321,360 and 379’s have all left the GA fleet and they don’t sign Stansted or any of the West Anglia side

 

[NSEWonderer]

Ilford drivers only sign 720’s now as the other types they did sign 317,321,360 and 379’s have all left the GA fleet and they don’t sign Stansted or any of the West Anglia side

Ah ok I see. Thanks

 

[fat_boy_pete]

134 and 135 moved to Wembley

https://twitter.com/Burbagefox1/status/1684192533113458688?t=QY64zGQtdHiUBNnAAduomg&s=19

 

[Poyntz]

No money from the DfT.

As cited endlessly on the GA Stadler thread, they envisaged a reduction of journey times with a timetable recast (that is not happening anytime soon due to the ECML recast delay) to tighten up turnarounds requiring only 8 circuits on the Norwich IC and 6 or 7 on the Stansted. The bid team ordered the minimum needed to allow Stadler to build a depot at Crown Point that was necessary because the 38 strong order of 755s was not enough so they tacked on an extra 20 745s and were not going to order any more than that.

Thanks for explaining what otherwise would seem an utterly bizarre decision.

 

[robert west]

Is there a number of 720s at Wembley waiting for transfer to Ilford? Haven't seen reports of new units in service lately.

0858 witham to liverpool street today had 720130 leading 720131
1st day in service for this pair?