It's such a disappointment that @Sm5 hasn't managed to answer @Bald Rick's question about when that journey was last undertaken. Maybe the 500 miles was a slight overestimate. 
-
Our new ticketing site is now live! Using either this or the original site (both powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!
UK switching to electric vehicles discussion
- Thread starter MattA7
- Start date
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R
RailUK Forums
For what it's worth I currently have an EV with a real world range of 180 winter or 220 summer miles.
I have a new car on order that according to other owners has a real life range of around 280 to 310 miles. The big difference is it will charge at a maximum of 150kW compared to the current car which has a cap of 42kW.
Having only owned EVs for several years now I can't really see myself needing a bigger battery.
I've done thousands of miles in the current car in the UK and Europe with no issues at all. Last week I plugged in at a decent pub on 10% (6 fast chargers, 4 were available) and by the time I'd finished my lunch I was up to 100% charge.
The people who go "but my diesel car will do 600 miles without having to stop" are missing the point. Unless you have a highly unusual use case the current cars available on the market will suit 95% of the population.
(And for those interested, current car is just short of 3 years old, has 40,000 miles and still has 99.5% original battery capacity remaining.)
I have a new car on order that according to other owners has a real life range of around 280 to 310 miles. The big difference is it will charge at a maximum of 150kW compared to the current car which has a cap of 42kW.
Having only owned EVs for several years now I can't really see myself needing a bigger battery.
I've done thousands of miles in the current car in the UK and Europe with no issues at all. Last week I plugged in at a decent pub on 10% (6 fast chargers, 4 were available) and by the time I'd finished my lunch I was up to 100% charge.
The people who go "but my diesel car will do 600 miles without having to stop" are missing the point. Unless you have a highly unusual use case the current cars available on the market will suit 95% of the population.
(And for those interested, current car is just short of 3 years old, has 40,000 miles and still has 99.5% original battery capacity remaining.)
It's such a disappointment that @Sm5 hasn't managed to answer @Bald Rick's question about when that journey was last undertaken. Maybe the 500 miles was a slight overestimate.
Didn't The Pretenders do that ?
pdq
Member
- Joined
- 7 Oct 2010
- Messages
- 901
It's interesting to see how used prices for nearly new petrol and EV cars seem to be converging a bit. I'm starting to look at a Kia Niro to replace my Octavia. Don't want another Skoda because the infotainment and engine software has driven me crazy in this car.
Anyway, been looking at top of the range Niros 1-2 years old - which will still have 5+ yrs of warranty. A quick look at cars at Kia's own used car website shows a 2022 hybrid with 10k miles for £28k and an EV with 7k miles for £28.5k. Same spec apart from the power plant.
At the cheaper end, there are now 8 year old Leafs around with less than 50k miles, battery still showing full life, for less than £6k.
I've done some sums based on my current energy usage and car mileage/mpg. By swapping to an EV I reckon I'd save around £1200 in fuel costs each year if I moved to the smart EV tariff. Without moving tariff it would still be £900 a year. I see no reason why I'd have to charge away from home except the odd occasion we go away. Without a price differential at the buying stage, the case for EV is getting very strong in this household.
Anyway, been looking at top of the range Niros 1-2 years old - which will still have 5+ yrs of warranty. A quick look at cars at Kia's own used car website shows a 2022 hybrid with 10k miles for £28k and an EV with 7k miles for £28.5k. Same spec apart from the power plant.
At the cheaper end, there are now 8 year old Leafs around with less than 50k miles, battery still showing full life, for less than £6k.
I've done some sums based on my current energy usage and car mileage/mpg. By swapping to an EV I reckon I'd save around £1200 in fuel costs each year if I moved to the smart EV tariff. Without moving tariff it would still be £900 a year. I see no reason why I'd have to charge away from home except the odd occasion we go away. Without a price differential at the buying stage, the case for EV is getting very strong in this household.
Didn't The Pretenders do that ?
or even The Proclaimers?!
But they took a bit longer than 7 hours, - however they could at least get regular comfort breaks when passing through rural areas.
Doh!
The Niro is a great car, we have one of the new model EVs.
If you're looking at a first gen Niro, make sure it's the larger battery version. They did a 50kWh (ish) version too. Hardly anybody bought one which is why they dropped it for the new model, but there will be a few floating around on the second hand market.
Ours is never charged away from home (other than a couple of trips last year when I was using it for work before I replaced my 208 with a Tesla). You won't regret the switch.
StKeverne1497
Member
Out of curiosity, is that from 100% to near zero, or is it within the 20% - 80% band that some manufacturers are still pushing as the best way to prolong the life of the battery? And does the manufacturer state that ultra-super-dooper-fast charging is only to be used occasionally (for example on long trips) as it also prolongs battery life to charge at a more sedate rate?
I only ask because I occasionally look at an EV to replace the small Diesels I've been using on my commute (the last three have been Kangoo, Modus, Sandero). The commute is not quite 100 miles round (can't charge up at work) but when you delve into the numbers, even buying a car with 250 mile range doesn't seem to quite offer me the security I need.
Ignore the rest of this post, I'm just thinking aloud
Hypothetical example. My commute is mostly motorway, it's all year 'round, I can't charge up at work and occasionally (due to roadworks / accidents / other things beyond my control) have to divert by a route which is only slightly longer but involves a lot of climbing.
Claimed range: 250 miles
Range with 20/80 charging (60%): 150 miles
Derate for motorway by 10% (most manufacturers seem to say 15% or so, but my commute isn't all by motorway): 135 miles
Derate for dark, cold winter by a further 10% ish: 120 miles (I note your derate for winter is ~20%)
This leaves me with a margin of only around 20 miles for my normal commute, which is probably ok, but I'd be worried if I did use the diversionary route, and then I'd also worry about remaining battery capacity after 5 years or more. I've tended to keep cars for 10 years+ and 200,000 miles+ The Modus lasted until 220,000 miles and only went because there was a corroded structural component which was on a 16-week-if-you're-lucky-to-find-one lead time. The engine was absolutely fine and may well have lasted to 300,000 miles.
And that's ignoring the capital outlay.
"Fuel" costs are becoming more comparable. Using one of the domestic EV tariffs, it's possible to charge at around 2½p per mile (Octopus, 7.5p/kWh, 3 miles per kWh) while I'm paying around 12p/mile for Diesel*, but charging outside the home is a whole other kettle of fish with 60p/kWh seeming to be about the lowest on offer at the moment (but I don't really know where to look so please correct me on this) which equates to approximately 20p/mile; significantly more than my Diesel costs.
My eldest doesn't need a car with 250 mile range. Commuting is 10 to 20 miles a day and doesn't involve the motorway, so a small car with 100 to 150 mile range would suit perfectly. There's pretty much no choice at that end of the market, and when you do find one availability is near zero. Also, there is no way their bank balance would cope with paying for a £25k car; something in the £15k - £20k range would be more affordable.
Our family car is a 7-seat Berlingo. While an EV Berlingo is scheduled to launch later this year, it is only available with a (comparatively) small battery! The same was true of other similar vehicles such as the Nissan NVe200. What is the point of a family car with best-case 180 mile range (I suppose it's ok for the school run), when you load it up with family and luggage and can't make it even as far as nearest in-laws without a charging stop? We'd normally do the 180 miles either in one hop, or with a short (10 minute) break for the loos. And it certainly makes going on holiday into a much more "relaxed" affair if you have to stop every 100 miles for a charge.
I'm not sure these are all "edge cases" as some are suggesting:
- a car with a guaranteed 100 mile range under adverse conditions and 100,000 miles+
- a car costing less than £20k
- a car capable of taking a large family on holiday without having to stop for a 60 minute (Nissan) or 30 minute (Citroën) charge every 90 minutes of driving
*The problem with the EV tariffs is that out of the special rate, electricity is more expensive than normal tariffs, so you might need to factor this in too. Note also that the Octopus tariff only gives you six hours of 7.5p charging which at 7.5kW (typical domestic charger) is only 45kWh; the larger batteries in the 250 mile+ range cars will be 60kWh or more, though if you are sticking to the 20/80 thing that's 36kWh so do-able. For one car...
A second hand Leaf would probably be affordable for your eldest - you can easily get a decent one for less than £15k.Out of curiosity, is that from 100% to near zero, or is it within the 20% - 80% band that some manufacturers are still pushing as the best way to prolong the life of the battery? And does the manufacturer state that ultra-super-dooper-fast charging is only to be used occasionally (for example on long trips) as it also prolongs battery life to charge at a more sedate rate?
I only ask because I occasionally look at an EV to replace the small Diesels I've been using on my commute (the last three have been Kangoo, Modus, Sandero). The commute is not quite 100 miles round (can't charge up at work) but when you delve into the numbers, even buying a car with 250 mile range doesn't seem to quite offer me the security I need.
Ignore the rest of this post, I'm just thinking aloud
Hypothetical example. My commute is mostly motorway, it's all year 'round, I can't charge up at work and occasionally (due to roadworks / accidents / other things beyond my control) have to divert by a route which is only slightly longer but involves a lot of climbing.
Claimed range: 250 miles
Range with 20/80 charging (60%): 150 miles
Derate for motorway by 10% (most manufacturers seem to say 15% or so, but my commute isn't all by motorway): 135 miles
Derate for dark, cold winter by a further 10% ish: 120 miles (I note your derate for winter is ~20%)
This leaves me with a margin of only around 20 miles for my normal commute, which is probably ok, but I'd be worried if I did use the diversionary route, and then I'd also worry about remaining battery capacity after 5 years or more. I've tended to keep cars for 10 years+ and 200,000 miles+ The Modus lasted until 220,000 miles and only went because there was a corroded structural component which was on a 16-week-if-you're-lucky-to-find-one lead time. The engine was absolutely fine and may well have lasted to 300,000 miles.
And that's ignoring the capital outlay.
"Fuel" costs are becoming more comparable. Using one of the domestic EV tariffs, it's possible to charge at around 2½p per mile (Octopus, 7.5p/kWh, 3 miles per kWh) while I'm paying around 12p/mile for Diesel*, but charging outside the home is a whole other kettle of fish with 60p/kWh seeming to be about the lowest on offer at the moment (but I don't really know where to look so please correct me on this) which equates to approximately 20p/mile; significantly more than my Diesel costs.
My eldest doesn't need a car with 250 mile range. Commuting is 10 to 20 miles a day and doesn't involve the motorway, so a small car with 100 to 150 mile range would suit perfectly. There's pretty much no choice at that end of the market, and when you do find one availability is near zero. Also, there is no way their bank balance would cope with paying for a £25k car; something in the £15k - £20k range would be more affordable.
Our family car is a 7-seat Berlingo. While an EV Berlingo is scheduled to launch later this year, it is only available with a (comparatively) small battery! The same was true of other similar vehicles such as the Nissan NVe200. What is the point of a family car with best-case 180 mile range (I suppose it's ok for the school run), when you load it up with family and luggage and can't make it even as far as nearest in-laws without a charging stop? We'd normally do the 180 miles either in one hop, or with a short (10 minute) break for the loos. And it certainly makes going on holiday into a much more "relaxed" affair if you have to stop every 100 miles for a charge.
I'm not sure these are all "edge cases" as some are suggesting:
There will come a time when we're all driving pure EVs, and we will just adjust our lifestyle to cope (maybe I'll leave earlier in the morning so that I can drive at 60mph on the motorway instead of 70mph) but it's not here yet for us, even though it is getting there for more and more people. I'm profoundly grateful to these early adopters who are helping refine the technology so that us laggards can eventually afford (in all senses of the word) to switch.
- a car with a guaranteed 100 mile range under adverse conditions and 100,000 miles+
- a car costing less than £20k
- a car capable of taking a large family on holiday without having to stop for a 60 minute (Nissan) or 30 minute (Citroën) charge every 90 minutes of driving
*The problem with the EV tariffs is that out of the special rate, electricity is more expensive than normal tariffs, so you might need to factor this in too. Note also that the Octopus tariff only gives you six hours of 7.5p charging which at 7.5kW (typical domestic charger) is only 45kWh; the larger batteries in the 250 mile+ range cars will be 60kWh or more, though if you are sticking to the 20/80 thing that's 36kWh so do-able. For one car...
For you, a Kia Niro, MG5, MG4 would absolutely manage the commute you describe with ease, even in the depths of winter. We have a Niro and went on a family trip to Wales (from Norfolk) last autumn. We stopped once on the way there for about 40 minutes, at the place and duration we'd have stopped anyway to let the kids have a run about.
I also drive a Tesla M3. The reality of that machine is that I need to stop more often than the car needs to charge. Did Norfolk to Preston without charging, and returned from Garstang to Norfolk with just a 5 minute charge (I stopped for tea and wee twice without bothering to charge). When I do stop to charge, by the time I've wandered to the building, made myself comfortable and bought a cup of tea I'm getting notifications that I have enough charge to continue to my destination. If I drink the tea at the service station, usually when I'm just about finishing I'm getting notifications that the car is nearly fully charged and to move it to avoid idle fees.
Public charging is expensive (though still a lot cheaper than petrol at Tesla superchargers which are about half the price of other options, and some other networks you can buy a subscription to reduce the kWh cost if you public charge a lot), but the key is to not charge more than you need to - aim to get home with 10% or less as there's no point arriving home with a battery full of expensive electricity!
We have 2 EVs and only get 4 hours of cheap overnight power on our charger but seems to be working OK.
Edit: There's no issue charging to 100% or running the battery down to 2% if you need to or it makes the journey more convenient. Just don't leave them it in either of those states for long periods of time. Touching high or low state of charge doesn't do the damage, it's being held there for long periods of time (and is also temperature-dependant too). What you shouldn't generally do is charge beyond 80% on a rapid charger as the charge rate slows down a lot and the last 20% might well take longer than the first 80% - that means it's actually quicker for you to drive on and have another short charge if necessary, and makes the charger avaialble for someone else.
Nothing more irritating than "Mr 100%" hogging a charger. I once saw a Zoe on 77% when I arrived at a site. After queuing for 10 minutes and charging for 25, they were still there when I departed, at 86% charging pitifully slowly and seemingly oblivious to the frustration they were causing and the delay to their own journey.
I haven't queud for a Tesla charger though.
I don't yet know anyone with an electric car, whether for reasons of cost or "range anxiety". Meanwhile, according to a recent Transport Times report, the UK Govt is rowing back on its climate targets and relying on technological fixes like electric cars rather than promoting lifestyle change (less car use and flying, more public transport, walking and cycling). The report even suggests it's reluctant to upset the car lobby (surely not!)
www.transporttimes.co.uk
Transport Times Events | News/Blog | Net zero policy hits a new low
Claire Haigh, Founder & CEO Greener Vision publishes her consulation on tackling the climate crisis which will run over the summer.
I don't yet know anyone with an electric car, whether for reasons of cost or "range anxiety". Meanwhile, according to a recent Transport Times report, the UK Govt is rowing back on its climate targets and relying on technological fixes like electric cars rather than promoting lifestyle change (less car use and flying, more public transport, walking and cycling). The report even suggests it's reluctant to upset the car lobby (surely not!)
Transport Times Events | News/Blog | Net zero policy hits a new low
Claire Haigh, Founder & CEO Greener Vision publishes her consulation on tackling the climate crisis which will run over the summer.
Right now they certainly are not even passively encouraging never mind prompoting rail travel
- cancellations and disruption due to ongoing strikes, working to rule, not overtime etc
- cutting the stock on lease so less frequent and/or overcrowded trains even without short formations due maintenance backlog and component supply issues.
- poorer on train experience e.g. layout, seats, luggage space, cutting wi-fi
- complex and inconsistant ticketing types/restrictions and ticket pricing plus potentially closing ticket offices
- existing infrastructure failures increasing
For now used EV's are still seen as a risk plus older technology in a constantly evolving sector. Even if at 10+ years many with only 100-120k miles on the clock still have say 70%+ battery life ending up statistically with e.g. 10% having a failure that is expensive so realistically not worth the cost is a fear. Of course an ICE can have a major failure too but perceived as less likely. Only time will tell.
Last edited:
Yes, all of those things. Public transport - buses as well as trains- is nowhere near meeting the challenge which reduced car use would present. The question is - will it ever be able to meet this challenge? Meanwhile the Austrian railways are ordering more double deck trains to meet the boom in travel!
I think in the next few years once battery recycling becomes commercially widespread, the financial hit from a failed battery will be much lower than it is now, and you'll effectively get a new battery for your old battery plus a much lower amount of cash than you would pay today. Battery prices are still falling rapidly and there's no reason to suspect that won't continue as the supply chain ramps up.
Buying my second hand Tesla it was at the back of my mind, but there's still 80,000 miles on the battery warranty (I will hit 120,000 miles long before the 8 year calendar limit), and total battery failures tend to occur early in a battery life. Same as any technology - most failures are either "dead on arrival" or due to some kind of mistreatment. There will always be a few random failures but that's true with anything that you buy.
5% of the population is a large number of unsuited people.
Try saying "The current rail infrastructure will get 95% of passenger to their destination"
And they should buy a hybrid which will be available to buy new for the next 12 years (and second hand for even longer). By 2035 it is highly likely there will be fully electric cars on the market that have that range (although as others have pointed out it’s pretty unnecessary, and bordering on illegal and certainly dangerous driving), and that charging infrastructure will be ubiquitous and even faster than today. As others have commented I think we are still all waiting for @Sm5 to tell us how often they drive 500 motorway miles non-stop in January? The reality is most people think they need more range than they actually do.
Last edited:
There's a lot of talk about EVs coming with ranges of 600+ miles (subject to usual variations based on speed/temp etc) and I am not sure if that's down to more advanced development or just shoving in more battery cells (or both), but if you can charge a 250-300 mile EV in 10-20 minutes (as is possible now on some vehicles, subject to finding a suitable charger) then it seems like total overkill - unless you are living somewhere where you might need to call upon your car to provide power for long periods of time.
More batteries = more weight. When I was young, people said that not filling up your tank helped keep the weight of your vehicle down and gave improved performance. Why add more weight and cost for a range that's far beyond what you'd ever likely need*.
Hybrids are a solution for many, but what I like about an EV is the reduced maintenance cost and the reduced likelihood of big bills if you keep the car for years (or buy an old one that's 10 years old). Why include all the ICE parts that can go wrong, and potentially make them even harder to work on because of the EV kit squeezed alongside?
* Insert crazy edge-case about that trip into the country where you're miles from civilisation and need to drive all over for your two week holiday, and will never be near a charging point.
More batteries = more weight. When I was young, people said that not filling up your tank helped keep the weight of your vehicle down and gave improved performance. Why add more weight and cost for a range that's far beyond what you'd ever likely need*.
Hybrids are a solution for many, but what I like about an EV is the reduced maintenance cost and the reduced likelihood of big bills if you keep the car for years (or buy an old one that's 10 years old). Why include all the ICE parts that can go wrong, and potentially make them even harder to work on because of the EV kit squeezed alongside?
* Insert crazy edge-case about that trip into the country where you're miles from civilisation and need to drive all over for your two week holiday, and will never be near a charging point.
Indeed more batteries are more weight and also more cost. A real world open road as against sub 40mph range of 300 miles or 250 miles with lights and heating plus reduced battery efficiency in winter I too think would be enough for the majority. This at least double what most standard models with 50 - 60kW battery capacity can deliver now.
Most, if not all, current PHEV have a relatively small battery and an ICE engine with similar power rating to the pure ICE equivalent. The available power is far in excess of the average power at 60 - 70mph. What I would find attractive is a PHEV with around 2/3 of the battery range of the pure EV then an ICE engine and alternator/generator that can deliver the average power at 60mph if not 70mph.
The battery would cover the majority of journeys then for the longer ones start running the ICE engine once the battery is down to say 30%. Away from urban areas this 30% would nominally be maintained. In urban areas the ICE would cut out unless the battery was right down to 10%. The engine might only be 500cc but I wonder if it is the cost, weight and size of the alternator/generator that makes this ideal not practical and/or too expensive to manufacture.
With this a round trip of 250+ miles split into e.g. three 80-90 mile stages could be completed without needing either access to a charger at the stopping points, I am thinking countryside rather than urban, or finding fast rate charger(s) along the route and taking even 20 minute stops not otherwise required.
Last edited:
That would be a rubbish car. It would be more expensive to buy than a pure EV with a full size battery, and because if the small battery you still have to buy loads of expensive fuel.
No thanks.
It’s the exhaust, cooling, fuel systems and starter / alternator that are (collectively) the majority of the weight.
Yes more expensive to purchase / lease than a pure EV but could it be comparable with the current PHEV that only have a small battery and a big engine?
At current fossil fuel prices using the ICE would, or at least should, be significantly more expensive than battery charged at home billed on a low overnight rate tariff. On top of the convenience if using the generator pack was 40mpg cheaper though than a public fast charger at say 75p/kWh - reference below from https://www.rac.co.uk/drive/electri...c-car-public-charging-costs-rac-charge-watch/
Attachments
Have you looked at the BMW i3 Range Extender? That’s fairly similar to what (I think) you are describing?
However, if you compare the specs of the pure EV i3 with the REx versions the addition of the ICE and ancillaries makes a (10-15%) dent on the pure EV range (and therefore overall efficiency) so you’d need to factor that in. I *believe* BMW sold most later ones without the REx as most people found the larger battery enough for their needs if they were worried about range. And presumably why they (or other manufacturers) haven’t done continued to do this with newer models.
DelW
Established Member
- Joined
- 15 Jan 2015
- Messages
- 6,024
As well as the BMW mentioned above, the General Motors Volt / Ampera was fairly close to this concept:
Chevrolet Volt - Wikipedia
but the fact that other builders didn't follow suit, and that it's no longer in production, suggests that it wasn't an attractive option for enough buyers.
I think that part of the problem is that the petrol engine and its ancillaries aren't much smaller or cheaper for a sub-one-litre, lower power engine than they are for a typical 100-150 bhp engine. Current PHEVs run very efficiently on their direct-transmission petrol engines when on long runs at cruising speeds, while using the electric motor during low speed or urban trips, avoids the inefficient use of the ICE motor.
GLC
Member
- Joined
- 21 Nov 2018
- Messages
- 401
I own a range extender i3, and it is perfect for my use case. I am unable to charge my car at home, and so I rely on (increasingly expensive)public chargers. The engine adds around 100kg of weight to the car, and so there is a paper drop in battery range and performance versus the battery only models. However, I get around 100 miles of range (average across motorway and town driving), and with a full tank of petrol (9 Litres), I'll get around another 70 miles on average.
I typically drive around town on battery, and only engage the Rex on the motorway. The 170 mile range is enough to get me far enough along a journey that I would be looking for a break anyway, and on (increasingly infrequent) occasions a charger is broken or occupied and I'm in a rush, I can top up with petrol and be on my way again. Last year I drove Glasgow to Bristol in it, and unfortunately was never able to find unavailable charger once past Cumbria, but the little engine kept me going until I arrived at my destination, where there was a plug anyway, and so I fully charged my car overnight.
I would of course prefer a zero emission car, but the i3 was cheap enough, with enough range, and flexibility until I live somewhere with home charging, that I'm very happy with. The other downside is that on the i3 rex specifically, the engine occupies the same space the optional heat pump would, and so heating/cooling of the cabin is more "thirsty", even if the car has more overall range. That and servicing is more expensive, as now there are annoying reciprocating oily bits of metal to maintain, but otherwise it's perfect for me.
The ride is too firm though
I typically drive around town on battery, and only engage the Rex on the motorway. The 170 mile range is enough to get me far enough along a journey that I would be looking for a break anyway, and on (increasingly infrequent) occasions a charger is broken or occupied and I'm in a rush, I can top up with petrol and be on my way again. Last year I drove Glasgow to Bristol in it, and unfortunately was never able to find unavailable charger once past Cumbria, but the little engine kept me going until I arrived at my destination, where there was a plug anyway, and so I fully charged my car overnight.
I would of course prefer a zero emission car, but the i3 was cheap enough, with enough range, and flexibility until I live somewhere with home charging, that I'm very happy with. The other downside is that on the i3 rex specifically, the engine occupies the same space the optional heat pump would, and so heating/cooling of the cabin is more "thirsty", even if the car has more overall range. That and servicing is more expensive, as now there are annoying reciprocating oily bits of metal to maintain, but otherwise it's perfect for me.
The ride is too firm though
The range extender concept probably died out because once people who have battery anxiety issues actually get used to their car, and their driving needs, they realise it isn't really the reality that you'll end up stranded on a road and starve to death or be eaten by wolves (or both)...
Thought I'd post an update on where EV adoption in the UK is currently and is predicted to be by the end of the year.
We currently have 810k on the roads with 152k sold in the first 6 months . Based on trends YTD the million EV mark will be passed by either December or January. This will take EV numbers to around 1 in 35 cars on the road. Around 300k EV will have been sold in 2023.
In terms of the discussion of extended range models with more or more energy dense batteries, these will come as technology is moving rapidly and so much resources are being used in battery development.
It's likely that most cars will be offered in both a more expensive extended range and cheaper shorter range models as for most people 200 miles range is plenty.
We currently have 810k on the roads with 152k sold in the first 6 months . Based on trends YTD the million EV mark will be passed by either December or January. This will take EV numbers to around 1 in 35 cars on the road. Around 300k EV will have been sold in 2023.
In terms of the discussion of extended range models with more or more energy dense batteries, these will come as technology is moving rapidly and so much resources are being used in battery development.
It's likely that most cars will be offered in both a more expensive extended range and cheaper shorter range models as for most people 200 miles range is plenty.
Well actually no - a car which has been "thrashed" will have borne additional wear on suspension etc, which since EVs are *much* heavier than an equivalent ICE will be a potentially costly repair.
The biggest issue with *any* used car is not how it has been driven but how it has been maintained. I'd rather buy a car which might have been thrashed but has a full, comprehensive service history than one which has seemingly had "one careful owner" but hasn't had an oil change in 5 years, because I know which one will be in better shape mechanically.
== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==
Bit in bold - so the various adverts which keep interrupting whichever TV programne I happen to be watching aren't promoting rail use ?
An EV doesn’t need an oil change though so you don’t have to worry about that…
I’d also like to know what the etc is beyond suspension? As an EV doesn’t have an ICE, clutch, gearbox, coolant system, all of which are the most likely points of failure if a car has been thrashed and/or poorly maintained.