Northern cancellations getting worse

DanJames93 · 19 Jun 2023

I thought that they improved vastly sometime around the new year when they introduced a new timetable?

Liverpool to Wigan & Blackpool.

Had to work on the old site today which meant going into Liverpool, surprise surprise I leave work and the next two services are cancelled delaying me by an hour. Got the TPE instead and took the hit on a taxi fare.

I regret giving them a chance again.

RailUK Forums

td97 · 23 Jun 2023

Northern have issued a statement regarding increased cancellations this weekend (which probably has been true all week). Especially surprising as the Atherton and Westhoughton lines are closed for the next week.

Short notice cancellations across the North West on Friday 23 - Sunday 25 June
Services on several routes in and around the North West are subject to disruption and short-notice cancellations. This is due to high levels of traincrew unavailability. We encourage everyone to plan ahead and recheck close to the time of travel.

TheSel · 23 Jun 2023

td97 said:
Northern have issued a statement regarding increased cancellations this weekend (which probably has been true all week).

Short notice cancellations across the North West on Friday 23 - Sunday 25 June
Services on several routes in and around the North West are subject to disruption and short-notice cancellations. This is due to high levels of traincrew unavailability. We encourage everyone to plan ahead and recheck close to the time of travel.

It's because people HAVE planned ahead, that they have planned to use the services as published.

Sure, there are high levels of traincrew unavailability - we get that. But that in turn means that the inept management at Northern have published timetables (and accepted bookings, I'm guessing) without knowledge that there would be staff in place to run them.

Effectively the advice is: Plan ahead, but don't expect your plans to be achievable.

GordonT · 23 Jun 2023

Holiday season starting to impact on staff availability?

Confused52 · 23 Jun 2023

GordonT said:
Holiday season starting to impact on staff availability?

If it is annual leave is there no limit on how many can take leave at such short notice because the local ones to me are PG codes which means they were not known in time for the Short Term Plan changes. Seems they were only known at 5pm on the 21st, i.e. 48 hours ago. I wouldn't have been able to do that other than for an emergency, is something going on?

43066 · 23 Jun 2023

Confused52 said:
If it is annual leave is there no limit on how many can take leave at such short notice because the local ones to me are PG codes which means they were not known in time for the Short Term Plan changes. Seems they were only known at 5pm on the 21st, i.e. 48 hours ago. I wouldn't have been able to do that other than for an emergency, is something going on

So presumably you work for Northern in planning? Please could you explain what those terms mean for those of us who don’t.

What are PG codes, for example, and what do you mean by “I wouldn’t have been able to do that”?

156421 · 24 Jun 2023

Confused52 said:
If it is annual leave is there no limit on how many can take leave at such short notice because the local ones to me are PG codes which means they were not known in time for the Short Term Plan changes. Seems they were only known at 5pm on the 21st, i.e. 48 hours ago. I wouldn't have been able to do that other than for an emergency, is something going on?

Why does it take 48 hours to change anything?

TheSel · 24 Jun 2023

156421 said:
Why does it take 48 hours to change anything?

Reminds me of the scene in 'Yes, Minister', where Sir Humphrey has to explain to PM Jim Hacker that "... it takes time to do things now. "

Train Maniac · 27 Jun 2023

While i dont normally see the point in grumbling, ive been stuck at Clitheroe for over an hour. Does anyone know why?

pokemonsuper9 · 27 Jun 2023

Train Maniac said:
While i dont normally see the point in grumbling, ive been stuck at Clitheroe for over an hour. Does anyone know why?

Realtime Trains | 2N57 1222 Rochdale to Clitheroe | 27/06/2023

Real-time train running information for 2N57 1222 departure from Rochdale to Clitheroe on 27/06/2023. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

has it as "A passenger taken ill"

Train Maniac · 27 Jun 2023

Ah. Noted.

Thanks

YorkshireBear · 29 Jun 2023

Looking at departure boards I am finally starting to see this increase in cancellations. Recently Carlisle and Sheffield services from Leeds have seen some real reductions in reliability.

I have heard Sheffield depot in particular is really struggling and it will get worse before it gets better.

xtpe · 29 Jun 2023

Yet transpennine have very few it's amazing what a rest day working agreement can do, hopefully northern will get the dft to open the purse strings and get northern drivers the same rate as their counterparts on tpe

175001 · 29 Jun 2023

It's not so much drivers Northern are short, it's more guards.

Ant158 · 29 Jun 2023

Train Maniac said:
While i dont normally see the point in grumbling, ive been stuck at Clitheroe for over an hour. Does anyone know why?

both the 6.58 and 7.28 from Whalley were cancelled this morning, apparently duetoa fault on the train, though the unit 156 and 150 went towards Clitheroe! Also the 6.58 was started at Blackburn again. Cue a drive to mcr for me!

td97 · 29 Jun 2023

Ant158 said:
7.28 from Whalley

There was no issue with that one. It ran throughout.

Ant158 said:
the 6.58

The unit for 2J22 failed on Blackburn King St, so one unit was detached from 2B89 at Blackburn which meant 2J22 could at least run from Blackburn to Rochdale.

Ant158 · 29 Jun 2023

td97 said:
There was no issue with that one. It ran throughout.

The unit for 2J22 failed on Blackburn King St, so one unit was detached from 2B89 at Blackburn which meant 2J22 could at least run from Blackburn to Rochdale.

We were waiting on the platform for the 6.58, an announcement was made about ten past 7 saying the 7.28 to Manchester was cancelled and most passengers left the station. If it actually ran that's really annoying! The display board said it was cancelled too.

northwichcat · 2 Jul 2023

What will be the impact of the ASLEF overtime ban this week?

175001 · 2 Jul 2023

northwichcat said:
What will be the impact of the ASLEF overtime ban this week?

Absolutely ziltch despite the company claiming there will be short notice changes early morning and late night, we haven't done weekday overtime in nearly 18 months...

td97 · 2 Jul 2023

Ant158 said:
If it actually ran that's really annoying! The display board said it was cancelled too.

For future reference it's worth checking if the inbound service makes it to Clitheroe, as this almost guarantees the southbound will run at least as far as Blackburn (as the same traincrew are used for both legs).

Killingworth · 2 Jul 2023

175001 said:
Absolutely ziltch despite the company claiming there will be short notice changes early morning and late night, we haven't done weekday overtime in nearly 18 months...

But weekends? We have to get to Manchester Airport on Sunday so for peace of mind think we'll take the car! It's quicker anyway.

northwichcat · 2 Jul 2023

Killingworth said:
But weekends? We have to get to Manchester Airport on Sunday so for peace of mind think we'll take the car! It's quicker anyway.

Engineering works means no Stockport to Chester services on Sundays this month. That will mean fewer Sundays services for Northern to cover from Piccadilly.

Jamesrob637 · 2 Jul 2023

northwichcat said:
Engineering works means no Stockport to Chester services on Sundays this month. That will mean fewer Sundays services for Northern to cover from Piccadilly.

The rail replacement bus is still only two hourly!

northwichcat · 2 Jul 2023

Jamesrob637 said:
The rail replacement bus is still only two hourly!

What I was getting at is the replacement buses don't need ASLEF members to work them.

Kite159 · 2 Jul 2023

That is assuming Northern can source a replacement bus and don't send something tiny like a 14 seated minibus. Although I suspect most residents on that line don't bother with the trains on Sundays

Mcr Warrior · 2 Jul 2023

northwichcat said:
Engineering works means no Stockport to Chester services on Sundays this month. That will mean fewer Sundays services for Northern to cover from Piccadilly.

Jamesrob637 said:
The rail replacement bus is still only two hourly!

Isn't the Chester to Manchester (via Stockport) Northern train service (when it runs) also effectively just the one service, operating every two hours on Sundays?

Fokx · 2 Jul 2023

Mcr Warrior said:
Isn't the Chester to Manchester (via Stockport) Northern train service (when it runs) also effectively just the one service, operating every two hours on Sundays?

Yes, Hence the two hourly bus replacement service

td97 · 2 Jul 2023

Killingworth said:
But weekends?

It was my understanding that Northern (north west) staffing on Sundays is hampered by guard availability rather than driver. Guard is overtime outside of working week (i.e. entirely voluntary), driver is committed overtime (must work unless a colleague can cover or annual leave day either side).

175001 · 3 Jul 2023

Killingworth said:
But weekends? We have to get to Manchester Airport on Sunday so for peace of mind think we'll take the car! It's quicker anyway.

The overtime ban ends on Saturday 8th.

Sunday will be the normal P codes I'd imagine.

CaptainHaddock · 3 Jul 2023

northwichcat said:
What will be the impact of the ASLEF overtime ban this week?

175001 said:
Absolutely ziltch despite the company claiming there will be short notice changes early morning and late night, we haven't done weekday overtime in nearly 18 months...

Really? This morning between 0730 and 0930 4 out of 8 Barnsley to Sheffield trains were cancelled due to having no driver.

Northern cancellations getting worse

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