London Buses Discussion

[duncanp]

According to the official TfL webpage, the change is not mentioned.

Bus changes

Permanent changes to TfL bus routes including new routes and changes to first and last stops.

tfl.gov.uk

Changes to buses from Saturday 15 July​

The following timetable changes will take place from Saturday 15 July.

The temporary timetable on route 31 will be removed with the frequency of the service restored to run every 10 at all times on all days of the week.

The temporary timetable on route 39 will be removed with the frequency of the service restored to run every 8 minutes during the daytime on Monday to Saturdays and every 12 minutes during the evening, every 15 minutes after 2330, and all day on Sundays.

Route 86 will have a new timetable on all days of the week with minor changes to times.

The temporary timetable on route 93 will be removed with the frequency of the service restored to run every 6-7 minutes during the daytime on Monday to Saturdays and every 10 minutes during the evening and all day on Sundays. Buses continue to run every 30 minutes on all nights of the week.

A temporary timetable will be introduced on route 422 which will widen the frequency of the service to a bus every 11-12 minutes during the daytime on Monday to Saturdays and every 13-14 minutes during the evenings and all day on Sundays. This temporary change is to give buses more time to pass through the East Greenwich area during gas main works on Blackwall Lane.

The temporary timetable on route 493 will be removed with the frequency of the service restored to run every 12 minutes during the daytime on Monday to Saturdays and every 20 minutes during the evening and all day on Sundays.

Route N86 will have a new timetable on all nights of the week with minor changes to times.

 

[Snow1964]

There will be 3 temporary bus routes numbered 718, 719, 720 during this summers 4 phases of Bakerloo and Overground (Euston-Watford) line closures

Route 718 Stonebridge Park to Harrow & Wealdstone (Phase 2)​

• Daily, from first to last train times during Phase 2 (Monday 31 July-Thursday 10 August)
• Via Wembley Central, North Wembley, Preston Road (walk for South Kenton), Kenton
• Access to the Metropolitan line at Preston Road station and Northwick Park station (6-minute walk from Kenton station)

Route 719 Queen's Park to Wembley Park (Phases 1 and 3)​

• During Phase 1: Monday 24 July-Friday 28 July 06:50-18:00
• Phase 3: Friday 11 August and Monday 14 August - Thursday 17 August 07:20-19:35
• Via Kensal Green, Willesden Junction, Harlesden Town Centre, Stonebridge Park, Wembley Central
• Times listed above are approximate departure times of the first/last bus from either Queen's Park or Wembley Park
• Access to the Jubilee and Metropolitan lines at Wembley Park station
• Does not run on Saturdays or Sundays, or during Phase 2

Route 720 Harrow-on-the-Hill to Watford Junction (all phases)​

• From first to last train times
• Via Harrow & Wealdstone, Headstone Lane, Hatch End, Carpenders Park, Bushey, Watford High Street
• Access to the Metropolitan line at Harrow-on-the-Hill station

Major works and events

Information about service changes required for upgrade works and major events. Includes driving, walking and cycling as well as public transport

tfl.gov.uk

 

[Goldfish62]

My thoughts as soon as I saw it. Why on earth someone would want to produce a fake poster like that beats me.

I take that back. Just been told it really is changing.

 

[Deerfold]

I take that back. Just been told it really is changing.

Who by?

 

[Goldfish62]

Who by?

By someone who knows at TfL.

 

[Dstock7080]

Who by?

The email to TfL Staff this morning came from Tom Cunnington, Head of Buses Business Development (Contracts)

 

[Deerfold]

Seems a shame to be SL8 rather than SL7 to keep some link with the old number and the parallel 207 and 427.

 

[LUYMun]

Same here.

 

[bluegoblin7]

First haven’t operated buses in London for a decade.

It’s from the first bus of the day, not ‘from First Bus (company)’.

It’s very much legit. I’m not personally going to share the internal TfL documentation about this, but if any other staff on here wish to search SL8 on Platform (internal Intranet) you’ll find the detail.

 

[Dstock7080]

According to the official TfL webpage, the change is not mentioned.

There is no official information on 607's number change as of yet, and if so it certainly wouldn't come this soon. Case closed.

Bus changes

Permanent changes to TfL bus routes including new routes and changes to first and last stops.

tfl.gov.uk

Route 607 renumbered - 15 July 2023​

From Saturday 15 July route 607 will be renumbered to route SL8. There will be no change to the timetable or the stops served between Uxbridge and White City.

Route SL8 will become the first route to join the Superloop network of express bus routes that will help improve connections and journey times between key outer London town centres and transport hubs.

For more information on route SL8 and Superloop can be found at http://www.tfl.gov.uk/superloop.

Times for the SL8 can be found in our journey planner tool at http://www.tfl.gov.uk/plan-a-journey

 

[Mikey C]

That's bizarre when the first announced route was the X183, suggesting that the Superloop routes would start with an X, and keep their relation with existing "slow" routes.

 

[dmncf]

Strange decision by TfL that on 15 July the only change will be the renumbering of the 607. Doesn't coincide with any changes to the 607's vehicles. Doesn't coincide with renumbering of other pre-existing Superloop routes.

 

[DaveLondon]

How can it be numbered SL8 when the consultations indicate that Superloop routes will have an X-prefix? There is no official information on 607's number change as of yet, and if so it certainly wouldn't come this soon. I might also be inclined to believe that First won't return to operate one route, given the first sentence is "from first bus". If else, it's a grammatical error that clearly indicates the poster's phoniness. Even the number sounds like a practical joke played by whoever created the poster (SL8 = "slate"). Case closed.

It is on the TFL website so all legit (albeit confusing). Vehicles being adapted to carry branding. I wonder why X26 was not renumbered? They carry Superloop branding.

 

[Goldfish62]

It is on the TFL website so all legit (albeit confusing). Vehicles being adapted to carry branding.

I've noticed that the advert frames have been removed on the buses.

Stand by for some hideous wrap including on the window pillars spoiling the impact of the bonded glazing.

 

[matt_world2004]

It is on the TFL website so all legit (albeit confusing). Vehicles being adapted to carry branding. I wonder why X26 was not renumbered? They carry Superloop branding.

X26 is being renumbered sl7 in August not to be confused with slough buses route 7 which serves the same bus station.

 

[MotCO]

X26 is being renumbered sl7 in August not to be confused with slough buses route 7 which serves the same bus station.

Why the random numbering? I would have expected the routes to be numbered sequentially clockwise, but SL7 does not link with SL8. Confusing or what?

 

[matt_world2004]

Why the random numbering? I would have expected the routes to be numbered sequentially clockwise, but SL7 does not link with SL8. Confusing or what?

I'm not sure. X68 is renamed the Sl6 and X140 is going to be renamed the SL9. X26 is being renumbered on the 19th August, but I don't know about the others.

 

[Surreytraveller]

I don't know why they cannot leave numbers of existing routes alone. It just leads to confusion. Rebrands cause chaos (thinking of Kentish Bus's renumbering of their routes back in the 1980s

 

[Busaholic]

I'm finding so much about so-called Superloop confusing. For a start, what has the 607 (or SL8) got to do with linking places in Outer London, any more than the peak X68 has? If those routes are included in the branding, it is obviously only to bring all express routes under one brand. The main imperative to do this, with one series of new route numbers, presumably numerically from SL1, in my mind would be to indicate that the usual bus fare does not apply on these services i.e. a higher flat fare applies. According to TfL, though, presumably very much under instruction from the Mayor, this will not be the case. If this is so, I see it as commercial suicide, and very overcrowded buses skipping stops. The fare on each route needs to be double the usual, with different ticket machines obviously as pointer to this.

The whole Superloop concept has an obvious flaw in any case, though it's not the fault of the bus operator. that being the lack of River Thames crossings between East and South East London in anywhere like the right places for it. Even if a Silvertown crossing does get constructed within a few years, Blackheath is hardly Outer London, for instance! I think the Dartford crossing needs to be brought into the picture of necessity, despite the risk of disruption at times. I know it's not even in London, but Herts and Essex get huge benefits daily from TfL services. The Dartford to Bexleyheath section of new route would reintroduce the express Green Line 725 and 726 of yesteryear, and on to Bromley and Croydon, though maybe a diversion via Erith could be incorporated, probably the nearest Thamesmead will get to it.

 

[johncrossley]

In my mind would be to indicate that the usual bus fare does not apply on these services i.e. a higher flat fare applies. According to TfL, though, presumably very much under instruction from the Mayor, this will not be the case. If this is so, I see it as commercial suicide, and very overcrowded buses skipping stops. The fare on each route needs to be double the usual, with different ticket machines obviously as pointer to this.

The 607 has coexisted with the 207/427 for many years without premium fares and without such chaos, so why should new limited stop services be any different?

 

[matt_world2004]

I'm finding so much about so-called Superloop confusing. For a start, what has the 607 (or SL8) got to do with linking places in Outer London, any more than the peak X68 has? If those routes are included in the branding, it is obviously only to bring all express routes under one brand. The main imperative to do this, with one series of new route numbers, presumably numerically from SL1, in my mind would be to indicate that the usual bus fare does not apply on these services i.e. a higher flat fare applies. According to TfL, though, presumably very much under instruction from the Mayor, this will not be the case. If this is so, I see it as commercial suicide, and very overcrowded buses skipping stops. The fare on each route needs to be double the usual, with different ticket machines obviously as pointer to this.

The whole Superloop concept has an obvious flaw in any case, though it's not the fault of the bus operator. that being the lack of River Thames crossings between East and South East London in anywhere like the right places for it. Even if a Silvertown crossing does get constructed within a few years, Blackheath is hardly Outer London, for instance! I think the Dartford crossing needs to be brought into the picture of necessity, despite the risk of disruption at times. I know it's not even in London, but Herts and Essex get huge benefits daily from TfL services. The Dartford to Bexleyheath section of new route would reintroduce the express Green Line 725 and 726 of yesteryear, and on to Bromley and Croydon, though maybe a diversion via Erith could be incorporated, probably the nearest Thamesmead will get to it.

X68 is being renumbered to the sl6.

 

[Blindtraveler]

I would have said that bringing Dartford into the equation would be commercial suicide also. The and sign bus x 80 Bluewater to lake side and chafford Hundred can pick up some monstrous delays when it all falls over, I did the root for the first time the other week and was on board and extremely hot Street deck for over 90 minutes

When does the super loop network actually launch

 

[Snow1964]

The 607 has coexisted with the 207/427 for many years without premium fares and without such chaos, so why should new limited stop services be any different?

I think Superloop is to have a frequency of between 4-6 buses an hour, current X26 is only half hourly, but in the tender programme.

The 607 is probably getting a frequency cut, it virtually duplicates the newly opened Western section of Elizabeth line, so will probably be spun as excuse as standardising Superloop frequencies rather than decimating the 607

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 2 Jul 2023 ==

When does the super loop network actually launch

Superloop is officially still a proposal out for Consultation, without any consultation results being published that it will be going ahead.
(but TfL tends to ignore statutory consultation and will have decided it is a done deal before results, then will probably publish fixed results just days before it starts)

 

[MotCO]

Superloop is officially still a proposal out for Consultation, without any consultation results being published that it will be going ahead.
(but TfL tends to ignore statutory consultation and will have decided it is a done deal before results, then will probably publish fixed results just days before it starts)

So will the new routes be tendered before the consultation outcome? Makes a mockery of 'consultation'.

Btw, when did new routes or changes to routes have to be consulted on? There was a time when there was an idea and it was just implemented.

 

[Notchapple]

X68 is being renumbered to the sl6.

Could I ask for the source of your information?

 

[Snow1964]

So will the new routes be tendered before the consultation outcome? Makes a mockery of 'consultation'.

Btw, when did new routes or changes to routes have to be consulted on? There was a time when there was an idea and it was just implemented.

Yes TfL will tender routes, even notify the Operators of start dates, weeks before consultation results.

These are latest X34 (Finchley-Walthamstow part of Superloop) which even says it is a consultation open until 21st July

Proposals for a new limited stop express bus route between North Finchley and Walthamstow (X34 bus route), part of the Superloop

Update 4 October 2023 Today we have published our response to the issues raised during the consultation on proposals for a new express bus route between North Finchley and Walthamstow, called SL1 (previously X34). Thank you to everyone who gave us

haveyoursay.tfl.gov.uk

And this is latest on other Superloop routes

Route X183 consultation, part of the Superloop
The consultation on proposals for a new limited stop express bus service between Harrow and North Finchley, called the X183, closed on 12 June. This route would form part of the proposed Superloop.
We are now analysing your feedback and will report on the outcomes of the consultation shortly.


Superloop sector maps
We have published maps showing further detail about our initial ideas for the new proposed Superloop bus routes. The maps show potential future sections which would, subject to consultation, provide limited stop links between:

• Harrow to North Finchley
• North Finchley and Walthamstow
• Walthamstow and the Royal Docks
• route X239 connecting Canary Wharf and Grove Park, (which was consulted on as part of the Silvertown Tunnel bus network)
• Bromley and Bexleyheath
• Croydon and Bromley

The routes and destinations shown are indicative and subject to further detailed planning, stakeholder engagement and public consultation.

Superloop - proposals for a network of limited-stop express buses connecting outer London

-update starts - Consultation reports have been published for routes SL10, SL1, SL2 and SL3, including our responses to the issues raised for SL1 and SL10. For further information about these and to read the reports, please visit: SL1 between North Finchley and

haveyoursay.tfl.gov.uk

 

[johncrossley]

Changes can still be made as a result of consultation even after the route has been tendered.

 

[Goldfish62]

Btw, when did new routes or changes to routes have to be consulted on?

Physical changes, new routes and withdrawals have always required consultation.

Frequency changes and a change of vehicle size do not require consultation.

 

[Busaholic]

The 607 has coexisted with the 207/427 for many years without premium fares and without such chaos, so why should new limited stop services be any different?

Because TfL is in a parlous financial situation and the current low flat level fare is predicated on so many bus journeys being of short distance and duration. The daily fare cap still means bus services are much more affordable in London than in so many other places and with better frequencies to boot.

 

[Dstock7080]

The 607 is probably getting a frequency cut, it virtually duplicates the newly opened Western section of Elizabeth line, so will probably be spun as excuse as standardising Superloop frequencies rather than decimating the 607

From the link above the SL8 isn’t changing frequency from 15 July.
However, “from 19 August an improved schedule will see buses run earlier and later.”