TPE franchise to move to OLR

[43074]

VTEC was running fine, other than the need to pay big premiums to the government… something which the government were happy to sign up to at the time but then used as a stick to beat Virgin/ Stagecoach with

People have short memories don't they?

Under VTEC morale was run into the ground, they overstretched the HST and 225 Fleet at the time by running additional services e.g. Edinburgh half hourly and a token Sunderland service, and staff shortages among TM and Catering grades were the norm. Essentially the need to pay big premiums affected the service on offer.

 

[Agent_Squash]

People have short memories don't they?

Under VTEC morale was run into the ground, they overstretched the HST and 225 Fleet at the time by running additional services e.g. Edinburgh half hourly and a token Sunderland service, and staff shortages among TM and Catering grades were the norm. Essentially the need to pay big premiums affected the service on offer.

Exactly, it wasn’t the management that was the problem - it was the premiums!

Believe it or not, even good management can’t get you out of having to make cuts (read: morale ‘run into the ground’) and stretching things to the limit because you owe the Treasury tens of million pounds annually.

 

[VauxhallNova]

So whose fault were the premium payments?

 

[DynamicSpirit]

On a lighter note, it seems that, in an unusual display of competence when reporting rail matters, the photo accompanying the BBC News report about this story actually is of a TPE train (and not, say, a SouthEastern or an SWR train because some reporter can't tell the difference )

 

[LYuen]

So whose fault were the premium payments?

Stagecoach bid for the terms didn't they?

 

[eldomtom2]

Nationalising means that the “spare money” has to be authorised from the government / DfT/ treasury who are incredibly reluctant for any “spare pennies” to be given out and in many cases is quite the opposite - cuts.

Except of course, in the present situation all the money comes from the government anyway...

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Under VTEC morale was run into the ground

Now it's gone the other way and LNER staff patrol trains with god complexes unrivalled by any other TOC.

 

[Horizon22]

Except of course, in the present situation all the money comes from the government anyway...

Well exactly - people expecting massive changes (that aren't already in the pipeline) I think will be left disappointed.

Most of the North of England local services are now effectively "nationalised"; it will be interesting to see what people who say "nationalise the railways" think about it once being told about it when they criticise the railway.

 

[Urobach]

Under the impression TPE driver do now have a RDW agreement in place, but it went into place the same time as Action short of a strike by ASLEF - overtime ban.

Correct a RDW agreement similar to last deal has been agreed, however, an overtime ban is in place due to multiple abrogation of T&Cs (on top of the national dispute)

Meetings have been happening in an attempt to resolve said issues but as yet it's as you were

 

[Olivine]

Agreed

VTEC was running fine, other than the need to pay big premiums to the government… something which the government were happy to sign up to at the time but then used as a stick to beat Virgin/ Stagecoach with

No, it was set up and run properly by East Coast trains (OLR) with exceptional profits, reliability and passenger satisfaction - six years of hard work ruined by three years under VTEC.

 

[basfordlad]

Now it's gone the other way and LNER staff patrol trains with god complexes unrivalled by any other TOC.

What do you mean?

 

[alansheppard77]

The Transport Secretary has today (11 May 2023) announced he will not renew or extend Transpennine Express’s (TPE) contract at the end of the month. This will bring the company into operator of last resort (OLR) from 28 May 2023.

Transpennine Express to be brought into operator of last resort

Transport Secretary has announced he will not renew or extend Transpennine Express's contract.

www.gov.uk

Great news

 

[ainsworth74]

What do you mean?

I believe @TT-ONR-NRN remains somewhat unhappy that Virgin are no longer present on the railway in any form and so this shows as being unhappy with subsequent operators of their former franchises

 

[JamesT]

Stagecoach bid for the terms didn't they?

Didn't Grayling later admit that the tender process encouraged overbidding?

 

[43066]

Except of course, in the present situation all the money comes from the government anyway...

Yet the government keep linking railway spend with fare revenue received.

 

[DJH1971]

This was ultimately inevitable.

Wonder what new name it will have under the OLR?

 

[Gaelan]

This was ultimately inevitable.

Wonder what new name it will have under the OLR?

Beyond LNER (where they obviously had to drop the “Virgin”), haven’t they more or less kept the names and branding as-is?

 

[pokemonsuper9]

Wonder what new name it will have under the OLR?

this might be a bit of a radical idea, but how about "Transpennine Express", I know the WCML route doesn't even cross the Pennines but most of the trains do, and they mostly run fast trains now so the "express" fits. (do I need to put a note saying this is satire?)

 

[Darandio]

My money would be on them removing a word and simply branding it "Trans-Pennine".

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

I believe @TT-ONR-NRN remains somewhat unhappy that Virgin are no longer present on the railway in any form and so this shows as being unhappy with subsequent operators of their former franchises

A rather patronising thing to suggest... do you really suppose I am that biased (?), because I'm not. I have spoken multiple times across other threads about the increasingly arrogant attitude of LNER staff over the recent couple of years, from the condescending treatment of first class customers by the hosts, the pettiness of the red tape brigade at King's Cross, the gobby Twitter team trying to take the moral high ground, etc.

I won't expand further as it's not really relevant, but type in TT-ONR-NRN and LNER to the search bar and you'll see enough results.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 11 May 2023 ==

My money would be on them removing a word and simply branding it "Trans-Pennine".

Another designer £10,000 makeover like Northern's?

 

[irish_rail]

Nothing more than a scape goat. I'd look at the head first rail as the heart of the problems.

Indeed. The loss of route knowledge for staff, especially drivers , across all First group franchises is at the heart of what is actually screwing up their railways operationally. The attempt to blame Aslef is frankly disingenuous at best, and libelous at worst.

 

[josh-j]

How much? A very small percentage is profit and the vast majority is already “nationalised”. One major thing that isn’t are rolling stock companies (ROSCOs) and it would cost tens of billions of pounds to buy that all back.

Nationalising means that the “spare money” has to be authorised from the government / DfT/ treasury who are incredibly reluctant for any “spare pennies” to be given out and in many cases is quite the opposite - cuts.

I don't see how it would cost money to buy back rolling stock - short term yes, but long term it would make money. And government can fund the short term cost very easily. It is really a no brainer, but of course the ROSCOs are owned by wealthy and influential funds and banks, so...

What a scam.

 

[Horizon22]

I don't see how it would cost money to buy back rolling stock - short term yes, but long term it would make money. And government can fund the short term cost very easily. It is really a no brainer, but of course the ROSCOs are owned by wealthy and influential funds and banks, so...

What a scam.

Have you met any government in the last 30 years (and particularly this one) when it comes to infrastructure spending? Often all they think about is short-term.

 

[CdBrux]

I wish we could do away with the ridiculous fiction that railway success or failure is down to private operators.

which was then followed by exactly that!

 

[Clarence Yard]

Indeed. The loss of route knowledge for staff, especially drivers , across all First group franchises is at the heart of what is actually screwing up their railways operationally. The attempt to blame Aslef is frankly disingenuous at best, and libelous at worst.

It’s political spin, that’s all.

The loss of route knowledge isn’t just a FG thing - it’s a DfT policy in order to reduce training costs. You just notice it more with FG because of the diversionary routes their TOCs have traditionally operated over. The DfT also love diagram optimisation packages because it minimises headcount.

They are not bothered about the chaos that it all causes.

 

[class 9]

Drivers being entitled to breaks etc. on the diagrams the company has agreed isn’t really a problem to be solved. Of course, as in any other workplace, a lack of goodwill will inevitably mean people are less likely to be willing to be flexible in order to help the company dig itself out of the mess its own decisions have created.

Not sure what you mean by driving a new traction every month as opposed to every six months?

The biggest things AIUI, other than the poor diagraming discussed on this thread, are the RDW agreement and lack of goodwill which likely won’t be sorted until the wider industrial dispute is resolved.

I presume the bit about traction is referring to Traction Competence, the industry standard is 6 months, surely TPE Competence doesn't run out after only a month??

 

[Agent_Squash]

Stagecoach bid for the terms didn't they?

The bid team and the day-to-day management teams tend to have very different focuses - one focused on the pie in the sky, the other firmly grounded in reality...

Greater Anglia is a brilliant example - fortunately for them, they got saved by COVID.

 

[Bantamzen]

Indeed. The loss of route knowledge for staff, especially drivers , across all First group franchises is at the heart of what is actually screwing up their railways operationally. The attempt to blame Aslef is frankly disingenuous at best, and libelous at worst.

The failure of multiple franchises over the years is a failure for the entire industry, despite the posturing by all sides.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

I don't see how it would cost money to buy back rolling stock - short term yes, but long term it would make money. And government can fund the short term cost very easily. It is really a no brainer, but of course the ROSCOs are owned by wealthy and influential funds and banks, so...

Most rolling stock is maintained by manufacturers these days, so it's not just a case of buying the stock.
Even public operators Merseyrail, Scotrail, TfL and TfW have long-term leasing/maintenance contracts for their stock.
Try unpicking the IEP deal with Hitachi (27.5 years lease including maintenance at Hitachi depots).
HS2 will be similar.

All transport operators (airlines, shipping etc) use leasing and purchase options when they borrow to fund an operation.
Purchase, sale and leaseback is another option in some cases.
Leasing (with manufacturer's maintenance) is also increasingly common with European state railway operators.

 

[infobleep]

There is one upside to this, if you consider it a silver lining, another TOC will be able to be FOI'ed. That is sent a Freedom of Ibformation reuwest, being a publicly owned company.

I am sure someone will find that useful.