tfl fare evasion

[railperson8928]

Hi there,
I regrettably committed fare evasion on tfl bus (i know its not rail but this is the only place I could get free help)

I really don't want a record on my name, especially as I want to work in the US.

Apparently I could write to them about out-of-court settlement. Whats the success rate of this?

I've received the letter where I will have to write back to them whether I accept or deny the offence. If I write back to say I accept commiting the offence, I will receive a SJP notice which will go on my record.

So, If I were to write a letter where I didnt mention 'deny or accept' and just go into detail about my future and how I wont do it again as I've now seen how serious it is, and then write about out of court settlement, will it work?

Please dont grill me, I've learnt my lesson

 

[AlterEgo]

It would help to know the nature of the evasion, because not all cases are the same. Abuse of high value passes like staff, Freedom, and younger person Oysters are more serious than other types of evasion, at least in the eyes of TfL.

 

[railperson8928]

oh dear
I accidentally used my brothers 11-15 oyster card as it was in my wallet from when I went out with my siblings and forgot to take it out

 

[Mike395]

Hi and welcome to the forum (albeit in slightly tricky circumstances!).

I mention this only as any person at TfL reviewing an appeal would pick up on this sort of thing should you include it in a reply to them, but there’s something that doesn’t quite add up.

You mention in your first post you wouldn’t do it again because you recognise the seriousness of the situation, but also in the second that you forgot it was a sibling’s Oyster card in your wallet so the usage was accidental. These can’t both be true.

So long as you’re careful not to give away too many specifics as to the exact journey / date here - I’d recommend being entirely honest in your replies here as we can only assist based on the information given (even if you conceivably may wish to/be advised to withhold information that’s not explicitly asked for, without being untruthful, in any reply to TfL)

 

[railperson8928]

After reading your second sentence, I can see that I do sound suspicious. However, It was an accidental use, at the time I was pre-occupied with something and the sound was the same as my regular oyster. My wallet has inner parts you can put cards in and I tapped the wrong end of my wallet.

If I were to be honest about the situation then this would lead to me accepting the offence, and thus lead to a non-criminal conviction. I do accept that I was in the wrong (I should've taken them out once we got home) however I cannot accept a criminal conviction which could hassle my career (im still in my early twenties).

How can I reply to the letter asking for a criminal conviction, to say Im sorry and to not write anything that could be used to start a prosecution.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 3 May 2023 ==

Just thought to mention, the reason why I hold my siblings card (the 11-15 yo one) is because he has autism and would lose the card during our travels (which has happened previously)

 

[AlterEgo]

TfL probably aren't going to buy that you did it by accident - and they generally find that most people who are caught using a free travel card they aren't entitled to haven't been unlucky enough to be caught on the first occasion.

They will likely seek to prosecute you for the single offence where you were caught, but you should be aware they will audit the pass' use especially if they offer you a settlement instead.

 

[furlong]

Is there any other information that would suggest it was accidental? Was it a regular journey where you can show that on every other occasion you used the correct card? Were there previous journeys the same day using the correct card? How were you caught and how did you react? Did you tell any lies at any point? At what point did you realise the wrong card was used? Would the bus CCTV help to show this was careless rather than deliberate? Can you provide them with some medical evidence for the autism? What changes have you made to make sure this can never happen again? Do you know anyone in a position of authority who'd be prepared to give you a short reference about your honesty and integrity? etc.etc.
TfL nearly always seems to prosecute but that doesn't stop you trying to persuade them it was genuinely careless rather than pre-meditated and to be lenient to you, or failing that, to provide mitigation to the court in an attempt to reduce the consequences for you if you are convicted.

 

[Hadders]

Welcome to the forum!

I think you're getting things slightly wrong about exactly what will happen regarding out fo court settlements and prosecutions.

Firstly, TfL rarely agree to put of court settlements, especially where misuse of Freedom Passes and Zip Oyster cards are concerned but in certain limited circumstances they have been known to issue a Final Warning. It might be worth failiarising yourself with TfL's Revenue Enforcement & Prosecutions Policy.

https://content.tfl.gov.uk/revenue-enforcement-and-prosecution-policy.pdf

Next, it sounds as though they have sent you a Verification Letter. This is your opportunity to tell them your version of events, along with any mitigating circumstances. Once you have sent this back to them they will then decide how to proceed, which will be one of the following:

1. Take no further action (highly unlikely in my view)
2. Issue a Final Warning
3. Prosecute you in the Magistrates Court

It would be helpful if you could post a copy of the letter you have received, with personal details redacted along with your draft reply and forum members will be happy to proof read it for you.

If the case is sent to the magistrates court then it will almost certainly be for breaking one of the TfL Bylaws. Prosecutions like these are normally heard by a single magistrate under what is called a Single Justice Procedure. If you plead guilty there is normally no reason to attend court in person, the magistrate will decide what penalty to impose based on the facts they have available, and you will be sent a letter with the outcome. If you plead guilty you can still attend court if you wish to give information to the magistrate in person. If you plead not guilty but if you do this you will need to attend court to argue your case.

If you plead guilty or are found guilty by the court then you will have been convicted of a Bylaw offence and I would expect the court to impose a fine, and be required to pay a victim surcharge, court costs and compensation for the fare avoided. Bylaw are criminal convictions but they aren't normally recorded on thre Police National Computer and normally won't show on DBS checks. That said, if you are asked about convictions in relation to employment or travel to the US etc then it is always best to be honest about what has happened. A conviction for a bylaw offence isn't something that I owuld expect to be a hinderance to your future employment prospects as long as you are honest about it.

 

[railperson8928]

Is there any other information that would suggest it was accidental? Was it a regular journey where you can show that on every other occasion you used the correct card? Were there previous journeys the same day using the correct card? How were you caught and how did you react? Did you tell any lies at any point? At what point did you realise the wrong card was used? Would the bus CCTV help to show this was careless rather than deliberate? Can you provide them with some medical evidence for the autism? What changes have you made to make sure this can never happen again? Do you know anyone in a position of authority who'd be prepared to give you a short reference about your honesty and integrity? etc.etc.
TfL nearly always seems to prosecute but that doesn't stop you trying to persuade them it was genuinely careless rather than pre-meditated and to be lenient to you, or failing that, to provide mitigation to the court in an attempt to reduce the consequences for you if you are convicted.

Hi Furlong, thank you so much for your detailed answer and yes I can definitely provide those. However, I'm just afraid on what to put for my initial letter as I know that any evidence I send can be used. In addition, if I do provide those info wouldn't that mean I admit to the offence which would mean they would simply give me a SJP notice and subsequently a criminal conviction.

 

[L401CJF]

Hi Furlong, thank you so much for your detailed answer and yes I can definitely provide those. However, I'm just afraid on what to put for my initial letter as I know that any evidence I send can be used. In addition, if I do provide those info wouldn't that mean I admit to the offence which would mean they would simply give me a SJP notice and subsequently a criminal conviction.

I'm no expert here and I'm sure others will correct me if I'm wrong - the offence has already been committed and they have evidence of that. They're effectively asking for your side of the story. If it is a genuine mistake, provide some evidence of that. They may ask you to pay a sum (out of court settlement with a final warning or similar to effectively make the matter go away).

If I am reading correctly you claim to have accidentally touched the wrong card as you have yours and your brothers in the same wallet. If you can provide evidence that it is infact a mistake (such as showing you used the correct card for other journeys the same day for example) then it may well help persuade them it was a mistake.

You're not admitting the offence as such, they already have proof of that.

Others will be able to provide further advice!

 

[railperson8928]

Welcome to the forum!

I think you're getting things slightly wrong about exactly what will happen regarding out fo court settlements and prosecutions.

Firstly, TfL rarely agree to put of court settlements, especially where misuse of Freedom Passes and Zip Oyster cards are concerned but in certain limited circumstances they have been known to issue a Final Warning. It might be worth failiarising yourself with TfL's Revenue Enforcement & Prosecutions Policy.

https://content.tfl.gov.uk/revenue-enforcement-and-prosecution-policy.pdf

Next, it sounds as though they have sent you a Verification Letter. This is your opportunity to tell them your version of events, along with any mitigating circumstances. Once you have sent this back to them they will then decide how to proceed, which will be one of the following:

1. Take no further action (highly unlikely in my view)
2. Issue a Final Warning
3. Prosecute you in the Magistrates Court

It would be helpful if you could post a copy of the letter you have received, with personal details redacted along with your draft reply and forum members will be happy to proof read it for you.

If the case is sent to the magistrates court then it will almost certainly be for breaking one of the TfL Bylaws. Prosecutions like these are normally heard by a single magistrate under what is called a Single Justice Procedure. If you plead guilty there is normally no reason to attend court in person, the magistrate will decide what penalty to impose based on the facts they have available, and you will be sent a letter with the outcome. If you plead guilty you can still attend court if you wish to give information to the magistrate in person. If you plead not guilty but if you do this you will need to attend court to argue your case.

If you plead guilty or are found guilty by the court then you will have been convicted of a Bylaw offence and I would expect the court to impose a fine, and be required to pay a victim surcharge, court costs and compensation for the fare avoided. Bylaw are criminal convictions but they aren't normally recorded on thre Police National Computer and normally won't show on DBS checks. That said, if you are asked about convictions in relation to employment or travel to the US etc then it is always best to be honest about what has happened. A conviction for a bylaw offence isn't something that I owuld expect to be a hinderance to your future employment prospects as long as you are honest about it.

much appreciated for your detailed reply. The letter I received it the same one from this forum https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...train-tfl-updated-now-recieved-letter.241659/

I can provide proof that I used the correct oyster card, and that it was topped with credit that day. I can also submit my brothers EHCP plan as evidence (his medical letters a slightly old, but I can still attach them if they would be good). Maybe ask to show cctv that I didnt check first which card end I was tapping, I was also on my phone the entire time as I was dealing with something at the time and was preoccupied by texting.

Would these things be okay to include in the first letter, those things, along with:

I would like to express my willingness to settle this matter out of court. I understand the seriousness of the offence and would like to resolve the matter as quickly and efficiently as possible without adding stress and work to London's prosecution office for a non-criminal case.
I am willing to pay any outstanding fare and administration costs associated with this matter, and I would like to request that you consider this offer as an alternative to prosecution.

Thank you for your attention to this matter.

 

[Krokodil]

Get a print out of your Oyster history statement for the day in question. Also see if you can get a screenshot of your call history.

 

[WesternLancer]

much appreciated for your detailed reply. The letter I received it the same one from this forum https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...train-tfl-updated-now-recieved-letter.241659/

I can provide proof that I used the correct oyster card, and that it was topped with credit that day. I can also submit my brothers EHCP plan as evidence (his medical letters a slightly old, but I can still attach them if they would be good). Maybe ask to show cctv that I didnt check first which card end I was tapping, I was also on my phone the entire time as I was dealing with something at the time and was preoccupied by texting.

Would these things be okay to include in the first letter, those things, along with:

I would like to express my willingness to settle this matter out of court. I understand the seriousness of the offence and would like to resolve the matter as quickly and efficiently as possible without adding stress and work to London's prosecution office for a non-criminal case.
I am willing to pay any outstanding fare and administration costs associated with this matter, and I would like to request that you consider this offer as an alternative to prosecution.

Thank you for your attention to this matter.

seems fine - obv as brief and as clear as possible explain it was a mistake and how this occurred (as you have explained in the thread) - after all these things can happen. Just do not lie. might help if you post up your full draft that includes that too for people to check for you. Include the evidence and as above, eg copy of your own oyster card statement showing regular, legitimate use.

 

[railperson8928]

seems fine - obv as brief and as clear as possible explain it was a mistake and how this occurred (as you have explained in the thread) - after all these things can happen. Just do not lie. might help if you post up your full draft that includes that too for people to check for you. Include the evidence and as above, eg copy of your own oyster card statement showing regular, legitimate use.

will do in a bit!
I've contacted a solicitor and they've said a sjp notice isnt a conviction, however I'm reading all on the internet that it is. I'm not sure who to believe.
It doesnt help that I work in the financial sector either and could affect my work

 

[alholmes]

will do in a bit!
I've contacted a solicitor and they've said a sjp notice isnt a conviction, however I'm reading all on the internet that it is. I'm not sure who to believe.
It doesnt help that I work in the financial sector either and could affect my work

It’s not a conviction. It’s a process by which you can either plead guilty by post (which would then result in a conviction but save you from going to court in person), or you plead not guilty which then results in a court hearing where a magistrate/judge will then consider the evidence before reaching a verdict - obviously if it’s a guilty verdict then it’s a conviction.