Are diesel trains allowed through the Thameslink Tunnels?

[778]

Are diesel trains (diesel hauled trains and DMUs) allowed through the Thameslink tunnels through central London or are they banned? I know diesel hauled trains used to run to Moorgate, so it must have been allowed in the past.

I know there is no reason a diesel hauled train would go through the Thameslink core as far as I am aware, I would just like to know if it would be allowed in certain circumstances (railtours, diverted freights etc).

 

[theageofthetra]

Are diesel trains (diesel hauled trains and DMUs) allowed through the Thameslink tunnels through central London or are they banned? I know diesel hauled trains used to run to Moorgate, so it must have been allowed in the past.

I know there is no reason a diesel hauled train would go through the Thameslink core as far as I am aware, I would just like to know if it would be allowed in certain circumstances (railtours, diverted freights etc).

I'm guessing track maintenance vehicles, must go through there?

 

[Gaelan]

Looking at route clearance in the sectional appendix (https://sacuksprodnrdigital0001.blo...sex Wessex Sectional Appendix March 2023 .pdf - route clearance starts around page 881, Thameslink core is listed under SO280), no DMUs but classes 31 and 33 are allowed under certain conditions. No loco-hauled coaching stock either, so railtours would be tricky.

 

[Supercoss]

Only class 31 , 33/2 and class 73 are route cleared due to a height restriction ( minimum overhead line clearance ) mark 1 and 2 coaching stock also cleared.
the overhead line must be isolated ( but not earthed )
15 mph speed restriction
opening windows should be closed

 

[zwk500]

I would just like to know if it would be allowed in certain circumstances (railtours, diverted freights etc).

No railtours or freight would be accepted by planning teams. You would need an unholy combination of circumstances going wrong to get control to send a railtiur or freight train through, due to clearances required.
Engineering trains and the test train fleet are the only diesels planned through the core.

Only class 31 , 33/2 and class 73 are route cleared due to a height restriction ( minimum overhead line clearance ) mark 1 and 2 coaching stock also cleared.

Is Loco gauge cleared?

 

[NSE]

Can a 73 take power from the third rail once it’s there or does it have to stay on diesel?

 

[Supercoss]

conductor rail goes as far north as Farringdon platform so 3rd rail power could be used.
as to rail tours a tour could be operated but it would require to operate either early in morning or at weekend as overhead line supply would be required to be off between city Thameslink and north of Kentish Town Which would prevent 'normal' trains operating very much " Do able" with correct planning
The clearance is so tight the contact wire just sits in-between the roof mounted warning horns at the lowest wire height area at Kings Cross Disused . 12'6" is gauge restriction for non emu stock .

 

[Fincra5]

They just need a 92 cleared then it opens some interesting ideas

 

[zwk500]

They just need a 92 cleared then it opens some interesting ideas

The Current draw would certainly make for some interesting results in the ECRs.

 

[D365]

The Current draw would certainly make for some interesting results in the ECRs.

Do they have a traction motor cutout facility?

 

[PZ 08895]

A numbers of years ago i travelled through the Thameslink tunnels in both directions on a Network Rail engineering train, top-and-tailed by a pair of Class 73s during the early hours of the morning. From recollection it was operated under diesel power throughout, not just where there is no 3rd rail north of Farringdon.

Whilst going through the tunnels the sound from the 73s was quite impressive inside the train, despite being in air-con MK2F!

 

[90sWereBetter]

To hijack this thread briefly, I'm guessing the same restrictions on diesels apply to the East London line core between Surrey Quays and Dalston?

 

[zwk500]

To hijack this thread briefly, I'm guessing the same restrictions on diesels apply to the East London line core between Surrey Quays and Dalston?

Slightly different, because there's no Overhead wire. Any locos that are cleared require authorisation from TfL/RfL and a Special Traffic Notice issued. No loco is permitted to exceed 25mph, in some places reduced to 10 or even 5mph. There are also a number of locos only permitted up to certain signals (Route Clearance is in Anglia Sectional Appendix). One important difference is that 73s are prohibited from diesel mode.

 

[Sm5]

The thumper railtour wasnt allowed under the canopy at Cannon St or Charing cross two weeks ago, so Thameslink would cause major palpitations for some people.

But otherwise, I would have thought a thumper very gauge friendly for Thameslink.

perhaps it could go southbound, as its mostly downhill except the climb to farringdon ( which is open air), and emerging from city thameslink (which is also openair).

on a side note, I wonder how much is the annual electric bill of Kings Cross Thameslink… lights on for 2 decades, for no reason.
Plenty of closed stations, including on the underground are closed, without lights being on.

 

[zwk500]

The thumper railtour wasnt allowed under the canopy at Cannon St or Charing cross two weeks ago, so Thameslink would cause major palpitations for some people.

But otherwise, I would have thought a thumper very gauge friendly for Thameslink.

Diesels under the canopy is usually an air quality concern due to diesels Idling. Victoria has extractor fans that railtiurs need to make sure are switched on before they go in there.