St Pancras Departure Boards

[edwin_m]

Not to mention all the southbound services...

I guess on that particular day there weren't any.

 

[Haywain]

I guess on that particular day there weren't any.

No, but it would be useful to point out where to find them.

 

[Horizon22]

Southeastern and EMR both use Worldline systems, however the setup is different. EMR use a very early system from NX days.

I don't believe there is an overall manager for the CIS, as each area is managed by each ToC

Indeed a common problem with multi-TOC stations such as terminals. Often times a "lead" operator is given responsibility for managing the station's information, especially if there's local controllers which most major stations will have with the payments and arrangments for the staffing costs done in a byzantine way which is in no way universal and mostly historical!

It is good to see those boards removed at St Pancras though as they really took up a lot of space to not actually say a lot and were not great for readability.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 21 Mar 2023 ==

Fundamentally, the issue with displaying Thameslink trains under the EMR title would be if there are TOC-Specific ticket restrictions (which may well be the case). Otherwise the only important thing is that the labels on the screen match the signage around the station so that passengers know where to head for their respective trains. The 4 groups of platforms are quite a fair distance from each other and the station signage often feels like it's more focused on not ruining the architecture than on actually showing people where to go.

I really don't think it would be hard in the back-end to segregate via TOC. All trains have an operator code.

 

[zwk500]

I really don't think it would be hard in the back-end to segregate via TOC. All trains have an operator code.

It's probably not hard, although it may be a pain to change it now they're running. If they can sort a next fastest train by TOC they can sort the boards by TOC.

 

[Haywain]

Maybe should have emphasised that it's the groupsave/ easyjet tickets now valid on emphasised services.

Now valid on EMR services?

 

[flitwickbeds]

The issue isn't in displaying Thameslink trains under the EMR label - it is displaying under the Thameslink label that there are no Thameslink trains. If that part of the board were to say there are some Thameslink trains, and that these are running from the EMR platforms to stations between St Pancras and Bedford, look under EMR for them, it would be fine.

I wonder if anyone has considered the scenario where low level is open but only for southbound departures, and all northbound is going via the high level platforms? In that case, the Thameslink screen would be full of departures to Brighton/Gatwick/Sutton/Dartford/etc, so no opportunity to display a "refer to EMR board" message for those looking for St Albans/Luton/Bedford.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

I suppose you could categorise into:

SUBURBAN PLATFORMS A&B - Downstairs, access by Domestic Ticket Offices

INTERCITY PLATFORMS 1-4 - Upstairs, access by The Arcade (North end)

KENT COAST PLATFORMS 11-13 - Upstairs, access by station's east exit

 

[flitwickbeds]

I suppose you could categorise into:

SUBURBAN PLATFORMS A&B - Downstairs, access by Domestic Ticket Offices

INTERCITY PLATFORMS 1-4 - Upstairs, access by The Arcade (North end)

KENT COAST PLATFORMS 11-13 - Upstairs, access by station's east exit

But then if you only know the destination, where on the boards are you looking?

 

[Hadders]

Separate departure boards for Domestic and International departures would make far more sense to me. There are only 10 domestic platforms, fewer than somewhere like Waterloo.

 

[ainsworth74]

Looks like they're making progress just grabbed a shot as I was walking past a few minutes ago. Looks like it'll be one of the colour LED types to me, doesn't look like an actual display screen.



(Image shows two large black display panels and space on either side for more to be mounted in coming days)

 

[XAM2175]

Looks like it'll be one of the colour LED types to me, doesn't look like an actual display screen.

Yeah, they're LED matrix panels.

 

[rob365]

The new CIS will look like this, split by TOC, with infographics to show where you need to go in the station, and both 24 hour and 'analogue' digital clocks.

 

[zwk500]

The new CIS will look like this, split by TOC, with infographics to show where you need to go in the station, and both 24 hour and 'analogue' digital clocks.

View attachment 132276

That looks very Smart! I do appreciate that the graphics designer has shown so much faith that they've pre cancelled a couple of trains

 

[rob365]

That looks very Smart! I do appreciate that the graphics designer has shown so much faith that they've pre cancelled a couple of trains

More for the concept of showing what a canx service would look like - SETL aren't going to start running High Speed services via Birmingham New Street either!

 

[Haywain]

SETL aren't going to start running High Speed services via Birmingham New Street either!

But EMR will??

 

[Bletchleyite]

No calling points? That's poor.

All look, no substance?

 

[rob365]

No calling points? That's poor.

All look, no substance?

Calling points run on a ticker below, as demonstrated on the EMR section. It should also be considered that the point of the main CIS is to direct people to the relevent train operator area, where more detailed CIS is displayed... lots and lots of market resarch/engagement undertaken, passenger surveys, etc. It's not like somebody just thought 'that looks nice, that'll do' and then went and ordered it.

 

[Via Bank]

Looks fine to me. Could maybe do with organising the Thameslink departures by direction (and marking all airport trains as "via Gatwick, Luton, etc.") but it's clearly a draft anyway, judging by the non-existent (e.g.) 13B, trains to Birmingham, etc.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Calling points run on a ticker below, as demonstrated on the EMR section.

Could do with those on Thameslink and Southeastern too.

It should also be considered that the point of the main CIS is to direct people to the relevent train operator area, where more detailed CIS is displayed... lots and lots of market resarch/engagement undertaken, passenger surveys, etc. It's not like somebody just thought 'that looks nice, that'll do' and then went and ordered it.

Given that they appear to have done exactly that at Euston (it really isn't fit for purpose at all, and obviously so if they'd asked any frequent user of the station), it's not exactly hard to see why we might think that!

 

[dosxuk]

So what happens when Thameslink operates from the EMR platforms - do they show up in the Thameslink section with EMR platform numbers, or just muddled into the EMR section?

 

[rob365]

Could do with those on Thameslink and Southeastern too.



Given that they appear to have done exactly that at Euston (it really isn't fit for purpose at all, and obviously so if they'd asked any frequent user of the station), it's not exactly hard to see why we might think that!

It's possible to have them and not have them for each TOC.

Agree, the layout at Euston really isn't great, both in in terms of where the CIS has been positioned, and how the information is layed out on the screen!

So what happens when Thameslink operates from the EMR platforms - do they show up in the Thameslink section with EMR platform numbers, or just muddled into the EMR section?

The screens are wholly interchangeable - Thameslink services will show in a Thameslink 'box' stating whichever platform they're running from (generally P1) when not from the sub-surface station. The map also updates to direct customers upstairs.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 4 Apr 2023 ==

Looks fine to me. Could maybe do with organising the Thameslink departures by direction (and marking all airport trains as "via Gatwick, Luton, etc.") but it's clearly a draft anyway, judging by the non-existent (e.g.) 13B, trains to Birmingham, etc.

All of the airport trains will have a little aeroplane graphic next to them, I think it was considered to be universally understood! Pro's and con's to listing out the trains in North/South vs. running time. Likewise you could split out SETL services running via the NKL vs. via AFK. Yes, very much a draft/design image!

 

[Geogregor]

The new CIS will look like this, split by TOC, with infographics to show where you need to go in the station, and both 24 hour and 'analogue' digital clocks.

View attachment 132276

Is it official design?

 

[rob365]

Is it official design?

Yes, this is what the CIS will look like when it is live.

 

[Mike395]

The new CIS will look like this, split by TOC, with infographics to show where you need to go in the station, and both 24 hour and 'analogue' digital clocks.

View attachment 132276

That's a rather smart design and a vast improvement on what was there before (also, love that the classic clock design will be staying from the old boards...)

My only thought is that, particularly on a LED matrix-style display, the Thameslink white on pink might be a bit hard to read? As a colleague pointed out when I showed him the design, it fails WCAG guidelines for web contrast, and LEDs tend to exacerbate contrast issues in my experience. Wonder if having that one as a pink border with column heading white-on-navy might be a better choice.

 

[plugwash]

The new CIS will look like this, split by TOC,

Wonder if it will actually be split by TOC or will claim to be split by TOC but actually be split by area of the station.

 

[zwk500]

Wonder if it will actually be split by TOC or will claim to be split by TOC but actually be split by area of the station.

This post suggests that the Thameslink board will still show TL trains but then point upstairs not down:

The screens are wholly interchangeable - Thameslink services will show in a Thameslink 'box' stating whichever platform they're running from (generally P1) when not from the sub-surface station. The map also updates to direct customers upstairs.

 

[rob365]

Wonder if it will actually be split by TOC or will claim to be split by TOC but actually be split by area of the station.

That's one and the same thing at St Pancras, with the exception of when GTR run from Platforms 1-4.

 

[jon0844]

Gotta say this looks good and being able to dynamically show where the trains go from solves the engineering work issue.

I don't think trains should be further split for north and south on Thameslink, as a tourist may not know which way they need to go. Let that information be shown when you get downstairs.

I also hope this design also allows for better information during disruption for one specific TOC (including when people going south on Thameslink will need to use the tube or buses during engineering).

It's quite the change from what was there before, which proves just how useless and unfit for purpose it was! Fantastic to see that someone had a clear vision of what needed to be done and all the benefits a colour matrix board allows.

I assume they'll be able to tweak the colours for accessibility purposes and perhaps each individual LED can have its brightness adjusted so backgrounds aren't too dominating?

 

[Bald Rick]

Good to see the digital clock running a couple of hours fast

Or is the analogue slow?

Or both?

I think we should be told

 

[swt_passenger]

That thread the other day about changing the time system seems to have had a slight affect already, one Eurostar service to “Lillie”, (an autocorrect presumably) is leaving at 11:70!