Tube line posters - why is the Lizzie the only one with a "line" suffix?

[Bletchleyite]

Something I've noticed that grates a bit.

On the Tube, there are those long posters above the windows showing the line and which lines it interchanges with. Almost all of them say just the line name, e.g. "Circle" or "Northern". But the Lizzie says "Elizabeth Line".

Why the inconsistency? I know it's not technically a Tube line but I don't see why this should mean this is different from everything else.

 

[Dstock7080]

‘Elizabeth Line’ is a different TfL mode; as is ‘Overground’, ‘IFS Cloud Cable car’, ‘DLR’ are all reflected on the diagrams with their respective names

 

[Class15]

‘Elizabeth Line’ is a different TfL mode; as is ‘Overground’, ‘IFS Cloud Cable car’, ‘DLR’ are all reflected on the diagrams with their respective names

But it sort of is a tube line, it runs through central London, the overground etc. is not a good comparison as the Elizabeth line is similar to “Central Line” more than the DLR. For consistency, I agree with @Bletchleyite

 

[BeijingDave]

Yes, they should all carry the suffix or none. I agree with Bletchleyite.

 

[Class15]

Yes, they should all carry the suffix or none. I agree with Bletchleyite.

I totally agree.

 

[zwk500]

But it sort of is a tube line, it runs through central London, the overground etc. is not a good comparison as the Elizabeth line is similar to “Central Line” more than the DLR. For consistency, I agree with @Bletchleyite

It's closest mode is Thameslink, both are more RER style than the tube. The key is labelled 'key to lines' but then the EL has a hollow line and people don't say 'The DLR Line' so arguably including Line is consistent as it's a hybrid service not a full tube line.

 

[Bletchleyite]

‘Elizabeth Line’ is a different TfL mode; as is ‘Overground’, ‘IFS Cloud Cable car’, ‘DLR’ are all reflected on the diagrams with their respective names

I suppose, though my personal line (!) is that it should be known as the Crossrail (mode) Elizabeth line (name), presumably there'll be another line of Crossrail at some point.

 

[zwk500]

I suppose, though my personal line (!) is that it should be known as the Crossrail (mode) Elizabeth line (name), presumably there'll be another line of Crossrail at some point.

Tbh at the rate things are going I'd be surprised if XR2 happens in my working life, and I'm in my late 20s.

 

[BeijingDave]

It's closest mode is Thameslink, both are more RER style than the tube. The key is labelled 'key to lines' but then the EL has a hollow line and people don't say 'The DLR Line' so arguably including Line is consistent as it's a hybrid service not a full tube line.

Aesthetically it just looks rubbish and inconsistent though (the naming on the map, not the hollow tube line).

 

[zwk500]

Aesthetically it just looks rubbish and inconsistent though (the naming on the map, not the hollow tube line).

It is inconsistent though - the Elizabeth line is not a Tube Line, it's a commuter train service that happens to serve central London directly at a Metro frequency. In an ideal world it'd have been called something sensible that didn't use 'Line', like Crossrail, that emphasised the non-tubeness of it (see Thameslink) but we are where we are with sycophantic politicians.

 

[BeijingDave]

I refer you mostly to my point about the cr*pness of it on aesthetic grounds.

 

[zwk500]

I refer you mostly to my point about the cr*pness of it on aesthetic grounds.

Which you could ease by having a separate box for 'Other TFL Services' below the 'Key to Tube Lines'

 

[Parjon]

Crossrail

 

[BeijingDave]

Calling some lines 'Line' on the map and not others would still look rubbish.

Like when the Beijing Subway map, for a brief period, called some stations 'Station' and left it off others.

One can mount various justifications for it, but deep down one knows it's rubbish, and is probably some bureaucrat interfering in the work of a design agency.

 

[Kilopylae]

It feels like passive aggression to me: TfL wanted to have a new mode and Boris Johnson told them that the name of the mode had to be "Elizabeth line". So they are belligerently pretending that it makes sense, from the diagrams discussed in this thread to the announcements which say "Good service on all other London Underground lines, London Overground routes, DLR routes, and Elizabeth line routes". It looks ridiculous because it follows an absurdly rigid application of their logic in a sort of malicious compliance with Boris' demand they rename a mode to Elizabeth line.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It feels like passive aggression to me: TfL wanted to have a new mode and Boris Johnson told them that the name of the mode had to be "Elizabeth line". So they are belligerently pretending that it makes sense, from the diagrams discussed in this thread to the announcements which say "Good service on all other London Underground lines, London Overground routes, DLR routes, and Elizabeth line routes". It looks ridiculous because it follows an absurdly rigid application of their logic in a sort of malicious compliance with Boris' demand they rename a mode to Elizabeth line.

I don't see why it couldn't be the Crossrail Elizabeth Line, leaving room for other Crossrail lines later.

 

[Kilopylae]

I don't see why it couldn't be the Crossrail Elizabeth Line, leaving room for other Crossrail lines later.

It wouldn't shock me if TfL ends up referring to the existing route and Crossrail 2 together as "Elizabeth line". With unintelligible announcements like "The Elizabeth line has severe delays between Chelsea and Hackney. Good service on other Elizabeth line routes."

 

[jon81uk]

It feels like passive aggression to me: TfL wanted to have a new mode and Boris Johnson told them that the name of the mode had to be "Elizabeth line". So they are belligerently pretending that it makes sense, from the diagrams discussed in this thread to the announcements which say "Good service on all other London Underground lines, London Overground routes, DLR routes, and Elizabeth line routes". It looks ridiculous because it follows an absurdly rigid application of their logic in a sort of malicious compliance with Boris' demand they rename a mode to Elizabeth line.

Yep its Boris' fault for trying to shove a name in that doesn't work.

 

[Meerkat]

Because its new? And maybe because the applicable Elizabeth was alive?
'The Elizabeth' sounds a bit odd, but might become normal later on with familiarity, and 'jumping on the Elizabeth' sounds downright treasonous!

 

[ThameslinkUser]

Has this question not been debated to death since the original renaming?

 

[BeijingDave]

If only there was some precedent of another monarch having a line named after her, so we could put this to bed...

 

[DynamicSpirit]

Because its new? And maybe because the applicable Elizabeth was alive?
'The Elizabeth' sounds a bit odd, but might become normal later on with familiarity, and 'jumping on the Elizabeth' sounds downright treasonous!

I think this is the correct answer. In English, Elizabeth is a girl's name, and that's pretty much the only sense in which anyone normally uses the word. Not only that but, as you say, when the Elizabeth line opened, Queen Elizabeth II was still our reigning monarch. For both of those reasons, having 'Elizabeth' as a label on the interchange diagrams and other maps would have looked decidedly odd. So I would imagine someone at TfL decided pragmatically that the inconsistency of 'Northern', 'Central', etc. vs. 'Elizabeth Line' was the lesser of two evils.

(Yes I know you could argue that Victoria is also a girl's name and we accept 'Victoria' as a label on tube maps. But Victoria is also well known as the name of several places, and its usage for the tube line is long established. I'm not sure how the Victoria line was labelled when it was first opened, but it was many decades after Queen Victoria's death, which I'm sure would have made the word less personal then than 'Elizabeth' is today).

 

[Class15]

Just put it as “Elizabeth” not “Elizabeth line”. Simple as that.

Also, someone needs to change the northern line announcement at Tottenham Court Road to “Central and Elizabeth lines” which sounds so much better than “Central line and the Elizabeth line”

 

[jon81uk]

Just put it as “Elizabeth” not “Elizabeth line”. Simple as that.

Also, someone needs to change the northern line announcement at Tottenham Court Road to “Central and Elizabeth lines” which sounds so much better than “Central line and the Elizabeth line”

The issue is the central line is one of the tube lines and the Elizabeth line isn't. So its like at other stations where you might get "change for the northern line and the DLR" instead of "change for the northern and DLR lines". "Elizabeth Line" is the name of the service. Whereas for others it is the Northern line of the Underground service.

 

[185143]

Putting aside my thoughts on the name, I *really* hate the way the announcements refer to interchanges.

"Change for Central, Northern"

 

[AM9]

Only on RUK could there be a thread debating such an obscure issue. Regular travellers will call it the 'Lizzie' or something similar, non-english speaking visitors will call it whatever TfL puts on signage.

 

[Class15]

The issue is the central line is one of the tube lines and the Elizabeth line isn't. So its like at other stations where you might get "change for the northern line and the DLR" instead of "change for the northern and DLR lines". "Elizabeth Line" is the name of the service. Whereas for others it is the Northern line of the Underground service.

Why is it another service? It is a line, run by TfL (unlike Thameslink) that goes through central London. It should be a tube line.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Why is it another service? It is a line, run by TfL (unlike Thameslink) that goes through central London. It should be a tube line.

It should really be under Overground, which is London's S-Bahn/RER.

"But that doesn't go to central London" => The Chingford line does.
"But that doesn't go underground across London" => The East London Line does.

Or it could have been called the Thameslink Elizabeth Line, I suppose, with t'other one getting another name.

Continued here: https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/alternative-naming-designation-for-the-elizabeth-line.246306/

 

[BeijingDave]

Looking forward to Shenfield nonsensically and annoyingly being labelled Shenfield Station Stop on future tube maps.

 

[PGAT]

1) It's NOT a tube line, and it would be demeaning to label it as such

2) Elizabeth on its own just looks quite weird