SWR outgoing Metro fleet withdrawals (complete)

[swr444]

U.5721 went down to Bournemouth Depot on 5B39, I take it from what you've said, that stayed at Bournemouth ?

Nope. 455904 has come back home to Wimbledon park with 5721 helping I presume as they came up together

 

[444045]

Nope. 455904 has come back home to Wimbledon park with 5721 helping I presume as they came up together

Thanks for the update.......

 

[Siemens Staines]

455904 16/11/22

455904 has returned to passenger service today (20/03/23) on 2M03 0609 Wimbledon to Chessington South

 

[WarrenTManager]

458513 is now waiting a main line test run.

 

[boiledbeans2]

455729 was back in passenger service on Sunday 29/01/23.

Just had a recent ride on 5729. Very loud motors!
But it seems half the lighting has failed in the entire unit (half the lights were off in each carriage). The other 455 coupled to 5729 had normal lighting.

 

[TEW]

There's some changes to 707 diagrams from next Monday to better allocate 10 car services to the busiest trains which will see 707s running on a few more routes to now.
The 0641/ 0841/ 1041/ 1241 Shepperton to Waterloo and 0742/ 0942/ 1142 Waterloo to Shepperton will be worked by 8-455 with the 10-707 instead working:
2D90 0618 Epsom-Waterloo
2J09 0706 Waterloo-Hampton Court
2J16 0753 Hampton Court-Waterloo
2D15 0854 Waterloo-Guildford
2D28 1045 Guildford-Waterloo
2J29 1206 Waterloo-Hampton Court
2J36 1254 Hampton Court-Waterloo

In the evening the 1743 Waterloo-Shepperton via Richmond, then 1836/ 2041/ 2241 Waterloo-Shepperton and 1942/ 2142 Waterloo-Shepperton will become 8-455 instead of 10-707.

10-707 will be used of 8-450 on:
2V45 1607 Waterloo-Waterloo via Brentford then Richmond
2C55 1750 Waterloo-Reading
2C66 1939 Reading-Waterloo

10-707 will be used instead of 8-455 on:
2O63 2030 Waterloo-Waterloo via Richmond then Wimbledon
2K67 2157 Waterloo-Waterloo via Wimbledon then Richmond

8-455 will be used instead of 8-450 on:
2C69 2120 Waterloo-Reading
2C80 2309 Reading-Waterloo

 

[Goldfish62]

There's some changes to 707 diagrams from next Monday to better allocate 10 car services to the busiest trains which will see 707s running on a few more routes to now.
The 0641/ 0841/ 1041/ 1241 Shepperton to Waterloo and 0742/ 0942/ 1142 Waterloo to Shepperton will be worked by 8-455 with the 10-707 instead working:
2D90 0618 Epsom-Waterloo
2J09 0706 Waterloo-Hampton Court
2J16 0753 Hampton Court-Waterloo
2D15 0854 Waterloo-Guildford
2D28 1045 Guildford-Waterloo
2J29 1206 Waterloo-Hampton Court
2J36 1254 Hampton Court-Waterloo

In the evening the 1743 Waterloo-Shepperton via Richmond, then 1836/ 2041/ 2241 Waterloo-Shepperton and 1942/ 2142 Waterloo-Shepperton will become 8-455 instead of 10-707.

10-707 will be used of 8-450 on:
2V45 1607 Waterloo-Waterloo via Brentford then Richmond
2C55 1750 Waterloo-Reading
2C66 1939 Reading-Waterloo

10-707 will be used instead of 8-455 on:
2O63 2030 Waterloo-Waterloo via Richmond then Wimbledon
2K67 2157 Waterloo-Waterloo via Wimbledon then Richmond

8-455 will be used instead of 8-450 on:
2C69 2120 Waterloo-Reading
2C80 2309 Reading-Waterloo

Thanks for the update.

2120 to Reading one to avoid then!

 

[43096]

10-707 will be used of 8-450 on:
2V45 1607 Waterloo-Waterloo via Brentford then Richmond
2C55 1750 Waterloo-Reading
2C66 1939 Reading-Waterloo

Good, but seems a bit odd not to use 458s. Or is this a way of getting Reading line passengers used to ironing board seats for when/if 701s start service?

It’s also something of a sticking plaster solution: better would be to bring back the 1735 which always acted as a relief to the 1750. There’s various other bits of weird diagramming such as 1713 Aldershot via Ascot being 10-458 (and 40% full when I last used it) whereas the 1720 is 8-450 and wedged.

 

[TEW]

Good, but seems a bit odd not to use 458s. Or is this a way of getting Reading line passengers used to ironing board seats for when/if 701s start service?

It seems to be a relatively minor diagram change so it may not have been possible to manage to swap things round so easily to get 458s on it instead of 707s. There are a lot of crew who no longer sign 707s too so they have to be quite carefully diagrammed now.

 

[swr444]

There will also be a 10-458 on the Kingston rounders again post AM peak, I believe the set is one that is used on the 2Uxx during the AM peak.

 

[Phil R]

There's some changes to 707 diagrams from next Monday to better allocate 10 car services to the busiest trains which will see 707s running on a few more routes to now.
The 0641/ 0841/ 1041/ 1241 Shepperton to Waterloo and 0742/ 0942/ 1142 Waterloo to Shepperton will be worked by 8-455 with the 10-707 instead working:
2D90 0618 Epsom-Waterloo
2J09 0706 Waterloo-Hampton Court
2J16 0753 Hampton Court-Waterloo
2D15 0854 Waterloo-Guildford
2D28 1045 Guildford-Waterloo
2J29 1206 Waterloo-Hampton Court
2J36 1254 Hampton Court-Waterloo

In the evening the 1743 Waterloo-Shepperton via Richmond, then 1836/ 2041/ 2241 Waterloo-Shepperton and 1942/ 2142 Waterloo-Shepperton will become 8-455 instead of 10-707.

10-707 will be used of 8-450 on:
2V45 1607 Waterloo-Waterloo via Brentford then Richmond
2C55 1750 Waterloo-Reading
2C66 1939 Reading-Waterloo

10-707 will be used instead of 8-455 on:
2O63 2030 Waterloo-Waterloo via Richmond then Wimbledon
2K67 2157 Waterloo-Waterloo via Wimbledon then Richmond

8-455 will be used instead of 8-450 on:
2C69 2120 Waterloo-Reading
2C80 2309 Reading-Waterloo

That's a bit interesting. Have 707s ever had any previous booked work to Guildford? Only ever seen one there once before, one evening about 3-4 years ago (and I think it was going back empty iirc).

 

[Big Jumby 74]

That's a bit interesting. Have 707s ever had any previous booked work to Guildford?

To understand that, one has to understand the overall 'timeline' history of their introduction (including the years of planning that went in to that before they hit the rails real time), the major problem being that Waterloo platforms 1 to 4 were the last platforms on the network to be extended to accommodate 10 cars. The original draft diagrams for 707's, produced long before they entered service, kept them to the Windsor side diagrams, where platforms (on that side at Waterloo) could accommodate them. Any trains formed of either 10-458 or 10-707 prior to the Waterloo rebuild of 2017 could not use the main suburban platforms (at Waterloo), and so any such formations on the main side had to be kept to a bare minimum, as they would need to be diagrammed in to platform 5 or higher, which would conflict with Main Line services. Some here may remember that certain main suburban services in those days were given 9xxx train ID numbers - this was designed to identify 10 car trains on the main side, that the signallers needed to direct away from plats 1-4.

Having said all that, one circuit of 707's (two individual unit diagrams running as one 10 car) as part of those draft diagrams, was booked to work (SX) 2D55, 1839 Waterloo to Guildford via Leatherhead, and return on 2G66, 2007 Guildford to Waterloo via Cobham. If this did actually take place once they started to hit the rails, I have no idea, but that was (part of) the original plan.

I am sure that under the more recent umbrella of 'SWR' they may well have been diagrammed down that way and elsewhere (as TEW mentions), no reason why not infrastructure wise, the only limiting factor (potentially) being crew knowledge (ie 707 traction) in relation to stock diagrams (ie routes).

 

[swr444]

458513 is now waiting a main line test run.

I saw it just now coming out of one of the sheds, is it off for the test run today?

 

[TEW]

That's a bit interesting. Have 707s ever had any previous booked work to Guildford? Only ever seen one there once before, one evening about 3-4 years ago (and I think it was going back empty iirc).

They have had a few booked diagrams to Guildford but only ever a handful of services and nothing for a few years in the LTP diagrams now.

 

[Andy1673]

There will also be a 10-458 on the Kingston rounders again post AM peak, I believe the set is one that is used on the 2Uxx during the AM peak.

Seems it will be 2U16 Windsor 07:53 to Waterloo then forms 2O17 Waterloo 09:00 to Waterloo (whole diagram starts as 5H89 off Strawberry Hill and ends as 5Y39 to Clapham Yard). Also some 450s diagram will be changed too.

 

[Phil R]

To understand that, one has to understand the overall 'timeline' history of their introduction (including the years of planning that went in to that before they hit the rails real time), the major problem being that Waterloo platforms 1 to 4 were the last platforms on the network to be extended to accommodate 10 cars. The original draft diagrams for 707's, produced long before they entered service, kept them to the Windsor side diagrams, where platforms (on that side at Waterloo) could accommodate them. Any trains formed of either 10-458 or 10-707 prior to the Waterloo rebuild of 2017 could not use the main suburban platforms (at Waterloo), and so any such formations on the main side had to be kept to a bare minimum, as they would need to be diagrammed in to platform 5 or higher, which would conflict with Main Line services. Some here may remember that certain main suburban services in those days were given 9xxx train ID numbers - this was designed to identify 10 car trains on the main side, that the signallers needed to direct away from plats 1-4.

Having said all that, one circuit of 707's (two individual unit diagrams running as one 10 car) as part of those draft diagrams, was booked to work (SX) 2D55, 1839 Waterloo to Guildford via Leatherhead, and return on 2G66, 2007 Guildford to Waterloo via Cobham. If this did actually take place once they started to hit the rails, I have no idea, but that was (part of) the original plan.

I am sure that under the more recent umbrella of 'SWR' they may well have been diagrammed down that way and elsewhere (as TEW mentions), no reason why not infrastructure wise, the only limiting factor (potentially) being crew knowledge (ie 707 traction) in relation to stock diagrams (ie routes).

They have had a few booked diagrams to Guildford but only ever a handful of services and nothing for a few years in the LTP diagrams now.

Thanks both. Yes I realise it would necessarily be a post P1-4 to 10 car thing and that crew knowledge may be a limiting factor. 1839 in / 2007 out feels like the right sort of time that I would have been about, if that was the same era.

Maybe one day I should go in to work a bit late on that for the novelty factor. Get them in while I can etc. etc.

 

[Andy1673]

According to the Today`s Railways UK issue 199 July 2018 one pair of the 707s was booked for then Waterloo-Hampton Court-Waterloo-Chessington South-Waterloo-Guildford via Epsom-Guildford via Comham-Waterloo curcuit amongst the other 15 455 or 455+456 formations. That was a only service booked for the 707s out of Windsor line (and of probably Shepperton).

 

[Phil R]

According to the Today`s Railways UK issue 199 July 2018 one pair of the 707s was booked for then Waterloo-Hampton Court-Waterloo-Chessington South-Waterloo-Guildford via Epsom-Guildford via Comham-Waterloo curcuit amongst the other 15 455 or 455+456 formations. That was a only service booked for the 707s out of Windsor line (and of probably Shepperton).

Sounds about right. Cheers.

 

[TEW]

According to the Today`s Railways UK issue 199 July 2018 one pair of the 707s was booked for then Waterloo-Hampton Court-Waterloo-Chessington South-Waterloo-Guildford via Epsom-Guildford via Comham-Waterloo curcuit amongst the other 15 455 or 455+456 formations. That was a only service booked for the 707s out of Windsor line (and of probably Shepperton).

Back then the 707s were not that common to Shepperton, mainly appearing on the peak time services via Richmond, but there were a few diagrammed on Kingston Rounders all day.

 

[Big Jumby 74]

According to the Today`s Railways UK issue 199 July 2018 one pair of the 707s was booked for then Waterloo-Hampton Court-Waterloo-Chessington South-Waterloo-Guildford via Epsom-Guildford via Comham-Waterloo curcuit amongst the other 15 455 or 455+456 formations. That was a only service booked for the 707s out of Windsor line (and of probably Shepperton).

Just for completeness, the main suburban part of the diagram referred to up thread was planned thus:

2J17, 0906 Waterloo to Hampton Court
2J24, 0954 Hampton Court to Waterloo
2D23, 1039 Waterloo to Guildford vla L
2G34, 1207 Guildford to Waterloo via C
2M33, 1316 Waterloo to Chessington
2M40, 1409 Chessington to Waterloo
1D39, 1454 Waterloo to Dorking
1D48, 1604 Dorking to Waterloo
2J49, 1706 Waterloo to Hampton Court
2J56, 1754 Hampton Court to Waterloo
2D55, 1839 Waterloo to Guildford via L
2G66, 2007 Guildford to Waterloo via C

A second pair (one diagram) were also planned for the some work on the main sub side;

2D93, 1800 Waterloo to Epsom
5D94, 18+40 Epsom to Waterloo
1D57, 1924 Waterloo to Dorking
1D66, 2034 Dorking to Waterloo
1J67, 2136 Waterloo to Hampton Court
1J74, 2224 Hampton Court to Surbiton
2J69, 2239 Surbiton to Hampton Court
2J76, 2254 Hampton Court to Waterloo

But again, no idea if this actually happened when the time came?

 

[Siemens Staines]

458513 23/04/22

458513 is now waiting a main line test run.

After 11 months out of service, 458513 is back in passenger service today (28/03) on 2C07 0550 London Waterloo to Reading

 

[TEW]

But again, no idea if this actually happened when the time came?

Yes, they did both happen. I think it was the May 2019 timetable change those diagrams ended.

 

[Big Jumby 74]

The whole thing was a moving/changing beast during the planning. I have a set of draft 707 diagrams dating from 2013 which differ again, albeit they weren't known as '707' that early on!

 

[Siemens Staines]

455860 14/01/23

455860 is back in passenger service today (29/03) on 2H89 0645 London Waterloo to Shepperton

 

[WarrenTManager]

5853 was back in traffic ex-C4 on the 27th.

 

[Siemens Staines]

Saturday was 01/04/23, so it is time for me to post an update of the list of 458 & 455 that I have not recorded working in passenger service for over a month. The dates below are the last date that I have noticed them appear on a passenger train on RTT. This date is not guaranteed to be 100% accurate.

458506 09/11/22
458509 27/03/22 (one year anniversary)
458533 28/01/22

List excludes Off-lease 458505,507,517

455719 14/01/23
455722 06/12/22
455724 04/02/23
455849 04/02/23
455850 27/06/22
455870 15/12/22
455902 15/12/22
455905 04/07/22
455915 23/10/22

List excludes Scrapped 455704,726,736,740,847,855,907,918

I notice that the new Hampton Court/Guildford 707 diagram (#1356) is 458504 + 458530 today.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

I notice that the new Hampton Court/Guildford 707 diagram (#1356) is 458504 + 458530 today.

Confirmed as sticking to diagram; here's a picture I got at Epsom this morning.

458 504 is at the London end



Edited before I get swamped with DMs: Just to say I leave my camera set on GMT all the year round; the working is the 08.54 Waterloo - Guildford seen at Epsom at 09.28.

 

[Goldfish62]

Saturday was 01/04/23, so it is time for me to post an update of the list of 458 & 455 that I have not recorded working in passenger service for over a month. The dates below are the last date that I have noticed them appear on a passenger train on RTT. This date is not guaranteed to be 100% accurate.

458506 09/11/22
458509 27/03/22 (one year anniversary)
458533 28/01/22

List excludes Off-lease 458505,507,517

455719 14/01/23
455722 06/12/22
455724 04/02/23
455849 04/02/23
455850 27/06/22
455870 15/12/22
455902 15/12/22
455905 04/07/22
455915 23/10/22

List excludes Scrapped 455704,726,736,740,847,855,907,918

I notice that the new Hampton Court/Guildford 707 diagram (#1356) is 458504 + 458530 today.

Thanks for the update.

 

[444045]

Saturday was 01/04/23, so it is time for me to post an update of the list of 458 & 455 that I have not recorded working in passenger service for over a month. The dates below are the last date that I have noticed them appear on a passenger train on RTT. This date is not guaranteed to be 100% accurate.

458506 09/11/22
458509 27/03/22 (one year anniversary)
458533 28/01/22

List excludes Off-lease 458505,507,517

455719 14/01/23
455722 06/12/22
455724 04/02/23
455849 04/02/23
455850 27/06/22
455870 15/12/22
455902 15/12/22
455905 04/07/22
455915 23/10/22

List excludes Scrapped 455704,726,736,740,847,855,907,918

I notice that the new Hampton Court/Guildford 707 diagram (#1356) is 458504 + 458530 today.

Thanks for the update, it is much appreciated.

 

[WarrenTManager]

Saturday was 01/04/23, so it is time for me to post an update of the list of 458 & 455 that I have not recorded working in passenger service for over a month. The dates below are the last date that I have noticed them appear on a passenger train on RTT. This date is not guaranteed to be 100% accurate.

458506 09/11/22
458509 27/03/22 (one year anniversary)
458533 28/01/22

List excludes Off-lease 458505,507,517

455719 14/01/23
455722 06/12/22
455724 04/02/23
455849 04/02/23
455850 27/06/22
455870 15/12/22
455902 15/12/22
455905 04/07/22
455915 23/10/22

List excludes Scrapped 455704,726,736,740,847,855,907,918

I notice that the new Hampton Court/Guildford 707 diagram (#1356) is 458504 + 458530 today.

A pair of 707s were sidelined after a fatality hence the substitution of 458s.

5722 should have had a depot test run today.