Indeed. It’s mostly staff and, I’d imagine, quite a few RailUK Forums members!
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How often are quiet coaches actually quiet?
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Indeed. It’s mostly staff and, I’d imagine, quite a few RailUK Forums members!
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Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
Commuters seem to have wised up to it if a recent journey down to Brighton is anything to go by, though to be honest now the bases of the Fainsa Sophias have inevitably collapsed I find Standard priority seats more comfortable so I don't go in there any more.
A little over five years into their service lives, just as many of us predicted would happen, the drab grey interiors of the 700s are looking fairly grim to say the least. The toilets are an absolute disgrace, many have been tagged, and there appears to be a disgusting tendency for people to smear snot onto the seat backs.
Apologies, it’s a little off topic, but I was on a particularly egregious example a couple of hours ago.
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Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
I think the problem there is the people who live on the innersuburban parts of the Thameslink route. It could be reduced by doing stuff like vinylling scenery in the toilets, but it's not really the fault of the 700's admittedly slightly bland (blue, not grey) interior. The state of the Southeastern innersuburban Networkers is similar, because it's the same people making a mess of those.
Basher
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I travel regularly on LNER, I like to sit in coach M , this coach can not claim to be an quite coach as you can hear the catering staff and equipment making a noise. As far as I am aware LNER do not have any designated quite coaches on the 800s .
Off topic - but SouthEastern have Vinyled the interior of the toilets on the 375's and this seems to work quite well at deterring graffiti. Even the toilets on the 465's are in a better state than the 700's - the 700's are all tagged, and the graffiti is never properly cleaned off. I've now also noticed window etching creeping in on the 700's; but so far, not SE. I wonder if Thameslink clean and repair the 700s less, than SE do the 375s and 465s?
On topic - the increasing lack of manners even on Avanti really puts me off travelling by train now. Was going to see a friend in Manchester last Saturday for a late lunch day trip, but the idea of 2hrs 30 on the the inevitably packed and noisy train each way, combined with warnings of signal failures around Crewe meant I abandoned the journey from London - just didn't want to risk it anymore as I don't trust the train now. Just not worth it for a few hours in the pub.
bramling
Veteran Member
It really is beyond time that government embarked upon a “properly back to 2019” campaign.
If what we have now is the “new normal” then it’s certainly not an improvement.
This is another thing I hold Johnson partly responsible for, his weak leadership failed to do this, when there were numerous opportunities to do so. Indeed it was kind of started a couple of times then he bottled it.
Poor behaviour in public spaces is but a symptom of all this.
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I don’t know, I find it might as well be the chav carriage, now that enough “normals” are aware of the whole thing. Especially at weekends.
Warrior2852
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They do, I was sitting in one when I started this thread 158 posts ago!
Bristol LHS
Member
Agree. It‘s also annoying that it’s Coach H, 5 coaches into a 9 coach train. Was much better on the class 91s/mark IVs, when it was Coach B, right at the front end - so no passengers walking through to and from the buffet, fewer people ending up in there by mistake.
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You’re both right - there’s a quiet coach on 9 coach LNER Azumas, but not on 5 or 10 coach trains
Coach H for hush is the quiet coach, as the train manager on my most recent trip announced, along with coach G for grub hosting the café and other assorted nonsense.
I think this may be true only on 9-coach trains.
trainophile
Established Member
Got told off today by a rather pompous middle aged gentleman in coach A on a GWR. Was travelling back from Paignton with my London friend who I only see about once a year, after a lovely few days break, and we were just chatting, not shrieking, giggling or even talking particularly loudly. He came to us from two rows of seats in front of us and told us he could hear us talking, and didn't we know it's the quiet coach. I was all set to point out that it's not the 'silent' coach, and generally applies to electronic equipment and phones, not normal conversations, but my much more diplomatic friend said "oh we're sorry" and nudged me not to make a big deal of it. I was still annoyed though. I did give him a look as I got off at Taunton.
A young couple got on at the next station after this incident and sat two rows in the other direction from him, and were literally just almost whispering to eachother, and he stuck his head over the back of the seat and told them off too. They looked incredulous. They got off at Taunton too and could hardly contain their giggles as we waited for the doors to release. It really was an absurd reaction on his part. I bet he's great fun at parties!
I didn't think it was forbidden to have a normal level of conversation in a quiet coach. Some people obviously see it differently though.
A young couple got on at the next station after this incident and sat two rows in the other direction from him, and were literally just almost whispering to eachother, and he stuck his head over the back of the seat and told them off too. They looked incredulous. They got off at Taunton too and could hardly contain their giggles as we waited for the doors to release. It really was an absurd reaction on his part. I bet he's great fun at parties!
I didn't think it was forbidden to have a normal level of conversation in a quiet coach. Some people obviously see it differently though.
156421
On Moderation
Might as well carry parcels as well why not
Deepgreen
Established Member
I don't think I would notice the difference!
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A friend and I were travelling through Switzerland about ten years ago and were talking quietly. We were asked to cease as it was a quiet coach. It's a very hard thing to police/enforce as different people find different things annoying. For no logical reason I find people talking on a phone more irritating than if they were doing it face-to-face, and I'm only hearing half the noise! To expect people not to talk quietly to each other is unrealistic, I think, but much of the problem is the very poor signing of the relevant zones and knowledge/display of the rules.
trainophile
Established Member
It's paywalled. But I find I don't mind phone conversations at all if they are obviously making arrangements or something like that. There was a chap today (not in the quiet coach!) telling his friend he'd phone him from the next station as he didn't know his connection time. Not a problem with that at all. It's the inane trivia that goes on for half an hour and is about nothing of any importance that gets my goat.
Flying Snail
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And I'm guessing that the inane trivia of no importance you and your friend were blathering for the entire journey was not enjoyable to that gent or anyone else in earshot wishing to complete their journey in peace either.
I really don't know where some people have got this idea that only device based noise is not wanted in the quiet coach/zones, noise is noise and by definition it is NOT quiet and that absolutely includes having a natter with your mates.
You weren't chained to the seats, you could easily have moved to another carriage to have your chat.
trainophile
Established Member
That's a bit rude. We were actually talking about the prospects of a replacement knee operation as my friend has been in some pain for a while and it has been suggested. And at what level does quiet conversation become unacceptable noise, given it isn't a Silent Coach?
D1537
Established Member
On Saturday last, I decided to have a trip on some 91s before their demise. On IC225s the quiet coach is B, next to the locomotive. All four trains I was on were completely silent, because there were <5 passengers on every single one.
trainophile
Established Member
Because that's what it says on the notices?
Flying Snail
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Frankly I don't care what the topic is, the point of the small part of the train assigned as quiet is so that people who want a quiet environment can spend their journey not being forced to listen to your or anyone else's noise.
Do you not think it is more than a little rude not to mention selfish to expect strangers to sit for an extended period listening to your <whatever> as if they are an audience in your amateur dramatic recital?
The majority of the train is not designated Quiet so is it really such an unreasonable ask to use that for your conversation?
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bramling
Veteran Member
It's one of those things where the "we were only having a quiet / important conversation" is okay, until *everyone* does it, then it certainly wouldn't be a quiet carriage any more. It sounds like the guy was OTT, but equally presumably you could have chosen to sit elsewhere and have the conversation?
A mate and I had the same experience in Denmark. It was made clear to us that "quiet" meant "silent". But I didn't think this was the case in Britain. Someone mentioned libraries - when I was a kid absolute silence was the rule otherwise an official in a uniform would throw you out! I suppose it's all about showing consideration to others.
bramling
Veteran Member
The problem is that our quiet carriages don't really define what is expected, which is asking for trouble. But personally I don't see why it should be such a problem expecting people to essentially remain silent.
I remember many years ago being in a Quiet Coach on c2c. It was so noisy, with uncontrolled children and also young gentlemen practising their rapping, that I went to a normal coach for some peace and quiet!
I can imagine it’s absolutely impossible for a c2c service to have a quiet coach, so do they still have these?
I think quiet coaches are pointless in the UK. For whatever reason, they’ve only been effective when I’ve experienced them on the continent.
All coaches should be the same, but there really needs to be more enforcement of ridiculous noise. But it’s clear that confronting some of the delightful characters we have to share trains with, it could end with arguments or much worse.
I can imagine it’s absolutely impossible for a c2c service to have a quiet coach, so do they still have these?
I think quiet coaches are pointless in the UK. For whatever reason, they’ve only been effective when I’ve experienced them on the continent.
All coaches should be the same, but there really needs to be more enforcement of ridiculous noise. But it’s clear that confronting some of the delightful characters we have to share trains with, it could end with arguments or much worse.
Jim the Jim
Member
I feel the main point of quiet coaches in the UK was to stop people having loud phone conversations, and that is no longer such a problem as today's phones allow you to speak at a normal volume and still be heard at the other end. Music and video played out loud is a problem but that shouldn't be allowed anywhere on the train! That said there is still an argument for something closer to the "silent" coaches found on the continent.
Quiet coaches are good in that you can more legitimately tell people making long phone calls, or playing TikTok videos without headphones to be quiet. I also think that extended loud conversations should be avoided - and whilst you may think you’re talking quietly, you may actually be quite loud. I for one have a loud voice naturally, so when I’m in the quiet coach, I speak in library like whispers to any seat mates. I think a few words are fine but if you want to have an extended conversation, then you should sit elsewhere if possible.
YorksLad12
Established Member
I had a similar conversation with CrossCountry on witter on this yesterday. The bloke boarding behind me was on his phone as he walked almost the whole length of Coach G, while two sets of passengers were having conversations. "Quiet" is relative; get rid of them, it saves any nastiness. Or, move them closer to First Class, where they might get policed (such as the half-coach on the IET sets LNER has).
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