Progress on Avanti West Coast's 805/807s Hitachi AT300 sets

[LNW-GW Joint]

I think they could be in service quicker than other new trains as it is effectively a version of a train already in service with GWR, LNER and TPE.

And the first two 805s have run under their own power, in normal traffic, between Wolverhampton and Glasgow.
But the railway often finds reasons not to put new trains in service.

 

[800001]

And the first two 805s have run under their own power, in normal traffic, between Wolverhampton and Glasgow.
But the railway often finds reasons not to put new trains in service.

But one has gone back to Dalby as it’s got engine issues.

 

[The Chimaera]

As yet no AWC staff are trained on the type so I wouldn’t be expecting them in passenger service any time soon.

 

[800001]

As yet no AWC staff are trained on the type so I wouldn’t be expecting them in passenger service any time soon.

Because they have not been handed over to Avanti yet, they are still under going testing on behalf on Hitachi, crewed by either GBRF or Freightliner drivers.

 

[Peter Sarf]

Todays Regulatory announcement about Avanti West Coast contains following statement


As Financial Regulatory statements are checked for accuracy, (so always better than Press office statements) it appears to be confirmation that trains (multiple) will be replacing voyagers before end of 2023

West Coast Partnership Contract Extension

I could read the statement as saying one more more Voyagers will be replaced by the start of 2023. But, since 2023 has started, I will assume by the end of 2023 but only one or more Voyagers.

It says "from 2023". One set running one service before the end of the year would seem to comply.

You immediately reminded me of TPEs grand effort to fulfil a franchise commitment they had. Was it not one train on one day for one service in the end !. To me TPE and to a lesser extent Avanti are in the same club - Still there for want of a bigger OLR.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 20 Mar 2023 ==

And the first two 805s have run under their own power, in normal traffic, between Wolverhampton and Glasgow.
But the railway often finds reasons not to put new trains in service.

I would not say normal traffic. I thought it was test runs and not by Avanti drivers.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

I would not say normal traffic. I thought it was test runs and not by Avanti drivers.

Yes, but if they ran normally it means that physical and electrical clearance must have been given for the route (which must mean the whole WCML really).
If they ran under possession it would be less promising.

 

[Boodiggy]

Yes, but if they ran normally it means that physical and electrical clearance must have been given for the route (which must mean the whole WCML really).
If they ran under possession it would be less promising.

They did run in traffic. Wouldn’t get a possession between Wolves and Glasgow for a start and it wasn’t a protected path. There were both day and night runs in normal traffic.
And of course the train would be fully cleared. There is a misunderstanding around gauge clearance that a train is sent along in the hope it will not hit anything… the reality is very different.
It seems some people have also been confused that as the new MU speed profile only goes as far north as Weaver the trains wouldn’t go beyond there.

 

[Skie]

And of course the train would be fully cleared. There is a misunderstanding around gauge clearance that a train is sent along in the hope it will not hit anything… the reality is very different.

This has always amused me, do people think they run a polystyrene train around and look at what survives at the end of the run for gauging work?

 

[Boodiggy]

This has always amused me, do people think they run a polystyrene train around and look at what survives at the end of the run for gauging work?

Haha!

 

[Bald Rick]

This has always amused me, do people think they run a polystyrene train around and look at what survives at the end of the run for gauging work?

That is, actually, done sometimes…

 

[Efini92]

There is a misunderstanding around gauge clearance that a train is sent along in the hope it will not hit anything… the reality is very different.

Unless it’s a GBRF train.

It seems some people have also been confused that as the new MU speed profile only goes as far north as Weaver the trains wouldn’t go beyond there.

They’ll go as far north as Blackpool in theory.

 

[Skie]

That is, actually, done sometimes…

A few blocks != entire train. But yes

 

[pokemonsuper9]

They’ll go as far north as Blackpool in theory.

I wouldn't be suprised if they occasionally go further north like the voyagers seem to randomly do.
Although 807s on Liverpool services should prevent that by freeing up 390s

 

[Efini92]

I wouldn't be suprised if they occasionally go further north like the voyagers seem to randomly do.
Although 807s on Liverpool services should prevent that by freeing up 390s

From what I understand no traincrew that signs north of Preston will be training them.
I suspect if Crewe depot doesn’t materialise then Preston will end up training them for the Blackpool services. Then we might see them in scotland.

 

[YourMum666]

From what I understand no traincrew that signs north of Preston will be training them.
I suspect if Crewe depot doesn’t materialise then Preston will end up training them for the Blackpool services. Then we might see them in scotland.

at some point, they’ll end up running north of preston but not with EPS

 

[Efini92]

at some point, they’ll end up running north of preston but not with EPS

How though if the train crew that sign north of Preston won’t be learning them?
They were never intended to run at eps speeds.

 

[YourMum666]

How though if the train crew that sign north of Preston won’t be learning them?
They were never intended to run at eps speeds.

wait but they were being tested north of preston surely there is a chance they might get signed by the guys up at preston

 

[800001]

wait but they were being tested north of preston surely there is a chance they might get signed by the guys up at preston

They are being tested there as there will be paths available for this.
The testing trains are crewed by either GBRF or Freightliner drivers.

 

[Snow1964]

This has always amused me, do people think they run a polystyrene train around and look at what survives at the end of the run for gauging work?

There is a photo of this being done on a class 317 on the widened lines to Moorgate, when the line first reopened with slab track and 317s were new, so not a completely daft notion.

But we all know they use laser scanners these days, then let the vegetation grow so a few odd branches still hit the trains.

 

[Efini92]

wait but they were being tested north of preston surely there is a chance they might get signed by the guys up at preston

That’s GBRF doing the testing.
As it stands only Euston, Wolves, Liverpool, Holyhead and Crewe (if/when it opens) are going to be learning them.

 

[Some guy]

That’s GBRF doing the testing.
As it stands only Euston, Wolves, Liverpool, Holyhead and Crewe (if/when it opens) are going to be learning them.

Train managers at Preston will sign them as Crewe is only getting a drivers depot and that depot isn’t open until December 2024

 

[AJDesiro]

If no drivers further up north will sign them, what will this mean for future diversions on diesel only lines north of Cheshire?

 

[Efini92]

Train managers at Preston will sign them as Crewe is only getting a drivers depot and that depot isn’t open until December 2024

Sorry I was only referring to drivers.
I’d take that December 2024 with a pinch of salt.

 

[Watershed]

If no drivers further up north will sign them, what will this mean for future diversions on diesel only lines north of Cheshire?

I presume you're alluding to diversions via the G&SW. These will unfortunately be impossible in future. They're already difficult enough as things stand, with only a small Voyager fleet and 2 sets already off-lease - hence why the G&SW services over upcoming weekends and during the 16 day blockade at Carstairs consist largely of Carlisle shuttles.

 

[Efini92]

If no drivers further up north will sign them, what will this mean for future diversions on diesel only lines north of Cheshire?

It’ll go the same way as the 57 hauled pendos.

 

[AJDesiro]

I presume you're alluding to diversions via the G&SW. These will unfortunately be impossible in future. They're already difficult enough as things stand, with only a small Voyager fleet and 2 sets already off-lease - hence why the G&SW services over upcoming weekends and during the 16 day blockade at Carstairs consist largely of Carlisle shuttles.

It’ll go the same way as the 57 hauled pendos.

That’s a shame, it’s things like this that make me wonder why they didn’t just order 27 805s (same number of carriages as the whole AWC 80X order), besides any issues such as depot space, as one of the great things about the formerly 20-strong voyager fleet was its diversion capability - a godsend when the Birmingham loop is shut, I’d much rather go via coleshill to Birmingham than a bus!

 

[Efini92]

That’s a shame, it’s things like this that make me wonder why they didn’t just order 27 805s (same number of carriages as the whole AWC 80X order), besides any issues such as depot space, as one of the great things about the formerly 20-strong voyager fleet was its diversion capability - a godsend when the Birmingham loop is shut, I’d much rather go via coleshill to Birmingham than a bus!

Agreed. Sadly the bean counters decide it costs too much to retain diversionary routes. Putting a bus on is the cheaper option.

 

[JonathanH]

Agreed. Sadly the bean counters decide it costs too much to retain diversionary routes. Putting a bus on is the cheaper option.

Diverting via Stafford is also an option.

 

[YourMum666]

How many 805s/7s are on test as of now

 

[800001]

How many 805s/7s are on test as of now

805001 is at Old Dalby, 805003 is at Oxley.

805002 and 807002 are both undergoing static testing at Newton Aycliffe.